There's a better way to beat the ebook pirates

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by Steven Lyle Jordan

I was talking about getting paid for my work. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be a topic anyone else is interested in, as they keep changing the subject back to piracy.

I see piracy as an opportunity rather than a threat. And I'm very much a "not only is the glass half empty but it will probably crash to the floor" type of person by nature.

Mrs ploppy keeps saying "How are you going to make any money if you just give them away?"

I point at the printouts stuck to the wall above my computer -- an email from someone who probably hasn't read a book since leaving school, the 70p I made from a Paypal donation, and someone's blog entry that mentions me.

"I'll make money from them, and people like them as soon as they notice me."

But if not, no big deal.

[Tome Keeper]

Originally Posted by Xenophon

The final quote from stonetools is, once again, overly certain of the applicability of the Amazon licensing terms. He's absolutely correct, however, that the author's copyright applies without regard to license-vs.-sale issues. He's wrong, however, that the question of license vs. sale is a red herring -- it's a key part of the legal questions regarding what an individual user can legally do about the DRM that may or may not be present on an ebook that they have legally acquired.

I remind stonetools yet again, that the DMCA is self-contradictory on the subject of fair-use rights and DRM. Competent legal authorities most definitely disagree, and no court has yet ruled. Stripping DRM (from legally acquired content, for personal use only) may be entirely legal, or may be against the law. Nobody knows! And nobody will know, until the legal system clarifies it for us. Period.

I know you are referring to the US but just to remind people that in the UK the law is pretty clear, breaking DRM even for personal back-up is illegal (except on software). Although I don't think this law has been tested in court. That's my understanding anyway.

[NVash]

I cant understand why DRM exists. All it does is serve to inconvenience people and even hinder sales in some respects.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by intheendofdays

I know you are referring to the US but just to remind people that in the UK the law is pretty clear, breaking DRM even for personal back-up is illegal (except on software). Although I don't think this law has been tested in court. That's my understanding anyway.

I don't think it's legal for software either. Certainly not games software, but I don't know what other type would have DRM anyway.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

I don't think it's legal for software either. Certainly not games software, but I don't know what other type would have DRM anyway.

Expensive business software. Some use hardware dongles.

EDIT: Also operating systems, like Windows, which often require activation.
I'm sure there's still plenty more.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

.

I strongly, strongly, recommend you spend $5 at Baen books, for a e-book copy of Fred Pohl's memiours, The Future the Way It Was and read it. You may find his missive close to home. (And it was written in the "good old days").

Ordered. Thanks!

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by stonetools

... I get the impression from you that publishers are 100 per cent focused on piracy and do little marketing ...

You are mistaken; had you taken the trouble to actually read my posts you would have realised.

Originally Posted by stonetools

... I get the impression from you that publishers are 100 per cent focused on piracy and do little marketing. I think its precisely the reverse ...

Oh, really? So, publishers are 100 percent focused on marketing, therefore zero percent on piracy, consequently presumably DRM and geo-restrictions are dreamt up by authors, or is it the fairies?

Originally Posted by stonetools

... Every single day, I get emails from Amazon, B&N, Borders, and Kobo touting some promotion or sale (Maybe you need to sign up for the newsletters?) THere is an entire forum here dedicated to keeping track of various freebies and ebook promos offered by publishers and booksellers.
...

Had you read my post (the one you quoted!) and you'd have seen that I already receive e-mails from at least one publisher, no I don't need more junk mail, and yes I was already aware of the forum dedicated to freebies and promos - which by the way mostly seems to be aimed at Kindle owners - thank you.

Originally Posted by stonetools

... Google " author's book tours"-who do you think pays for those-pirate sites? The plain fact is that pirate sites don't pay for anything and don't help the authors and publishers. They are to the publishing industry as leeches and tapeworms are to a healthy human being. Just as we would not ignore leeches and tapeworms if we had them, so too the publishers cannot ignore pirates, as to you seem to advocate . On the contrary, the publishers have the right, duty, and contractual obligation to preserve, protect and defend the IP rights of the authors they represent. That means taking action against pirates, in addition to marketing.

Had you bothered to read my posts you'd know that I have not suggested publishers ignore pirates. Presumably you just don't get it, or you're playing games, either way I can't be bothered to repeat what I've already written. This is just too tedious and I'm bored by it.

I'm not at all persuaded by your arguments, so the publisher(s) that you represent - if that's the case - will just have to continue doing without my business. When I buy e-books, it'll be from sources such as BeWrite Books, O'Reilly Books, Baen Books, Smashwords, and so on.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by NVash

Truthfully I dont think the piracy is anywhere near as big as youre trying to make it...

Originally Posted by MrsJoseph

I fully agree that you should be able to earn something for the work you do (if people are willing to buy it)...

I did mention I was leaving this thread (by request, I might add)?

[NVash]

Originally Posted by Steven Lyle Jordan

I did mention I was leaving this thread (by request, I might add)?

Ill admit, I skipped over ten pages that happened overnight and really dont feel like backtracking. Why are you leaving this thread (by request) again?

[jkeene]

Originally Posted by ApK

...
You could try an experiment. Start selling copies of your bought-and-purchased personal ebook property on-line and make some money.
Maybe you'll get sued, and then maybe a judge can explain to you more clearly than us here if you are right or wrong in your understanding.
...

I think your proposed test is not a pure test of a single hypothesis. And I see someone has posted some EBay listings, as though your experiment has already been anticipated. Thus leaving me more money to spend on books, not lawyers.

That might work its way into a signature line. Buy books not lawyers!

[ApK]

Originally Posted by jkeene

I think your proposed test is not a pure test of a single hypothesis. And I see someone has posted some EBay listings, as though your experiment has already been anticipated. Thus leaving me more money to spend on books, not lawyers.

A shame. Even if they get sued and go to court, I doubt those sellers will report back to us with the results.
And they're in the UK. I'd have liked to have some US case law on it.

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by stonetools

Er, except that they didn't legally BUY the BOOK: they bought a license to access the efile, which remains on the bookstore's servers ...

Cue drum roll

In other words, when someone 'buys' an e-book with DRM, what they are paying for is the privilege of using it - they don't own it and their use of it is severely restricted.

[Quexos]

I simply would never buy DRM protected stuff if I lived in a country with such blatant disregards for personal freedoms. Having to pay for a product that is a threat to your personal freedom is beyond me.
Tututuututututu 1984 ...

Originally Posted by intheendofdays

I know you are referring to the US but just to remind people that in the UK the law is pretty clear, breaking DRM even for personal back-up is illegal (except on software). Although I don't think this law has been tested in court. That's my understanding anyway.

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

Buy a gun (or steal one if you can't afford it) and use it to rob a bank. Apparently doing that is no worse than downloading an ebook without the writer's permission. And under Stonetools' new world order you would get a shorter prison sentence if you got caught.

Karma to you :~)

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by Steven Lyle Jordan

I was talking about getting paid for my work. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be a topic anyone else is interested in, as they keep changing the subject back to piracy.

Oh, yeah... the thread topic...

Oh, well. I guess I'll just do a high-kick-off right here.

Go and start a thread like this one. Remember to charge a dollar for each post ... I forgot :~)