Do some publishers have any idea?

[murraypaul]

Originally Posted by leebase

Well....I can vouch for Amazon doing targeted genre advertising of their indie authors. I get constant adds for military science fiction...even on Facebook. After I bought 30 or so I had to stop myself. No idea if they are good books yet, haven’t gotten around to even reading one of them.

Targeted advertising plus cheap prices were working with this customer

If you haven't tried Kindle Unlimited, you might want to give it a try.
There is a lot of military science fiction on KU. (At least in the UK, can't imagine it would be any different in the US.)

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Hellmark

The problem with this is, many people are doing that, and the publishers are taking it as "People aren't interested in ebooks" instead of "We are selling ebooks at too high of a price".

Yeah, back catalog stuff is often cheaper. However, newer stuff, it isn't uncommon to see ebooks for as much as the paperback or more. Hell, there are times I've seen the ebook go for more than the hardcover.

And I've seen a lot of ebooks that are priced well below the hardback or paperback prices. The problem with confirmational bias is you only notice the things that confirm what you believe to be true. It's worth checking every so often and seeing how true your assumptions actually are.

Top 5 NY Times best seller list
title - hard cover price - ebook price
Where the Crawdads sing - $15.60 - $12.99
The 18th Abduction - $13.26 - $14.99
Cari Mora - $17.40 - $14.99
Fire and Blood - $18.31 - $ 15.99
Redemption (Baldacci) - $14.72 - $14.99

So 3 out of 5 where the ebook price was several dollars below the hardback price, 1 out of 5 where the ebook price was higher than the hardback price and 1 out of 5 when they were roughly the same.

[HaemishM]

I've always been of the mind that eBooks should never cost more than their hardback or paperback equivalents. How much less is going to be variable and is something the publisher or author has to determine. The thing about eBooks that I think most publishers have problems getting their heads around is the complete removal of the supply part of the economic equation. Your supply is limitless - it mostly doesn't matter how big the book is, you don't suddenly have to reprint if you sell out (because how are you going to sell out) and so long as the store site doesn't go down, you can sell the book until the heat death of the sun. Clearly there are storage costs and bandwidth costs for the seller and there's going to be costs for the publisher/author in preparing the file (and maybe even some maintenance costs if you have to go back and fix mistakes) but there's never a reason for the eBook to go "out of print" other than those involving the store. If bandwidth and storage costs are borne by the store (and should be a part of the store's cut), eBook's should in theory cost the publisher/author less to produce than a physical book.

Having just recently released 2 books as eBooks only, but then bundling those eBooks into the rest of the series as both eBooks and paperbacks, I was amazed at the necessity for difference in cost.

This is based on Amazon's self-publishing platform:
eBook containing 6 novellas (about 180k words) - List price is $4.99 and I make about $3.40 per book on that (except in some markets where I only make $1.75)
Paperback containing those same 6 novellas (about 561 pages) - List price is $20.99 and I make about $5.13 on that which seems high - however, in order to use their Expanded Distribution (which puts the book into places like Ingram so that brick and mortar stores can order the book), I have to price it that high and I only make $.93 cents per book on those sales.

Barnes and Noble and Smashwords are similar numbers though B&N's paperback pricing is a little different, though not enough for the retail price to change.

Now I don't have the overhead that a publisher does, so I can afford to price things cheaper, and I can't credibly say what the difference in costs are them. However, if their volume of sales allows them to sell a hardback $20, selling an eBook for $20 is, in my opinion, completely out of whack unless they just don't expect the eBooks to sell at all. These days, I can't fathom that being a possibility unless you are talking about a market where Internet penetration is back in the Stone Ages.

[DiapDealer]

I value ebooks more than physical books. So as I've said so many times before, it would be silly of me to compare the price of an ebook to the physical version of it that I'm simply not going to buy. Dollar for dollar, I find the current prices of new-release ebooks (by major publishers) to be more than a fair price for the enjoyment I derive from them--a bargain even. None of the rest of the noise matters to me. Cost to produce/distribute/store isn't anything I ever thought about when physical books were the only thing going, and I'm not going to start thinking about them now RE ebooks. It's not relevant to my valuation of the product.

The value, for me, has always been 100% in the content of a book (and my enjoyment of that content). I don't consider Ebooks to be an "addon" product. They're meat and potatoes. As such I don't expect to get the entree at cup-o-soup prices (even if most of the ingredients for the entree had already been purchased to make the soup).

[leebase]

Originally Posted by leebase

Well....I can vouch for Amazon doing targeted genre advertising of their indie authors. I get constant adds for military science fiction...even on Facebook. After I bought 30 or so I had to stop myself. No idea if they are good books yet, haven’t gotten around to even reading one of them.

Targeted advertising plus cheap prices were working with this customer

Update. I have gotten around to reading a couple. Bobby Adair's Freedom's Fire box set. I've read the first 3. Nice, popcorn level space opera. Very enjoyable. Probably is YA, not sure if it's intended to be. The main characters aren't kids...but the story telling is linear and no sex.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by leebase

Probably is YA, not sure if it's intended to be. The main characters aren't kids...but the story telling is linear and no sex.

YA or poor writing.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

YA or poor writing.

Actually, linear writing, no subplots mirroring the major themes--to me, this is the real "tell" of self-published writing, more than almost anything else. (Well, that and gruesomely awful covers, of course...).

It's frustrating. I don't mind potato-chip books, but I'd like a bit of depth. Even YA has subplots, for crying out loud!

Hitch

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Actually, linear writing, no subplots mirroring the major themes--to me, this is the real "tell" of self-published writing, more than almost anything else. (Well, that and gruesomely awful covers, of course...).

It's frustrating. I don't mind potato-chip books, but I'd like a bit of depth. Even YA has subplots, for crying out loud!

Hitch

I've gotten to the point where I just ignore books with manga like covers. I would say that it's not so much self-publishing as self publishing where the writer hasn't learned the craft yet.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

I've gotten to the point where I just ignore books with manga like covers. I would say that it's not so much self-publishing as self publishing where the writer hasn't learned the craft yet.

I admit, I'm spared on those because I'm not a manga reader. :-)

Hitch

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Hitch

I admit, I'm spared on those because I'm not a manga reader. :-)

Hitch

I'm not a manga reader either. Apparently, the use of manga style drawing has now become a thing for some self-published books.

[lumpynose]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

I'm not a manga reader either. Apparently, the use of manga style drawing has now become a thing for some self-published books.

It surprises me that it's popular because it's an unimaginative stuck-in-the-rut style, the big eyes and all. Way back when I was a kid watching TV in the 1960s we had English dubbed Astro Boy from Japan, with the same style and those same big eyes. Then it died out here for several years, but not in Japan, then it came back here.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Hitch

I admit, I'm spared on those because I'm not a manga reader. :-)

Hitch

I also don't read Manga.

As for self-published, if I find the cover to be awful, I'll bypass the book. The saying "Never judge a book by it's cover." never had to deal with Kindle Unlimited.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by lumpynose

It surprises me that it's popular because it's an unimaginative stuck-in-the-rut style, the big eyes and all. Way back when I was a kid watching TV in the 1960s we had English dubbed Astro Boy from Japan, with the same style and those same big eyes. Then it died out here for several years, but not in Japan, then it came back here.

Slightly OT: At one point, as an adult, I used to see that Sailor Moon cartoon, in the afternoons, when I'd workout. I'd pop on whatever machine, turn on afternoon Telly--let's face it, daytime TV pre-streaming was not afloat in options--and my cats loved it (and a show called "Gargoyles," too...). I thought it was cute, for kids...and then, at some point, my brain kicked in and I realized that it's pedo porn for adult men. I looked further into anime/manga, and that was it for me. I have no problem with men, women, porno...but stylized pedo porn is just disgusting, legitimizing or facilitating something that oughn't be facilitated, stylized, etc.

Hitch

[GlennD]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Slightly OT: At one point, as an adult, I used to see that Sailor Moon cartoon, in the afternoons, when I'd workout. I'd pop on whatever machine, turn on afternoon Telly--let's face it, daytime TV pre-streaming was not afloat in options--and my cats loved it (and a show called "Gargoyles," too...). I thought it was cute, for kids...and then, at some point, my brain kicked in and I realized that it's pedo porn for adult men. I looked further into anime/manga, and that was it for me. I have no problem with men, women, porno...but stylized pedo porn is just disgusting, legitimizing or facilitating something that oughn't be facilitated, stylized, etc.

Hitch

The thing about manga is that there is literally something for everyone. You can pretty much find what you're looking for - everything from volleyball manuals to various flavors of porn. I easily could point you at some great manga without even a hint of innuendo in it.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Slightly OT: At one point, as an adult, I used to see that Sailor Moon cartoon, in the afternoons, when I'd workout. I'd pop on whatever machine, turn on afternoon Telly--let's face it, daytime TV pre-streaming was not afloat in options--and my cats loved it (and a show called "Gargoyles," too...). I thought it was cute, for kids...and then, at some point, my brain kicked in and I realized that it's pedo porn for adult men. I looked further into anime/manga, and that was it for me. I have no problem with men, women, porno...but stylized pedo porn is just disgusting, legitimizing or facilitating something that oughn't be facilitated, stylized, etc.

Hitch

Yes, supposedly that is how Manga got it's start, pedo porn that was stylized enough that the Japanese courts wouldn't throw you in jail for having it because it didn't look enough like a real kid to count. No idea if that's really the case or if it's just some sort of urban legend. There is a scene in Kill Bill Vol 1 where they switch from live actors to animation for pretty much the same reason.

Apparently they have software packages now that make it easy to generate. Plus, anime and Manga have become a pretty big genre at Amazon. I have friends who are really into anime. Some of it is fine, some really pushes the envelop. Of course, these days compared to what you can see on cable, it's tame.