Amazon kicking Apple Tv, Chromecast out of store - Page 5

DuckieTigger · 10-30-2015, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoHunt

It was rumored that hundreds of thousands of these devices were sold on Amazon, so this may be a goldmine for ebay sellers of these banned items. I bought my Chromecast 2 on ebay ...

It may be a goldmine on ebay, but I doubt it pleases Google and Apple much. Losing Amazon as a store has to be a huge hit in the wallet - I doubt ebay (re)sellers are going to be able to pick up the slack. More dangerous (for Google and Apple) is their marketing they are paying for (can't be cheap) leads to Amazon selling no-name and Amazon devices. Lost marketshare for Google and Apple while Amazon is now a great source to buy alternatives for cheap.

On the flip side - if Apple and Google give in to the pressure (doubt it), then they will make their devices Prime compatible - and this on Amazon's terms not theirs. Win win for Amazon either way.

GERGE · 10-30-2015, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leebase

This should be fun. Amazon is not selling any streaming device that does not support Amazon Prime Video. I think that's fair.

No. That is the textbook definition of unfair competition. I don't know about USA but this would never fly in Europe. They can do it, but they will be greatly fined for it and they will start selling other devices after that.

Amazon is different from Apple Store. Apple Store only sells their pruducts but Amazon is a general store. And one that has the biggest share.

leebase · 10-30-2015, 11:49 PM

Amazon is a whatever they want to be store. There is no reason they MUST sell any product, let alone a competitor's product. Just like Apple didn't HAVE to allow the Kindle and Kobo apps on its devices.

Amazon isn't even close to being a monopoly in the retail space. Perhaps being enough in the ebook space to warrant government attention

Cinisajoy · 10-31-2015, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leebase

Amazon is a whatever they want to be store. There is no reason they MUST sell any product, let alone a competitor's product. Just like Apple didn't HAVE to allow the Kindle and Kobo apps on its devices.

Amazon isn't even close to being a monopoly in the retail space. Perhaps being enough in the ebook space to warrant government attention

That would be like Albertsons having to sell Great Value products or Walmart having to sell Everyday Essential products. No, those are STORE brands.

GERGE · 10-31-2015, 02:03 AM

Consider that Walmart is selling rice, called Walmart Rice. Wallmart suddenly stops selling all other rice brands because they have their own brand of rice now. Would that be alright?

I studied competition extensively, while I admit that I know next to nothing about USA law, according to EU and the rest of the world following the continental law system, this is unfair competition. That store is Amazon and product is a streaming device makes no difference.

Amazon doesn't need to be a monopoly, it just needs to be big enough to effect the market.

Apache · 10-31-2015, 07:13 AM

I own a retail store and no person, or government will ever tell me who's merchandise I can or can not sell.
Apache

GERGE · 10-31-2015, 07:23 AM

If you have a small shop on the corner of a street, then yes, you can sell whatever you want; but the moment you start to have an effect on the market, things change. This is the law.

DuckieTigger · 10-31-2015, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

If you have a small shop on the corner of a street, then yes, you can sell whatever you want; but the moment you start to have an effect on the market, things change. This is the law.

Either quote the law, or stop assuming.

David Munch · 10-31-2015, 10:25 AM

"The moment you affect the market" is one of the most vague things I have ever heard...

ApK · 10-31-2015, 10:27 AM

Better yet, take the more abstract legal theories to the p&r forum.

Alpha o · 10-31-2015, 10:39 AM

deleted

RodMyers · 10-31-2015, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

Either quote the law, or stop assuming.

Typical straw man argument.

He can't quote any law

Cinisajoy · 10-31-2015, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

If you have a small shop on the corner of a street, then yes, you can sell whatever you want; but the moment you start to have an effect on the market, things change. This is the law.

Huh?
What market are you talking about?
Just because Amazon sells more than Apache, that doesn't mean that they have to sell everything.
They are just a retailer. Nothing more.
Plus and here is the big one. Apple and Google could tell Amazon no you can't sell our products or even one of their products.
See I don't know if Amazon pulled the product or Apple and Google quit distributing it to Amazon.

Show me actually proof from the companies what was really said.
The actual contracts.

Walmart sells other rices but only rices they choose to sell.
They don't sell other stores rices.

Now I might halfway agree with your "they should sell theory" if the other two didn't have their own stores.

GERGE · 10-31-2015, 11:26 AM

Have you ever heard something called antitrust laws?

When a company has a monopoly and uses that to stifle competition, it breaches antitrust laws. Amazon's market share is the greatest among online retailers, but there are many arguments for and against whether or not it is a monopoly. And denying to sell competitor's devices are stifling competition for a retail store. We are not talking about an Amazon Store that only sells Amazon pruducts but a retail store with market dominancy.

Also monopoly here refers to a concept, a retail store with %50 percent market share may well count as a monopoly for the purposes of this law.

I don't care enough to research USA law to offer example cases here, but if you think I am wrong, then you think I am wrong. I don't care either way.

Cinisajoy · 10-31-2015, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

Have you ever heard something called antitrust laws?

When a company has a monopoly and uses that to stifle competition, it breaches antitrust laws. Amazon's market share is the greatest among online retailers, but there are many arguments for and against whether or not it is a monopoly. And denying to sell competitor's devices are stifling competition for a retail store. We are not talking about an Amazon Store that only sells Amazon pruducts but a retail store with market dominancy.

Also monopoly here refers to a concept, a retail store with %50 percent market share may well count as a monopoly for the purposes of this law.

I don't care enough to research USA law to offer example cases here, but if you think I am wrong, than you think I am wrong. I don't care either way. But I am sure that this will go to court.

Monopoly means only one company.
Amazon is not the only retailer.
Just because half a population shops there only means they have good prices.
Not only that but except for some streaming videos with Prime, is there anything Amazon sells that I cannot buy elsewhere?
Antitrust only comes into play if I have to buy a commodity at one place.
The key word being commodity.
If I could only buy grain at Amazon, that would fall under antitrust.
What is Walmart's market share?

Now if you want to research antitrust and very bad business practices, look up Thurber, TX.

10-31-2015, 10:39 AM	#71
Alpha o Addict Posts: 282 Karma: 2603524 Join Date: Jan 2015 Device: Onyx Boox Darwin, inkBOOK Obsidian	deleted Last edited by Alpha o; 10-31-2015 at 10:45 AM.

10-31-2015, 11:26 AM	#74
GERGE Guru Posts: 733 Karma: 5797160 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Istanbul Device: Kobo Libra	Have you ever heard something called antitrust laws? When a company has a monopoly and uses that to stifle competition, it breaches antitrust laws. Amazon's market share is the greatest among online retailers, but there are many arguments for and against whether or not it is a monopoly. And denying to sell competitor's devices are stifling competition for a retail store. We are not talking about an Amazon Store that only sells Amazon pruducts but a retail store with market dominancy. Also monopoly here refers to a concept, a retail store with %50 percent market share may well count as a monopoly for the purposes of this law. I don't care enough to research USA law to offer example cases here, but if you think I am wrong, then you think I am wrong. I don't care either way. Last edited by GERGE; 10-31-2015 at 11:28 AM.

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10-30-2015, 11:49 PM	#63
leebase Karma Kameleon Posts: 2,976 Karma: 26738313 Join Date: Aug 2009 Device: iPad Mini, iPhone X, Kindle Fire Tab HD 8, Walmart Onn	Amazon is a whatever they want to be store. There is no reason they MUST sell any product, let alone a competitor's product. Just like Apple didn't HAVE to allow the Kindle and Kobo apps on its devices. Amazon isn't even close to being a monopoly in the retail space. Perhaps being enough in the ebook space to warrant government attention

10-31-2015, 02:03 AM	#65
GERGE Guru Posts: 733 Karma: 5797160 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Istanbul Device: Kobo Libra	Consider that Walmart is selling rice, called Walmart Rice. Wallmart suddenly stops selling all other rice brands because they have their own brand of rice now. Would that be alright? I studied competition extensively, while I admit that I know next to nothing about USA law, according to EU and the rest of the world following the continental law system, this is unfair competition. That store is Amazon and product is a streaming device makes no difference. Amazon doesn't need to be a monopoly, it just needs to be big enough to effect the market.

10-31-2015, 07:13 AM	#66
Apache Readaholic Posts: 5,306 Karma: 90981752 Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: South Georgia Device: Surface Pro 6 / Galaxy Tab A 8"	I own a retail store and no person, or government will ever tell me who's merchandise I can or can not sell. Apache

10-31-2015, 07:23 AM	#67
GERGE Guru Posts: 733 Karma: 5797160 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Istanbul Device: Kobo Libra	If you have a small shop on the corner of a street, then yes, you can sell whatever you want; but the moment you start to have an effect on the market, things change. This is the law.

10-31-2015, 10:25 AM	#69
David Munch Scholar Posts: 1,012 Karma: 3999312 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Denmark Device: Kobo Libra H2O + iPad Air 4	"The moment you affect the market" is one of the most vague things I have ever heard...

10-31-2015, 10:27 AM	#70
ApK Award-Winning Participant Posts: 7,402 Karma: 69116640 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NJ, USA Device: Kindle	Better yet, take the more abstract legal theories to the p&r forum.