Dual firmware announcement

[Terisa de morgan]

Originally Posted by gerraldo

Heck, some of us would even be happy if they'd release the last v1.2 build (834) for download...

ME! ME! My device has it but I can't get it for backup (the seller says they don't have it).

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Have you ever programed on an e-reader ?
Do you know how things works at bookeen ?
Nope. You can't judge something unless you have all the facts.

Yes, there was some serious screw up. I'll have to wait a bit for firmware, so what ? Not the end of the world.

Oh Puh-LEEEEEEZZZZ! I've cracked open an e-ink ereader and gotten down and dirty with the (must I remind you that it runs LINUX?) OS and apps. So please don't try to pretend that programming a LINUX device is somehow "mystical" and "unbelievably complex" simply because it's got an e-ink screen and display controller. Besides, you *do* know, don't you that one can *BUY* a full-blown Samsung S3C2410 or S3C2440 development kit (which includes the cpu and either a 3.5" or 7" LCD display) for around $160 on eBay. Except for the lack of an e-ink display, it's got EVERYTHING for development. Do *you* have one? I do.

As for knowing how things work in the development section of Bookeen, I'd have to say I have a pretty darned good idea from their lack of success in meeting their stated deadlines.

But just to make my point, let me state - again - that failing to meet their own published release dates by more than ONE YEAR not only pisses off their current customers, it also ensures that *potential* customers will go elsewhere. For two reasons. First, potential customers will see that Bookeen's own website and publicity releases do not show favorably on their dedication, competence and clarity. Second, many potential customers for a product come to that product because of word-of-mouth advertising from *HAPPY* current customers. Given Bookeen's ongoing attempts to PISS OFF their current crop of customers, I can well imagine how many potential customers have been driven off by negative word-of-mouth.

I realize that in a "perfect world of customers", potential customers would be stupid and eager to accept any dribble with the gladness of of Oliver Twist asking "Please, Sir. May I have some more?" But we live in a real world where customers are fickle enough to *demand* that the company act under the rule that "THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT" - something which I do not believe Bookeen has learned.

Derek

[Godzil]

programming for linux is not "complex" making an EMBEDDED DEVICE is another beast...

And ho yeah, you have a chinamade "dev" board with a S3C24x0 cool, what do you do with? Have you really tried to make a real embedded device with? (ie something that work with a battery, that should never crash, consume the less possible battery etc.)

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Godzil

And ho yeah, you have a chinamade "dev" board with a S3C24x0 cool, what do you do with? Have you really tried to make a real embedded device with? (ie something that work with a battery, that should never crash, consume the less possible battery etc.)

But that is not things Bookeen care about. The battery time was halved in a firmware update and the device still crashes a lot. So obviously it should be pretty fast developing the firmware.

Exactly what additional problem are you thinking about? Yes, you sometimes have to work around bugs in the hardware and similar stuff but with such old hardware as the Gen 3 these issues should be well known.

[pieter]

Who cares how difficult it might or might not be? I'm a customer, I don't care about those things AT ALL! Actually I pay not to care about such stuff.
Somehow people in this thread seem to imply that with electronic reading devices things are different and that I should somehow care and be involved with the making of this product. oooooh it's sooo hard, and those amazing experts are hard at work to fix my device.

Again... I do not care how hard it is, and I shouldn't have to care since I paid Bookeen a quite handsome amount of money for a device that years after I bought it still isn't stable and crashes once in a while, and still doesn't have folder support.

Now that I seem to have learned to live with, although I already know my next ebook device will never be a Bookeen device. But surely everybody can see the stupidity of promising me my fixes "soon" and then not delivering it "soon". Bookeen really has some of the worst customer relations ability I've ever come across.

They make the same mistake when they seem to think you can just tell a customer "no sorry you can't have epub and mobi on the same firmware because of contracts" and then expect us to say: "ok too bad". I don't care what stupid contracts you as a company have or may not have. The end result is that I have a lousy customer experience. Also they seem to think suggesting to a customer: "well you can just switch firmdates to go from mobi to epub and back" is perfectly normal. Yeah right, almost every firmdate had threads of people complaining of the device bricking during the update, and they think telling me to do it regularly is a good way to solve this lil problem?

Customer is always right. Only the french (read people of bookeen) seem not to have grasped this concept. You know why I'm right? because it's my money!

[EowynCarter]

They make the same mistake when they seem to think you can just tell a customer "no sorry you can't have epub and mobi on the same firmware because of contracts" and then expect us to say: "ok too bad". I don't care what stupid contracts you as a company have or may not have.

Blame amazon for that. (And without that, we probably would be using ePub on our gen3 happily.

Yeah right, almost every firmdate had threads of people complaining of the device bricking during the update, and they think telling me to do it regularly is a good way to solve this lil problem?

Calibre fixed that for me. Bye bye mobi !

But that is not things Bookeen care about. The battery time was halved in a firmware update and the device still crashes a lot. So obviously it should be pretty fast developing the firmware.

When i spoke to the peaple at bookeen, i had a felling they where a bit perfectionists. Like tactile screen, good enough for sony, but not for bookeen.
And them delaying firmware over and over again because they want it to be "perfect". But prefect is not compatible with computing.

Customer is always right. Only the french (read people of bookeen) seem not to have grasped this concept. You know why I'm right? because it's my money!

You paid for an e-reader, you got an e-reader. What's the problem ? Do you think becasue you've paid an e-reader bookeen should jump when you say jump ? No company does that.

[pieter]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Blame amazon for that. (And without that, we probably would be using ePub on our gen3 happily.

My point is that customers shouldn't have to blame or look for answers anywhere. I don't care where the problem comes from. Fix it! Make it work! Don't come to me explaining why it doesn't. Or I guess I should just go to Amazon then since they have the answer to how to make it work? (incidentally this is probably will be the case for my next device)

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Calibre fixed that for me. Bye bye mobi !

DRM too? Is it even legal to shift format and take out DRM? Anyway, I know about Calibre, although why I as a customer should jump through hoops to make something work is beyond me. Seriously only in a market where there is no competition can you expect customers to jump through hoops and find their own sollutions from other companies that fix the problems of the company that i paid money to.
The competition seems to have arrived in Europe, and we'll see how long the "well, it's not our fault, and other companies have the means to fix something we can't fix" answer will hold up.

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

When i spoke to the peaple at bookeen, i had a felling they where a bit perfectionists. Like tactile screen, good enough for sony, but not for bookeen.
And them delaying firmware over and over again because they want it to be "perfect". But prefect is not compatible with computing.

PERFECT?!?! lol, now you take this discussion into absurdo-world. The real reason for the abysmal way they deal with firmware updates is their perfectionism?
That is as bad as that old joke about soliciting for a job.
Job interviewer: "oh, what would you say is you weakness concerning this job?"
answer: "well, I'm a bit of a perfectionist, so I try to do my work perfectly."
Seriously, don't expect me to buy into that "Bookeen are perfectionists" bullshit. Why then have none of their firmware updates EVER been perfect?

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

You paid for an e-reader, you got an e-reader. What's the problem ? Do you think becasue you've paid an e-reader bookeen should jump when you say jump ? No company does that.

I'm saying they should deliver on what they promise. "Soon" (and not again in the french meaning of "soon")


perfectionists...

[EowynCarter]

PERFECT?!?! lol, now you take this discussion into absurdo-world. The real reason for the abysmal way they deal with firmware updates is their perfectionism?
That is as bad as that old joke about soliciting for a job.
Job interviewer: "oh, what would you say is you weakness concerning this job?"
answer: "well, I'm a bit of a perfectionist, so I try to do my work perfectly."
Seriously, don't expect me to buy into that "Bookeen are perfectionists" bullshit. Why then have none of their firmware updates EVER been perfect?

That's the point. Computer program will never be "perfect". You will always find bug to fix, small things to add or improve. So sometimes you have to say "ok, good enough for that, let's publish"

[GeoffC]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

That's the point. Computer program will never be "perfect". You will always find bug to fix, small things to add or improve. So sometimes you have to say "ok, good enough for that, let's publish"

..... memo to Bookeen....

[K-Thom]

None of their former firmware releases came close to being "perfect". So why start being perfectionistic now ...?!

Just release it. Former firmwares tended to brick an occasional Cybook, too.

[Over]

We should do a meet-up(tm) at their offices!

[K-Thom]

You mean the one with torches and hay forks?

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by K-Thom

You mean the one with torches and hay forks?

Hay forks? Why? So we can 'turn down the bedding' for their programmer? Nope. I'm thinking of torches, racks, Iron Maidens and the guillotine would me more appropriate. Either that or 72 straight hours of Seinfeld reruns.

Derek

[gerraldo]

Originally Posted by pieter

My point is that customers shouldn't have to blame or look for answers anywhere. I don't care where the problem comes from. Fix it! Make it work! Don't come to me explaining why it doesn't. Or I guess I should just go to Amazon then since they have the answer to how to make it work? (incidentally this is probably will be the case for my next device)

Incidentally Amazon is the problem with this format wars... And though I'm not interested in it, it's nice to have the possibility to switch to ePub (with the new firmware) and no need to buy a new device!

My CyBook is perfectly OK for reading (Mobi) and I'm just angry about Bookeens no information policy, them not keeping their promises and not releasing the d*mn thing (though they use it on newly sold devices)...

[Deneb]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Have you ever programed on an e-reader ?
Do you know how things works at bookeen ?
Nope. You can't judge something unless you have all the facts.

Yes, there was some serious screw up. I'll have to wait a bit for firmware, so what ? Not the end of the world.

Originally Posted by delphidb96

But just to make my point, let me state - again - that failing to meet their own published release dates by more than ONE YEAR not only pisses off their current customers, it also ensures that *potential* customers will go elsewhere. For two reasons. First, potential customers will see that Bookeen's own website and publicity releases do not show favorably on their dedication, competence and clarity. Second, many potential customers for a product come to that product because of word-of-mouth advertising from *HAPPY* current customers. Given Bookeen's ongoing attempts to PISS OFF their current crop of customers, I can well imagine how many potential customers have been driven off by negative word-of-mouth.

Derek

Originally Posted by pieter

Now that I seem to have learned to live with, although I already know my next ebook device will never be a Bookeen device. But surely everybody can see the stupidity of promising me my fixes "soon" and then not delivering it "soon". Bookeen really has some of the worst customer relations ability I've ever come across.

Sorry Eowyn, I have to desagree with you and agree with Derek and Pieter. I don't know why you always try to protect Bookeen but this time, they really, really went "off line".
I'm french, I bought a cybook because it seemed nice and it was a french company()...I doubt very much I will buy another reader from bookeen ever again!

They do have a lousy customer relation maybe the worst I have seen! It's sad because the device is very fine, really, once I choose what book I want to read, it's perfect...but I have to choose between 96 pages of 5 books witch don't even show the title full! And how depressing it is to read two books at the same time if they are far away in the alphabet!! I have to use my old small SD cards (from 32Ko to 256 Mo) because it crashes when I use the advertised 2Go...

Other little company do come to this forum and actually answer their customers (Check the Astak forum)...If Bookeen hasn't realised how customer review is important, then, too bad for them. I think they loose a lot of potential customers here, the global feeling on bookeen is negatif and frustrated and mobilread is the first forum you find when you begin a research on ebook reader... If they are happy with their sales, ok, but I doubt it. In the growing competition, it's seems suicidal.

As to how difficult programing is, first, we don't care as consumer, it's their job not mine, especially when they promised it "soon" (how stupid that was...).
And second, other devices already have the folder support (whitch is the most commun feature hoped for) or whatever is supposed to be in that update. Other programers don't seem to find it so hard...They could have made small updates often instead of one big (we're still waiting for), They could communicate here, there is a lot of things they could have done, instead, I feel ignored and frustrated. They are not logical from my customer point of view, I don't understand how they think...

I don't even get mad because they don't deliver the update promised a year ago (while they use it on the opus), delay happens, no, what's so infuriating is their lack of explanation why it's late. They have a blog and It's never updated! It make them either arrogant or incompetent...