What a Basic Premise needs

[crich70]

I was reading one of the books on writing that I've bought from Amazon this morning when I read something that makes perfect sense and is crystal clear. A story premise needs 3 basic things:
1. Character
2. Goal, and
3. Conflict.
If your story idea doesn't have all 3 then it's not a complete premise. Simple, but you can't get any easier than that. I mean say someone had the following: "A writer who has broken his legs wants to get out of a house." It's a start, but where's the conflict to keep a reader turning pages? So you add conflict into the mix. "There is a potentially dangerous crazy person in the house who won't let the writer leave." Ah, now that sounds interesting. And Stephen King's novel of Misery as well as the movie version are well known.

Spoiler:

The story has Character (Paul Sheldon & Annie Wilkes). It has a goal (Paul Sheldon escaping from Annie) and conflict (if he doesn't she will probably kill him).

[amazon author]

How about theme?

[crich70]

Originally Posted by amazon author

How about theme?

It's my understanding that theme comes from the story itself. You have to have a story to tell (a complete premise) in order to have a theme (IMO). I mean if you have a love story you can have a theme like "love conquers all" or "love is worth dying for" etc. But which one is in your story depends on your characters, their goals, the conflict and how you want the story to end.

[gmw]

Hmm ... Why use of the word "premise"? A story may need those three things, but does the premise? It seems a strange use of the word (at best redundant). And if you leave out the word premise, then you can find the same advice pretty much anywhere.

A premise is the structure or assumption on which something else depends. A story's premise is usually something like: what if a man-made virus killed most of the population? (The Stand). Or, what if the reason vampires can't be out in the sun is because they go all glittery (Twilight). Those are assumptions that the stories are built on, but they say nothing character, goal or conflict.

But let's assume for a moment I was more polite and hadn't argued about the word "premise", I think the advice is good but overly simplistic. Let's see...

I've got Postman Pat (character), he wants to deliver a letter (goal), but the dog won't let him through the gate (conflict).

I might be able to make a kid's story out of this, or maybe a brief comedy, but if I'd been thinking of writing an 80,000 word serious adult novel then I'm in trouble. Which leads to the first piece missing from the advice: the writer needs to have their own goals (what they want to write, and who for), but there's lots more.

A story needs a setting, and it needs background. More often than not it needs a sense of urgency - that's often what conflict is for, but it's not the only possible source. Characters need to be interesting, and preferably some way that the reader can connect to them (love, late, annoy, there are lots of possibilities). Goals need to difficult, sliding an envelope through a slot doesn't really qualify, so it's just as well our conflict gets in on the act. Which is an important point, it's not just enough to have these ingredients, they all need to be interrelated. For example, if I'd said the conflict was with Postman Pat's neighbour (for whatever reason) then I'd have nothing to make the story's goal more difficult; and if Postman Pat wasn't a postman he'd have less reason to be delivering a letter. It's all connected. That's what stories do.

But none of these are fixed rules. Many thrillers have cardboard cut-out characters, but still work because they make up for it in other ways. There are books in which can be difficult to identify conflict, or where the urgency comes through in subtle ways. There can be strange stories where you're wondering what's going on, why the author is telling you all this ... until the end where suddenly the connections become clear (I have a Ted Chiang short story, Story of Your Life, in mind as I write this).

So there's nothing wrong with the advice that stories need characters, goals and conflict, but that's leaving a lot out.

[crich70]

Well I didn't say that that was all there was too it either. It's just the 1st step. The book is "Rock your Plot" by Cathy Yardley.

[Kasper Hviid]

Originally Posted by gmw

I've got Postman Pat (character), he wants to deliver a letter (goal), but the dog won't let him through the gate (conflict).

... but unbeknownst to the young female recipient, those nasty letters are written by Postman Pat himself! With each delivery, the conflict between the protective dog and the psychotic postal worker gets more extreme.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by crich70

Well I didn't say that that was all there was too it either. It's just the 1st step. The book is "Rock your Plot" by Cathy Yardley.

I don't know if it was your paraphrasing, or the way it was put in the book, but "If your story idea doesn't have all 3 then it's not a complete premise" strongly suggests that with all 3 it is a complete premise. (Hmm... there's that word again, I just can't make it sit right in my head ... but I can sort of see the author's problem, they don't want to claim they mean "story" or even "plot" since then the shortcomings of the advice would become just too obvious.)

By now you know what I'm like, I see these overly simplistic theories and go a little over the top. I find them quite irritating. I hope the book is based on more than that single premise (and this time the word fits).

Originally Posted by Kasper Hviid

... but unbeknownst to the young female recipient, those nasty letters are written by Postman Pat himself! With each delivery, the conflict between the protective dog and the psychotic postal worker gets more extreme.

Ah, yes. Getting more adult now.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by gmw

I don't know if it was your paraphrasing, or the way it was put in the book, but "If your story idea doesn't have all 3 then it's not a complete premise" strongly suggests that with all 3 it is a complete premise. (Hmm... there's that word again, I just can't make it sit right in my head ... but I can sort of see the author's problem, they don't want to claim they mean "story" or even "plot" since then the shortcomings of the advice would become just too obvious.)

By now you know what I'm like, I see these overly simplistic theories and go a little over the top. I find them quite irritating. I hope the book is based on more than that single premise (and this time the word fits).



Ah, yes. Getting more adult now.

What I meant was that you ned characters, a goal and a conflict as the very least on which to build a story idea. The premise is just the 1st step in the development. Just like you need wheels, a motive force and a means of steering in order to have a land vehicle that will go somewhere. lol. Of course you also need such things as breaks, windshield wipers and a speedometer but without the 1st three the other things are without use.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by crich70

What I meant was that you ned characters, a goal and a conflict as the very least on which to build a story idea. The premise is just the 1st step in the development. Just like you need wheels, a motive force and a means of steering in order to have a land vehicle that will go somewhere. lol. Of course you also need such things as breaks, windshield wipers and a speedometer but without the 1st three the other things are without use.

To pick up your analogy and run with it*: Before your wheels are any good you need some ground to run on (the setting). And having some idea whether you're driving in the backyard (kid's stories), a race track (thrillers), the highway (contemporary fiction), rocky ground (horror), or alien ground (fantasy) would be really helpful in choosing your wheels. The steering and motive force are totally pointless unless they are connected to the wheels. Do you see what I mean now?

I actually like your analogy better than the meaningless words of the OP. Motive force is the goal - something that drives the story from beginning to end. Character is the steering, that often arbitrary choice between left and right. Conflict is problems with your steering, or holes in your tyres. The way to understand conflict is to see that it is a way to make the goal more difficult to achieve. See it in that light and you begin to understand what it really means in terms of story construction.

Think back over the short stories you've read and think about conflict (what I'm talking about tends to be more obvious in shorts). I don't know about you, but I can name many where the conflict is not obvious. This is because conflict (by common interpretation) is not what is critical to the story. What is meant by "conflict" is what lies between the central character(s) and the goal(s). Seen this way it becomes obvious that just any conflict is not good enough, it has to be connected to the character and the goal. In fact conflict is not the right word. Obstruction comes closer. Rocks on the road of your analogy. Things that make achieving the goal more difficult. Understand what is really meant by "conflict" and you open up whole new vistas of story construction.

But the more I think about it, the more I come up with one word: connections. Stories make connections, even improbable ones. The connections are what makes the story feel complete. And not only connections within the story, but connections to real life, even from fantasy stories, so that the reader can be connected as well.

Think back to your Misery example.

Spoiler:

Annie is not just some random crazy thrown in to make Paul's life hard. No. She is his "number 1 fan". This highly improbable situation not only adds to the spice of the story, it adds to the difficulties that Paul faces. It calls upon connections to the past, from before the story started, and ties the story together in terms of motivation, both Annie's and Paul's. It calls upon the readers, most of whom have probably read favourite books and series where they wish the author hadn't killed off a character, and via this connection the reader gets a spark of understanding for Annie.

Connections. Stories make connections.


* My mother may have told me not to run with scissors, I really don't remember, but I'm pretty sure she never mentioned not to run with analogies .

[crich70]

I take your point that you need different 'wheels' for different ground. I thinkit also depends on how far your destination is as well. You don't need to pack a lot of luggage for a trip to the corner market but may need a lot of stuff if you are going camping or something.