Kaufman links e-book trend to bookburning, Nazis

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

So is that, then, the chief purpose of this website: to swear facistic allegiance to Sciene?

Is this like your little Nuremberg Rally for e-book users to celebrate the electronic Triumph of the Shill?

Mr. Kaufman,

As a regular reader and fan of the Huffington Post, it gives me no pleasure to say that the site is “hit-and miss when it comes to matters of science." Some of the science articles that appear on the Huffington site are excellent. It is unfortunate but true, however, that others leave a great deal to be desired.

That being said; I am neither the spokesperson nor the apologist for what you have chosen to label MOBILE SLEAZE, and I certainly don’t set the agenda for anyone here. In addition, to the best of my knowledge, I’ve never organized a Nuremberg Rally for the purpose of motivating the masses to swear fascistic allegiance to Prometheus.

I haven’t read any of your poetry, although I plan to remedy that in the near future. From your creative and eloquent style of writing here and elsewhere on the web, I imagine that when you aren’t busy accusing people who embrace new technologies of being Nazi sympathizers, your writings are quite enjoyable.

I did read the original article that sparked this whole debate, and quite frankly, I sympathize with much of what you say, and believe you raise some valid concerns, but in the final analysis, I believe the brunt of your anger is largely misdirected.

That neighborhood bookstores are closing their doors all over the country is indeed sad, and probably has been exacerbated by the arrival of e-texts and e-readers, but it certainly didn’t start with them. The elements that have contributed to this perfect storm are many and varied, old and new. The overall decline of reading can most probably be traced to the advent of radio and later TV. The first direct attack on mom and pop bookstores can no doubt be traced to the arrival of the big bookstore chains, which, via their homogenization of stock, most likely had a more negative impact of what books were available than did the advent of television or radio. Then, of course, there’s the economic crash, which only further aggravated the already insecure fiscal position of the average citizen in this country who had been suffering for years under stagnant wages and an economic system that saw no crime in redistributing wages to the upper tiers of society with ever-increasing rapidity.

But that you would refer to the decline in physical book sales as a new holocaust and refer to books as the new Jews is nothing short of bizarre. For a gentile like me to say what I am about to say to someone of your heritage borders on the absurd, but here it is:

1) To compare declining book sales to the wholesale slaughter of six million Jews and untold numbers of Gypsies, homosexuals, and others cheapens the memory of the victims of the Holocaust.

2) Jews are the new Jews. Unfortunately, anti-Semitism never died, and throughout the world attacks upon individuals and groups based on ethnicity still occur with alarming frequency.

In the article, you raised concerns about privacy. These concerns are valid, and have been discussed here and elsewhere. There are no easy answers, but the problem is hardly limited to e-readers. These days, in the U.S., the simple act of checking out certain books from the library can land you on a Homeland Security watch list. Buy those same books with a credit card and an electronic trail of your reading habits has been firmly established.

The silver lining in all of this is that once again the classics are being read, via the uploading of e-text versions to places like Project Gutenberg, and here at MobileRead via the hard work of individual members who not only upload classics, but also actively encourage reading and discussion of classical literature. In addition, many valuable books that in former days couldn’t find publishers because of their limited mass appeal are finding new life on the Internet. New and worthy authors who would otherwise fall by the wayside are finding audiences through independent e-publishing. More and more people are turning off their TV sets and turning on their readers. Online communities are expanding the human family by bringing people together from around the world. Quite a bit of good has come out of all this, if you open your eyes to see it.

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

Dear KindleKitten,

I want to thank you for offering an amazingly civilized and well-considered response. Your account of sititing in the seats of the Nuremberg courtroom is moving and I find the points you've raised compelling. In ithe 90's made a great number of visits to Germany in my capacity as author but I had very different impressions. In fact, on my first night there, I asked my host, the head of a cultural institute, whether there was a rising Neo-Nazi problem in Germany and he promptly replied:"No!". An instant later, a van screeched past pursued by two police cars wth spinning blue lights and all three veered onto an embankment, braked, the van doors flew open, out jiumped a group of skinheads who charged up the hill as the police leaped from their cars and gave chase. At the top of the hill were hundreds of skinheads rioting against hundreds of police. During my tour, especially in East Germany, I encountered numerous skinheads driving around in autos that displayed the Confederate flag and everywhere I went, in gas stations and the like, I noticed confederate flag key chains, confederate flag antennae ornaments, confederate flag patches, pens, et al. When I asked one of the officials at University of Erlangen why the prevalence of confederate flags he explained that since the Swatstika is banned in Germany, people use confederate flags as a substitute totemic expression of their true sympathies. KindleKitten, I saw a hell of a lot of confederate flags while there. Across Germany, Neo-Nazis were burning Turkish women and children alive in their own homes, including in places like Solingen, the birthplace of Adolf Eichman, one of the chief administrators and policy makers of the Final Solution. And today, in Europe, anti-Semitism has reached levels unseen since World War II. The Jews of France are in flight, emigrating to Israel and other places, because things have grown so perilous for them in their home country. Imagine the irony of that! I'm the son of a French Jewish Holocaust survivor who must watch French Jews once more driven out by anti-Semitism. Incredible!
You describe my essays and responses as harangues. True, some of my later responses have grown defensive. I think this is due, in part, to the extraordinary hostility that has erupted on this and other tech-freindly websites in response to my essays on Evergreen Review and The Huffington Post. I want to point you to, if I may, the responses on this website. I have been called every name in the book. I have been threatened with axphixiation by plastic bag. I have been the butt of every sort of vileness imaginable. Why? Because i express opinions that do not concur with the
veneration of hi-tech that is the premise of this and other like websites.
In other words: get with us or face vilification and abuse. Which is my point.
Where here on this site among these hundreds of responses is a single trace of evidence to support the view that electronic book replacements and hi-tech will usher in some new dawn of enlightenment. In fact, yours and one others is the only genuine evidence of civilizational high intelligence evident throughout this entire thread--a thread that now exceeds 300 posts. I'm afraid that my brief experience on this website confirms my worst fears, that hi-tech is fostering a new breed of uncivil and largely ignorant barbarians who may indeed have accesss to thousands of texts but in no way benefit
from them because they are unsupported by any sort of civiilizational tradition, such as books and book culture. May I point out that among the Nazis were amazingly cultured and well-read individuals, who listened to music by Bruckner and Wagner, attended ballets and theater, read books by Goethe, and went out in the evening, pulling on their white gloves, to
axphixiate and incinerate Jews 3,000 at a time (capacity of the chambers at Auchswitz--they were the size of football fields) using new technology.
It is not only what one reads but cultural respect for the medium of its transmission that produces civilization, decency, tradition. Here, I encounter a very snide, Nazi-like culture of jeering and hurtfulness and most of all, of
herd-like conformity that positively astonishes me! Not a single voice of dissent! Only a lot of backslapping and heehawing and above all, self-reighteous smugness that, too, reminds me of the National Socialists.

But then, there is you and I want you to know that because of your fine statement I will reread what you've written and consider and reconsider and reconsider again. You have given me pause for thought, if only to probe and revisit my assumptions, to see where they can be better focused or if needed, changed.

But you stand alone among these hundreds. If one in three hundred Americans are like you, that is cause for hope but not very much hope.
Many many more like you will be needed to pursuade me that we are not on a downward slide to hell.

Thank you!
With regards,
Alan

What I don't understand is why the need for the new technology in the first place? What is wrong with books? Libraries? The argument

Geez! Talk about confusing individual acts with oranges!

Yes, there are skinheads. Yes, there *are* skinheads - and their philosophical brethren - in other countries, including the US. Yes, islamic radicals *are* ideological brethren to skinheads - they just target a different set of 'impure races'. (GAWD, you'd think these people would get a clue that differing religious beliefs do NOT mean 'inferiority', but that's another discussion.)

I also liked KindleKitten's reply, but it is clear you still don't get the real issue. Technology, including ebooks and ebook readers is NOT the problem. The problem is that these people don't just hate their (supposed) 'inferiors', they hate anything that can inform people (especially those who might otherwise be swayed to their ideology) to a broader understanding of the issues.

Please, if you grasp NOTHING ELSE, understand that it wasn't the 'technology' of books Hitler feared, it was the knowledge contained therein. Had personal computers, the internet and ebook readers existed before and during WWII, he would have just as vigorously suppressed them.

Derek

[CleverClothe]

Originally Posted by ardeegee

After reading some of Kaufman's rants on another forum just now:

http://www.lisnews.org/provocative_e...c_book_burning

I have to amend my earlier post-- he's mentally ill.

Good, I was about to question your own sanity.


Elfwreck and Kali Yuga:

There is much more nobler work you could be putting the effort of such large posts to!

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by CleverClothe

Good, I was about to question your own sanity.

Elfwreck and Kali Yuga:

There is much more nobler work you could be putting the effort of such large posts to!

Well, I'm supposed to be writing fanfic for the Yuletide fic exchange. And commenting on a friend's collection of renfaire photos. But I'm really not sure either of those is a "nobler" use of my time.

[catsittingstill]

Alan--I have responded to your previous posts. You have *never* responded to me. Nor do I expect you to change that pattern now, of course...

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

Why is it so impossible for you to grasp that what you are engaging in, doing, is destroying the world of books....

Because we're not.

I mean, seriously, how is reading e-books the same as destroying books? Even assuming that by "books" you mean "paper books" this is just wrong.

I own thousands of paper books. I just asked for, and got, two more paper books for my birthday. I have a dozen more paper books on my wishlist for the holidays. I have *never* harmed a paper book, even a really, really bad one. It's a fetish of mine, I know--burning one copy of a book doesn't make a difference in its general availability-- but my mother lived through the Nazi occupation of Holland, and I'm never, ever going to burn a book.

E-books and paper books are like word processors and pencils. They each have strengths and weaknesses (who would want a pencil that needed batteries and wouldn't fit in a pocket? Who would want to write a whole book with a pencil, now that word processors are available?). These differences mean the two technologies will persist side by side and neither is a significant threat to the other.

And in the meantime, my "world of books" has been vastly expanded by the e-book. It is because of e-books that I even *contemplated* reading classics again after a couple of horrible gradeschool experiences with them. I posted about it here: http://catsittingstill.livejournal.c...33.html#cutid1

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

... wharever (sic) benefit you believe accrues for you from these machines is rubbish compared to the cultural traditions and human freedoms that you are blithely trampling on.

Blink. What human freedom am I trampling on, Alan?

The freedom to read? I have not reduced the availability of one single book. As a matter of fact, I'm a member of Friends of the Library and frequently donate paper books to literacy programs and libraries.

The freedom to write? Go right ahead and write, I neither can, nor want to, interfere with that. Nor does the possibility of publishing those works in more than one format interfere with that.

Your particular "freedom" to give me irrational orders and have me actually obey? Well, okay you got me; I *am* trampling on that human freedom. Now explain to me why it matters.

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

...I accuse you all of gross cultural irresponsability (sic) that has lead (sic) to the imminent downfall of the book iindustry (sic) and the desruction (sic) of book culture (comma needed here) and I regard it as little less than an economic and cultural war crime of sorts, no less than any Nazi who burned a book. (You are comparing an act to a person here--unless you're comparing yourself to the Nazi? I thought not. So you want a parallel construction; something like "I regard it as a war crime of sorts, no less than the burning of a book by a Nazi")

You obviously feel very strongly about this.

Now if you can calm down a little and explain 1) how being able to read electronic files is grossly culturally irresponsible, 2) how book culture is different from culture in general and 3) how e-books will destroy book culture.

I advise you avoid metaphor in these explanations--it is like strong drink for you. You obviously enjoy it, the bite, and the heat, but after two or three hits of metaphor, your prose starts to stagger and quits making sense.
------------------------------------------------------------
In a later post you say:

I have been called every name in the book. I have been threatened with axphixiation (sic) by plastic bag. I have been the butt of every sort of vileness imaginable. Why? Because i (sic) express opinions that do not concur with the veneration of hi-tech that is the premise of this and other like websites.
In other words: get with us or face vilification and abuse. Which is my point.

The way I remember it you began the conversation by calling us Nazis, book-burners, and genocidal murderers. If I understand correctly, you did this because we express opinions that do not concur with your vilification of technology. In other words, we were to get with you or face vilification and abuse. You were not content to leave us to our joys, as we would have been happy to leave you to yours, no, you were livid that you could not convince us we were wrong--no, not just wrong: Nazis!--to like e-books.

To then turn around and complain because you get some of the same treatment you dish out--there's a word for that. It's right on the tip of my tongue but I can't quite remember--hippopotamus? hypnosis? hypocrates? Something like that...

May I point out that among the Nazis were amazingly cultured and well-read individuals, who listened to music by Bruckner and Wagner, attended ballets and theater, read books by Goethe,

I think it's great that you point that out. It's remarkably forthright of you to bring up a major weak point of your argument so openly.

Given that Nazis read great literature and enjoyed inspired works of art and culture, that would imply that 1) Nazis don't necessarily stamp out literature, art and culture and 2) lack of interest in same doesn't make someone a Nazi. Making your attempt to liken what you wrongly perceive as our lack of interest in paper books to Naziism, well, a non-sequitur even by your own lights.

It is not only what one reads but cultural respect for the medium of its transmission that produces civilization, decency, tradition.

Please explain how cultural respect for the medium of transmission produces civilization and decency.

The ancient Chinese, for example, had great cultural respect for ideograms, and the calligraphy used to produce them, but treated each other very cruelly. I would not consider that decent.

What I don't understand is why the need for the new technology in the first place? What is wrong with books? Libraries? The argument (sic)

My husband and I have literally thousands of pounds of books. We moved three times in two years. I have a bad back.

When I go to visit my Dad or my in-laws the books I want to take are heavy, and packing them in the luggage so they don't chew on each other is difficult.

My bookcases are full, and new ones are expensive. Extra wall to put them against is even more expensive. 200 e-books will fit on a ten dollar SD chip the size of a postage stamp.

[Alan Kaufman]

Alan Kaufman moderating panel: "IS THE BOOK DEAD?"


http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?...2643604&ref=mf

[Moejoe]

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

Alan Kaufman moderating panel: "IS THE BOOK DEAD?"


http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?...2643604&ref=mf

NO.

Next question.

Is water wet? Is the sky up above? Why do birds, suddenly appear....?

[cklammer]

The belittlement of the Sho'a as being used in the article's comparison voids any valid points he is making and cast him out from any consideration of his opinion whatsoever!

I'd do a web site about Kaufman but thestupidestmanoneath.com is already taken ...

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

Alan Kaufman moderating panel: "IS THE BOOK DEAD?"


http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?...2643604&ref=mf

As if any one would be stupid enough to help you boost your facebook ratings.

Derek

[Alan Kaufman]

Alan Kaufman moderating panel on Is The Book Dead? Hi-Tech Vs. The Book

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7seAE...layer_embedded

[Deb]

Originally Posted by Slite

and also



The difference between the Kindle and the e-book is what exactly?

The Kindle is an e-book reader, not all e-book readers are Kindles. (thank you Ghod.)

[b0ned0me]

Originally Posted by Alan Kaufman

Alan Kaufman moderating panel on Is The Book Dead? Hi-Tech Vs. The Book

Gosh - I bet that was a balanced discussion, right up there with Goebbels moderating panel on 'Would the world be better off without jews'.

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by b0ned0me

Gosh - I bet that was a balanced discussion, right up there with Goebbels moderating panel on 'Would the world be better off without jews'.

I dunno... I've heard that that Goebbels dude was a pretty even-handed and fair-minded kind of guy. Not sure such a panel would fall to the depths of depravity as anything hosted by Kaufman.

Derek

[Alan Kaufman]

KAUFMAN'S LAW: "Efforts such as Godwin's Law to thwart the finding of contemporary relevence in the Holocaust is a form of Holocaust denial."

[nboshart]

Mr. Kaufman, I'd be interested in you addressing Kali Yuga's post.