Combination of physical payment and distribution via email?

limone · 04-12-2012, 07:38 PM

Hello everybody.
I've got a question about how to distribute e-books in a country where people don't have widespread access to credit cards, etc. Is there any possibility that buyers pay physically in a (university) shop for a small fee (2 USD) and receive their e-book copy per e-mail? If this is possible, can the e-books distributed through e-mail maintain their protection?

Thank you so much for any help!

Greets,
Limone

taustin · 04-13-2012, 10:32 AM

I suspect the "right answer" there is not to sell ebooks through the university shop, but rather, sell a physical product that has a download key for a web site.

As for protecting ebooks, that'd be no different than any other ebook distribution system, which is to say, there isn't a DRM scheme out there that hasn't been broken thoroughly enough that pretty much anybody can find a way to do if they're determined enough.

limone · 04-13-2012, 12:10 PM

Thank you for your answer. Yes, this could work. The download key could even be sent by e-mail to the purchaser.

I'm not so much worried about breaking DRM. As you say, if they want to, they can break it. I just want to prevent that students can e-mail the downloaded file to their friends, without breaking DRM. How could I prevent in the selling scheme you proposed that a downloaded file would spread fast among the tight-knitted student networks? Can the downloaded files still be "embedded, and therefore somewhat protected from easy copying, in the personal Kindle software or the Adobe Digital Editions software?

Bit of our background. We are a group of students in Ecuador who want to publish the best student thesis and a review journal. The problem is that we lack the financial means to print them and the students don't have enough money to buy printed products. The solution could be an electronic version to bring the price down (say 5 USD per thesis). Still, the publisher group depends on a small income, which we run the risk of losing if students just could sent themselves the files someone bought.

Thank you so much for any input!

Limone

susan_cassidy · 04-13-2012, 12:35 PM

You can't use the Kindle DRM or the Adobe DRM without going through the right channels (e.g. Amazon or Adobe, which charges high fees).

You'd have to use some scheme of your own, which would keep people from wanting to buy it. Watermarking is probably your best bet. If you did have DRM, and it was broken, nothing would keep students from emailing copies with DRM removed.

Steven Lyle Jordan · 04-13-2012, 12:38 PM

No one has found a way to prevent someone from downloading an ebook, and promptly resending copies to others. Having the book password-protected can keep others from opening it, but the original buyer can resend their passwords too.

About the only way it would work would be if the password was personal enough that the original buyer did not want to share it (companies often use credit card or social security numbers, for that reason).

limone · 04-13-2012, 01:03 PM

That helps a lot for the understanding. I see it's more complicated than I thought. Thanks for all the answers!

Limone

taustin · 04-13-2012, 01:57 PM

Yeah, unfortunately, there really isn't a good way to do what you want. The only way to even try would be some kind of DRM, and that costs quite a bit of money to get licensed for. Even the "social DRM" like using a credit card number as a password won't work if your customers don't have a credit card. Even if you wrote your own DRM package (which is a bad idea if you're not a season pro at such things), you'd have the expense of running your own internet server to authenticate against.

You might google on "open source drm" to see if there's anything out there that you can make work.

limone · 04-13-2012, 02:06 PM

This is great information. I'll look into the "social DRM" and open standards in the next days. Thanks again for all the hints. Especially for someone who is new to the whole e-book distribution thing your answers have been very helpful.

Limone

NightGeometry · 04-14-2012, 07:58 AM

Could you not do something like put the papers up at Amazon in Kindle format (and find a similar ePub stockist), and in the book store on Campus sell an Amazon / <other> gift card for the correct amount? Then a student could go and download the paper. Added benefit (possibly) - if it looks interesting anyone else in the world could buy it too. Downside - you lose 30% to Amazon - I assume other retailers charge similar. (I've no idea if you need a credit card to open an Amazon account, to be honest, or if it can be done just with a gift certificate - I'm pretty sure for Apple you can just use a gift certificate, for others apart from these two - also no idea).

It may be worth checking if any of the major retailers of ebooks offer a special service for academia, taking a reduced cut.

Steven Lake · 04-14-2012, 09:03 AM

I found a great solution to this problem a while back. The easiest way to do it is to sell your ebook on a CDrom. Yeah, I kid you not. In places where they have ebooks, but not access to credit cards (actually this came up as an answer for how to sell ebooks at book shows and conventions) just sell the ebooks on cdrom. The neat thing about this is you can sell quite a few different combinations that way. Plus, given how little space an ebook takes up, you could include lots of bonus material, including an author read audiobook, posters, other pictures, a video greeting, and tons of other interactive content. It would be a hugely interactive disk and have lots of value added content. It's actually quite a fun way to reach people who use ebooks, but either don't have internet, or they don't have a way to pay by credit card.

emellaich · 04-14-2012, 08:30 PM

For what its worth, I'd offer some new business advice.

As you build the list of what you should ideally do, the set of items will become huge. What happens if you worry about DRM and payments and distribution and more and find out that no one wants the product in the way that you packaged it?

I'd suggest you start small and build your business. As you begin to get customers you can 'solve' problems -- if they are real. Take Steven Lake's advice and sell a CD of stuff with no DRM. If people are interested, you can then go to the next step if you find DRM is a problem.

Steven Lake · 04-14-2012, 09:31 PM

limone: emellaich is right on this one. Case in point:

I've actually found that you sell more, and have happier customers if you DON'T use any DRM at all. DRM only annoys and punishes the honest. It does nothing to stop the dishonest. If you are really that scared of someone stealing your stuff, you've got your eyes on the WRONG THING. Writing and publishing IS NOT nor ever should be about the money. It's about writing, doing what you love and sharing it with others either for free, or for purchase.

If you're in it for the money you're doing it for all the wrong reasons and it'll blow up in your face and be an epic failure for you. On top of that, you're likely really new to all this if you're asking questions like this, so here's my advice. It's not piracy, or theft, or anything like that which is the bane or curse of the writer. It's OBSCURITY. Yes, it's plain old obscurity, with people not knowing who you are. So here's my advice. Forget about the money, forget about the DRM, and forget about piracy. Focus on getting readers, making them happy, build a fan base, build readership, give value added extra content with your books, etc.

Once you get yourself a sizable fan base, THEN consider changing your business model to something else. But for now you want one that's as open and friendly to the end user as possible. IF that means free at the beginning, then so be it. That's actually how I built my initial fan base. I used to write short stories and give them away on my tech site for all the read and enjoy. Then when I moved to novels I did the same, giving away one chapter at a time. Now my fans are dedicated enough that when I release a book they're more than willing to pay whatever price I ask, and some even send me money without asking anything in return. Yes, I kid you not, they actually send me money out of the clear blue to "support the artist" as they say. That's the thing you should aspire to. It sure beats the more restrictive, controlling business model you're planning.

Well, that's my 2c. I hope this healthy bit of advice from a seasoned author helps.

PS: Since you're so new to book publishing (at least that's what I'm taking from your post), I would suggest you also read my guide to book signings and events. Even if you only do ebooks and don't do a mixture like I do (I still do print as I have a number of fans who demand it, thus I carry it) it'll still be handy as even in the digital ebook age there is still a place for doing book signings and events for authors.

Check my website for details.

04-12-2012, 07:38 PM	#1
limone Junior Member Posts: 4 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2012 Device: iPad2	Combination of physical payment and distribution via email? Hello everybody. I've got a question about how to distribute e-books in a country where people don't have widespread access to credit cards, etc. Is there any possibility that buyers pay physically in a (university) shop for a small fee (2 USD) and receive their e-book copy per e-mail? If this is possible, can the e-books distributed through e-mail maintain their protection? Thank you so much for any help! Greets, Limone

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04-13-2012, 10:32 AM	#2
taustin Wizard Posts: 1,358 Karma: 5766642 Join Date: Aug 2010 Device: Nook	I suspect the "right answer" there is not to sell ebooks through the university shop, but rather, sell a physical product that has a download key for a web site. As for protecting ebooks, that'd be no different than any other ebook distribution system, which is to say, there isn't a DRM scheme out there that hasn't been broken thoroughly enough that pretty much anybody can find a way to do if they're determined enough.

04-13-2012, 12:10 PM	#3
limone Junior Member Posts: 4 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2012 Device: iPad2	Thank you for your answer. Yes, this could work. The download key could even be sent by e-mail to the purchaser. I'm not so much worried about breaking DRM. As you say, if they want to, they can break it. I just want to prevent that students can e-mail the downloaded file to their friends, without breaking DRM. How could I prevent in the selling scheme you proposed that a downloaded file would spread fast among the tight-knitted student networks? Can the downloaded files still be "embedded, and therefore somewhat protected from easy copying, in the personal Kindle software or the Adobe Digital Editions software? Bit of our background. We are a group of students in Ecuador who want to publish the best student thesis and a review journal. The problem is that we lack the financial means to print them and the students don't have enough money to buy printed products. The solution could be an electronic version to bring the price down (say 5 USD per thesis). Still, the publisher group depends on a small income, which we run the risk of losing if students just could sent themselves the files someone bought. Thank you so much for any input! Limone

04-13-2012, 12:35 PM	#4
susan_cassidy Wizard Posts: 2,251 Karma: 3720310 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: USA Device: Kindle, iPad (not used much for reading)	You can't use the Kindle DRM or the Adobe DRM without going through the right channels (e.g. Amazon or Adobe, which charges high fees). You'd have to use some scheme of your own, which would keep people from wanting to buy it. Watermarking is probably your best bet. If you did have DRM, and it was broken, nothing would keep students from emailing copies with DRM removed.

04-13-2012, 12:38 PM	#5
Steven Lyle Jordan Grand Sorcerer Posts: 8,478 Karma: 5171130 Join Date: Jan 2006 Device: none	No one has found a way to prevent someone from downloading an ebook, and promptly resending copies to others. Having the book password-protected can keep others from opening it, but the original buyer can resend their passwords too. About the only way it would work would be if the password was personal enough that the original buyer did not want to share it (companies often use credit card or social security numbers, for that reason).

04-13-2012, 01:03 PM	#6
limone Junior Member Posts: 4 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2012 Device: iPad2	That helps a lot for the understanding. I see it's more complicated than I thought. Thanks for all the answers! Limone

04-13-2012, 01:57 PM	#7
taustin Wizard Posts: 1,358 Karma: 5766642 Join Date: Aug 2010 Device: Nook	Yeah, unfortunately, there really isn't a good way to do what you want. The only way to even try would be some kind of DRM, and that costs quite a bit of money to get licensed for. Even the "social DRM" like using a credit card number as a password won't work if your customers don't have a credit card. Even if you wrote your own DRM package (which is a bad idea if you're not a season pro at such things), you'd have the expense of running your own internet server to authenticate against. You might google on "open source drm" to see if there's anything out there that you can make work.

04-13-2012, 02:06 PM	#8
limone Junior Member Posts: 4 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2012 Device: iPad2	This is great information. I'll look into the "social DRM" and open standards in the next days. Thanks again for all the hints. Especially for someone who is new to the whole e-book distribution thing your answers have been very helpful. Limone

04-14-2012, 07:58 AM	#9
NightGeometry Zealot Posts: 139 Karma: 1057240 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Brighton, England Device: Sony PRS-T1, Kindle 3G, Kindle DX	Could you not do something like put the papers up at Amazon in Kindle format (and find a similar ePub stockist), and in the book store on Campus sell an Amazon / <other> gift card for the correct amount? Then a student could go and download the paper. Added benefit (possibly) - if it looks interesting anyone else in the world could buy it too. Downside - you lose 30% to Amazon - I assume other retailers charge similar. (I've no idea if you need a credit card to open an Amazon account, to be honest, or if it can be done just with a gift certificate - I'm pretty sure for Apple you can just use a gift certificate, for others apart from these two - also no idea). It may be worth checking if any of the major retailers of ebooks offer a special service for academia, taking a reduced cut.

04-14-2012, 09:03 AM	#10
Steven Lake Sci-Fi Author Posts: 1,158 Karma: 14743509 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Michigan Device: PC (Calibre)	I found a great solution to this problem a while back. The easiest way to do it is to sell your ebook on a CDrom. Yeah, I kid you not. In places where they have ebooks, but not access to credit cards (actually this came up as an answer for how to sell ebooks at book shows and conventions) just sell the ebooks on cdrom. The neat thing about this is you can sell quite a few different combinations that way. Plus, given how little space an ebook takes up, you could include lots of bonus material, including an author read audiobook, posters, other pictures, a video greeting, and tons of other interactive content. It would be a hugely interactive disk and have lots of value added content. It's actually quite a fun way to reach people who use ebooks, but either don't have internet, or they don't have a way to pay by credit card.

04-14-2012, 08:30 PM	#11
emellaich Wizard Posts: 1,101 Karma: 4388403 Join Date: Oct 2007 Device: Palm>Ebookman>IPaq>Axim>Cybook>Kndl2>IPAD>Kndl3SO>Voyager>Oasis	For what its worth, I'd offer some new business advice. As you build the list of what you should ideally do, the set of items will become huge. What happens if you worry about DRM and payments and distribution and more and find out that no one wants the product in the way that you packaged it? I'd suggest you start small and build your business. As you begin to get customers you can 'solve' problems -- if they are real. Take Steven Lake's advice and sell a CD of stuff with no DRM. If people are interested, you can then go to the next step if you find DRM is a problem.

Advert

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04-14-2012, 09:31 PM	#12
Steven Lake Sci-Fi Author Posts: 1,158 Karma: 14743509 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Michigan Device: PC (Calibre)	limone: emellaich is right on this one. Case in point: I've actually found that you sell more, and have happier customers if you DON'T use any DRM at all. DRM only annoys and punishes the honest. It does nothing to stop the dishonest. If you are really that scared of someone stealing your stuff, you've got your eyes on the WRONG THING. Writing and publishing IS NOT nor ever should be about the money. It's about writing, doing what you love and sharing it with others either for free, or for purchase. If you're in it for the money you're doing it for all the wrong reasons and it'll blow up in your face and be an epic failure for you. On top of that, you're likely really new to all this if you're asking questions like this, so here's my advice. It's not piracy, or theft, or anything like that which is the bane or curse of the writer. It's OBSCURITY. Yes, it's plain old obscurity, with people not knowing who you are. So here's my advice. Forget about the money, forget about the DRM, and forget about piracy. Focus on getting readers, making them happy, build a fan base, build readership, give value added extra content with your books, etc. Once you get yourself a sizable fan base, THEN consider changing your business model to something else. But for now you want one that's as open and friendly to the end user as possible. IF that means free at the beginning, then so be it. That's actually how I built my initial fan base. I used to write short stories and give them away on my tech site for all the read and enjoy. Then when I moved to novels I did the same, giving away one chapter at a time. Now my fans are dedicated enough that when I release a book they're more than willing to pay whatever price I ask, and some even send me money without asking anything in return. Yes, I kid you not, they actually send me money out of the clear blue to "support the artist" as they say. That's the thing you should aspire to. It sure beats the more restrictive, controlling business model you're planning. Well, that's my 2c. I hope this healthy bit of advice from a seasoned author helps. PS: Since you're so new to book publishing (at least that's what I'm taking from your post), I would suggest you also read my guide to book signings and events. Even if you only do ebooks and don't do a mixture like I do (I still do print as I have a number of fans who demand it, thus I carry it) it'll still be handy as even in the digital ebook age there is still a place for doing book signings and events for authors. Check my website for details.