Who else is ready for a Libra 3 (grayscale)?

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Sirtel

I love the asymmetrical form factor with one wide edge. For me, it's much easier to hold than the symmetrical one.

I had no problem at all holding my Aura H2O with the symmetrical smaller bezel. I prefer that form factor.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Lavender

True, but I still wonder if Apple will sell user replaceable battery devices in the USA. I personally hope they do, but I could see them spitefully selling a glued-in battery model here, and an EU regulation model there.

Then all you do is order the EU model and not the US model.

[DNSB]

Considering some the differences in frequency bands between North American and European markets, that is likely to be a bad idea. Unless Apple decided to go with a universal model which would be extra cost.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Considering some the differences in frequency bands between North American and European markets, that is likely to be a bad idea. Unless Apple decided to go with a universal model which would be extra cost.

I have used a US iPhone in Scotland with no noticeable problem.

I do think there would be an outcry if Apple only made an iPhone with a replaceable battery only for the EU. I think the first company to then make a good phone with a replaceable battery outside the EU would outsell the iPhone.

There would be an outcry for any company to only do the replaceable battery in the EU.

[graycyn]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

You charge more frequently and you then have a duff battery sooner. It's better to have a battery that needs less charging so it lasts longer before it needs to be replaced.

I know which I'll choose when it comes to pain/adding damage to my body and replacing a device more often... I can't replace my arms, my tendons. I can't replace my spine. A device replacement is a far simpler matter.

FWIW, I'm not having any particular issues with my Sage battery life 4 years down the road. (Forma is another story.)

[Apollyon202]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Considering some the differences in frequency bands between North American and European markets, that is likely to be a bad idea. Unless Apple decided to go with a universal model which would be extra cost.

I’d guess they’ll come up with something else to make the devices obsolete faster, like not enough RAM, software limitations or whatever. I kinda expect them to find some way to stop people from using the same device for 5-10 years, even if it could easily last that long.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I have used a US iPhone in Scotland with no noticeable problem.

Here's a list of the frequency bands in use in Canada and the United Kingdom.

Please note that while some frequencies overlap, there are many that don't.

Canada
GSM
850 MHz
1900 MHz (PCS)

UMTS
B2 (1900 MHz PCS)
B4 (1700/2100 MHz AWS 1)
B5 (850 MHz)

LTE
B2 (1900 MHz PCS)
B4 (1700/2100 MHz AWS 1)
B5 (850 MHz)LTE
B7 (2600 MHz)LTE
B12 (700 MHz ac)
B13 (700 MHz c)
B17 (700 MHz bc)
B25 (1900 MHz +)
B26 (850 MHz +)
B29 (700 MHz de)
B38 (TD 2600 MHz)
B46 (TD 5900 MHz)
B66 (1700/2100 MHz)
B71 (600 MHz)

5G NR
N1 (2100 MHz)
N41 (2500 MHz)
N66 (1700/2100 MHz)
N71 (600 MHz)
N78 (3500 MHz)

United Kingdom
GSM
900 MHz (E-GSM)
1800 MHz (DCS)

UMTS
B1 (2100 MHz)
B8 (900 MHz GSM)

LTE
B1 (2100 MHz)
B3 (1800 MHz +)
B7 (2600 MHz)
B8 (900 MHz)
B20 (800 MHz DD)
B28 (700 MHz APT)
B32 (1500 MHz L-band)
B38 (TD 2600 MHz)

5G NR
N1 (2100 MHz)
N3 (1800 MHz)
N7 (2600 MHz)
N8 (900 MHz)
N28 (700 MHz)
N77 (3700 MHz)
N78 (3500 MHz)

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Here's a list of the frequency bands in use in Canada and the United Kingdom.

Please note that while some frequencies overlap, there are many that don't.

Canada
GSM
850 MHz
1900 MHz (PCS)

UMTS
B2 (1900 MHz PCS)
B4 (1700/2100 MHz AWS 1)
B5 (850 MHz)

LTE
B2 (1900 MHz PCS)
B4 (1700/2100 MHz AWS 1)
B5 (850 MHz)LTE
B7 (2600 MHz)LTE
B12 (700 MHz ac)
B13 (700 MHz c)
B17 (700 MHz bc)
B25 (1900 MHz +)
B26 (850 MHz +)
B29 (700 MHz de)
B38 (TD 2600 MHz)
B46 (TD 5900 MHz)
B66 (1700/2100 MHz)
B71 (600 MHz)

5G NR
N1 (2100 MHz)
N41 (2500 MHz)
N66 (1700/2100 MHz)
N71 (600 MHz)
N78 (3500 MHz)

United Kingdom
GSM
900 MHz (E-GSM)
1800 MHz (DCS)

UMTS
B1 (2100 MHz)
B8 (900 MHz GSM)

LTE
B1 (2100 MHz)
B3 (1800 MHz +)
B7 (2600 MHz)
B8 (900 MHz)
B20 (800 MHz DD)
B28 (700 MHz APT)
B32 (1500 MHz L-band)
B38 (TD 2600 MHz)

5G NR
N1 (2100 MHz)
N3 (1800 MHz)
N7 (2600 MHz)
N8 (900 MHz)
N28 (700 MHz)
N77 (3700 MHz)
N78 (3500 MHz)

Modern iPhones are the same worldwide for the most part. Really just the esim/physical sim split. They all support the same frequencies and obscure regional features like FeliCa.

[Quoth]

Nokia was making multi-region/mulitband phones before Apple or Google made any phones. But Apple's first iPhone was CDMA or GSM, thus USA model didn't work elsewhere and Europe model didn't work in USA, though the Europe Nokia models might only have worked on USA non-CDMA operators (there was GSM and 3G in USA too in 2007)

Historically CDMA in USA was the awkward one as it didn't use a SIM (not even like modern Apple promoted eSIM) and was completely different. It's gone. Also USA GSM and Europe GSM used different bands in 2007.

There is now considerable overlap even without a phone having multiple country specific bands as the old Nokia phones had. When the Apple iPhone first arrived in Europe it had GSM (900 & 1800 MHz back then, much has migrated to 3G/UMTS or 4G) but no 3G (then 2100 MHz only).
Some countries in Europe have replaced 3G/UMTS with 4G, but kept some 900 MHz GSM (smart meters, but works on phones). The 1800 went from GSM -> 3G -> 4G.

The 5G is mostly irrelevant except in stadiums, racecourses etc.

So since demise of CDMA (USA 2G) and much GSM (Europe 2G) and most 3G, most phones work worldwide. or the same model is used worldwide, but enabled feature change per operator

The available WiFi channels will vary with what region you set it to.

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Nokia was making multi-region/mulitband phones before Apple or Google made any phones. But Apple's first iPhone was CDMA or GSM, thus USA model didn't work elsewhere and Europe model didn't work in USA, though the Europe Nokia models might only have worked on USA non-CDMA operators (there was GSM and 3G in USA too in 2007)

Historically CDMA in USA was the awkward one as it didn't use a SIM (not even like modern Apple promoted eSIM) and was completely different. It's gone. Also USA GSM and Europe GSM used different bands in 2007.

There is now considerable overlap even without a phone having multiple country specific bands as the old Nokia phones had. When the Apple iPhone first arrived in Europe it had GSM (900 & 1800 MHz back then, much has migrated to 3G/UMTS or 4G) but no 3G (then 2100 MHz only).
Some countries in Europe have replaced 3G/UMTS with 4G, but kept some 900 MHz GSM (smart meters, but works on phones). The 1800 went from GSM -> 3G -> 4G.

The 5G is mostly irrelevant except in stadiums, racecourses etc.

So since demise of CDMA (USA 2G) and much GSM (Europe 2G) and most 3G, most phones work worldwide. or the same model is used worldwide, but enabled feature change per operator

The available WiFi channels will vary with what region you set it to.

There wasn't a CDMA iPhone until the iPhone 4. iPhone was exclusive to AT&T in the U.S for a few years which used GSM.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Nokia was making multi-region/mulitband phones before Apple or Google made any phones. But Apple's first iPhone was CDMA or GSM, thus USA model didn't work elsewhere and Europe model didn't work in USA, though the Europe Nokia models might only have worked on USA non-CDMA operators (there was GSM and 3G in USA too in 2007)

The original iPhone was GSM only, it wasn't until Apple started supplying iPhones through Verizon/Sprint/etc. that used CDMA, that the CDMA models were available.

Originally Posted by Quoth

There is now considerable overlap even without a phone having multiple country specific bands as the old Nokia phones had. When the Apple iPhone first arrived in Europe it had GSM (900 & 1800 MHz back then, much has migrated to 3G/UMTS or 4G) but no 3G (then 2100 MHz only).
Some countries in Europe have replaced 3G/UMTS with 4G, but kept some 900 MHz GSM (smart meters, but works on phones). The 1800 went from GSM -> 3G -> 4G.

The 5G is mostly irrelevant except in stadiums, racecourses etc.

So since demise of CDMA (USA 2G) and much GSM (Europe 2G) and most 3G, most phones work worldwide. or the same model is used worldwide, but enabled feature change per operator

The available WiFi channels will vary with what region you set it to.

For what it may be worth, most cellphone manufacturers seem to keep the costs down by using chipsets which match the bands in use in the destination country. There have been phones with chipsets that will work over multiple national sets of bands but at least for the one manufacturer whose product line I was somewhat familiar with, the "universal" phone was more expensive which was blamed on the chipset being more expensive.

As for 5G being only relevant at racecourses, stadiums, etc.? Sitting at home and turning off the WiFi, my phone labels the connection as 5G+ (3500MHz band, 5G SA). If I felt like steaming HD+ video over cellular, that would, in theory, allow me a faster and more reliable connection with fewer congestion issue. Of course, it would also eat into my data cap like it was a freebie.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DNSB

The original iPhone was GSM only, it wasn't until Apple started supplying iPhones through Verizon/Sprint/etc. that used CDMA, that the CDMA models were available.

Yes, but USA GSM and Europe GSM used different bands. I had assumed the lack of compatibility was CDMA vs GSM, so it was bands. My mistake.
Also 1st model had no copy/paste.

Nokia though had lost the plot in about 2004, with killing S80 and political in fighting. So offloading the phone division was inevitable. The period 2006 to 2009 was a crazy time with Nokia doing everything wrong, Intel & Motorola backing WiMax for 4G (LTE won and WiMax is dead). Qualcom bought Flarion for the 4G patents and killed it.

Then the 2008 crash and by 2009 our R&D was shuttered completely.

[Quoth]

The Phone companies wanted 5G for cafes, hotels, open plan offices etc, instead of WiFi. Coverage due to the bands used is garbage.
Hence the main viable use case is large crowds in open spaces that want the phone data. It doesn't matter WHAT "G" you use. What counts is channel width. The bands below 3 GHz use 5, 10 or 20 MHz channels per sector. So it's worse than WiFi in same room. The bands with big channels for huge capacity / speed are almost line of sight.