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Old 01-02-2015, 03:08 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks View Post
One thing that DID change for me over the last year for certain: When you do a search on my name, WITHOUT my middle initial, which is how most people search, my author page/link no longer comes up on Amazon--someone else's page shows up. My books show up, but not my author link. Maria Schneider the jazz artist also gets much more prominent displaying than she used to (she's quite famous). She always showed up in the search, but now she is the ONLY Maria Schneider to show up UNLESS a person specifies books.

A year ago, a simple search yielded at least one of my books, the jazz stuff and a few other authors. Now it's rearranged and not to my benefit. This is what I mean when I say I am not sure KU can be blamed for all the loss of income. I have read that Amazon is much more interested in paid placement than in the past and the searches have definitely changed.

I regard it all as business decisions. They are never static. They will try new things and different searches. That's just the way it is.
You say that you know this for certain, but I just did a search on "maria schneider" and once I scrolled past the music CDs on the first page of results, I started seeing your books. I'm not sure why you would think that the order of the search results changing has anything to do with Kindle Unlimited, or why you would think that this is anything other than, maybe, people buying more jazz music than books. It's unfortunate that you happen to share a name with a popular musician, but it's certainly not Amazon's fault in any way. Of course the first results in a general search are going to be the bestsellers. How else should they do the sort?

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Old 01-02-2015, 03:18 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by shalym View Post
You say that you know this for certain, but I just did a search on "maria schneider" and once I scrolled past the music CDs on the first page of results, I started seeing your books. I'm not sure why you would think that the order of the search results changing has anything to do with Kindle Unlimited, or why you would think that this is anything other than, maybe, people buying more jazz music than books. It's unfortunate that you happen to share a name with a popular musician, but it's certainly not Amazon's fault in any way. Of course the first results in a general search are going to be the bestsellers. How else should they do the sort?

Shari
I don't think it has anything do to with KU--I was merely mentioning that I think things have changed in the search function and they are not as "good" for me personally. The thing that changed is that my author page no longer shows up under a search of Maria Schneider (My books always did and under a general search, I used to be mixed in with the jazz artist rather than at the end--this is not an issue for me, just something I noted). I'm thrilled to share my name with her. She has grown more popular over the years and I'm actually more likely to benefit from the association.

My author page no longer shows up even when you select "Books" and Maria Schneider as the search. Someone else's author page does. This is new, but it's been this way for months. Their search function has changed. When I asked about getting my author page/link back in the search list I was told it was not something they would even discuss.

Again, I'm not blaming anyone or angry, but it changed. I used to be more prominent (whether due to sales or other changes made to the search engines). My results were more mixed in with the jazz artist. My author page used to show up in there. Perhaps the change is just that another Maria Schneider showed up on the scene (although her book is out of print so I think she's been around for a while).

These are little things that indicate the possibility that Amazon is not pushing ebooks (or indies?) as much/frequently as they used to. But it's anecdotal/clue not irrefutable proof.

As another example, when I used to search on my name, Karen Cantwell's books showed up. Those no longer show up (I'm not sure why the DID in the past). I think Amazon's search engine has been tweaked. For whatever reason.
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Old 01-02-2015, 04:13 PM   #108
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@BearMountainBooks:

I appreciate the insight into the situation, by the way. Didn't mean to suggest we were necessarily "at odds." You just happened to be the last person to mention the "Amazon isn't 'on your side'" thing.

I find the motive aspect to be largely irrelevant when it comes to sellers or buyers—a meaningless distinction. People aren't going to stick with them for long if Amazon's business goals suddenly started resulting in customers having to jump through more hoops (than they would somewhere else), or having to spend more money (than they would somewhere else) to utilize their services. So for all practical purposes, many readers/consumers and Amazon ARE currently on the same side. Even if it's only a temporary, somewhat incidental alliance of convenience.
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Old 01-02-2015, 06:45 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks View Post
My author page no longer shows up even when you select "Books" and Maria Schneider as the search. Someone else's author page does. This is new, but it's been this way for months. Their search function has changed. When I asked about getting my author page/link back in the search list I was told it was not something they would even discuss.
Remove your middle initial from your Amazon profile.

Your avatar shows a book cover without an initial.
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Old 01-02-2015, 06:47 PM   #110
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One of the reasons Amazon may be moving back to "placement" and ads is because they have milked the other methods of driving traffic and making money. So now they may be trying placements or more of it. This isn't necessarily helpful to readers either, and may in fact, drive them to more expensive products.
Another reason may be that the agreements with the publishers for modified agency envisions that there be charging for placement and ads.
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Old 01-02-2015, 07:15 PM   #111
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Another reason may be that the agreements with the publishers for modified agency envisions that there be charging for placement and ads.
This is what I suspect.

I leave the initial off the covers for space reasons. I'm the same person though. Really, I am!

I could try changing the profile/author page and whatnot, but I don't know if that would help. Amazon claims that the other author has more visits than my page (even though she has one book and it isn't even an English version--thanks for that ego boost Ammie. ) So technically, even if I changed my name, if her page has more visits...

It's not a huge deal. It's just something I noticed. I notice it on searches for titles as well. The algorithm is constantly changing and there could be a lot of reasons for it.
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Old 01-02-2015, 07:58 PM   #112
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This is what I suspect.

I leave the initial off the covers for space reasons. I'm the same person though. Really, I am!

I could try changing the profile/author page and whatnot, but I don't know if that would help. Amazon claims that the other author has more visits than my page (even though she has one book and it isn't even an English version--thanks for that ego boost Ammie. ) So technically, even if I changed my name, if her page has more visits...

It's not a huge deal. It's just something I noticed. I notice it on searches for titles as well. The algorithm is constantly changing and there could be a lot of reasons for it.
For fun I did a search. I thought the title was "Dragon Kin". But it seems to be "DragonKin" which probably makes it harder to find. Also the author names are inconsistent in the different books. Sometimes it is with E and sometimes not.

The old way was that the way the title and the author was written on the title page in the book was how it was cataloged. Regardless of how it was written on the cover. But nowadays I assume that not all books have a title page.

For me that have a register of read books it is very annoying when the authors spelling is not consistent.
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Old 01-02-2015, 08:15 PM   #113
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For fun I did a search. I thought the title was "Dragon Kin". But it seems to be "DragonKin" which probably makes it harder to find. Also the author names are inconsistent in the different books. Sometimes it is with E and sometimes not.

The old way was that the way the title and the author was written on the title page in the book was how it was cataloged. Regardless of how it was written on the cover. But nowadays I assume that not all books have a title page.

For me that have a register of read books it is very annoying when the authors spelling is not consistent.
Sorry about the inconsistency. I actually originally used the initial so that I wouldn't be confused with another author and the jazz singer. But readers told me they couldn't find ALL my books when searching (because they were not including the initial). My books did show up on most platforms with just a Maria Schneider search, but it is true that some retailers would not find my name at all UNLESS the "e" was used. So, I started listing books without my middle initial to get them to show up more consistently. Unfortunately, that didn't help. Some search engines (Smashwords) has a fit if the metadata, name on the book cover and author submitted name are not exactly the same. Some search engines now find my name/books much easier with just a Maria Schneider. And, alas, some still only find me with the "e" inserted because that is how I am registered as an author on most sites.

I fear you may be correct and I cannot blame all of this on Amazon. I was actually only trying to make the point that what they showed in a common search a year ago was/is not the same as what they show now and their rules have changed. Their search engine was "Friendlier" to some of my titles (misspelled or partial) and friendlier to variations of my name than it is today.
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Old 01-03-2015, 02:11 AM   #114
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I fear you may be correct and I cannot blame all of this on Amazon.
Come on! Get with the program!
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Old 01-03-2015, 05:09 AM   #115
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So? If they're not happy with it, they don't have to participate.

I don't care what kinds of deals authors make with publishers or booksellers. Not my problem.
Lot's of people state this, but I don't get that way of seeing the world. As a consumer, I definitively care about the ethics and behaviour of the companies I give money to. Partly from an ethical point of view (if I give money to someone I know use them to behave unethically, I share part (admittedly a small part) of their guilt), but mostly from a practical point of view. If I support companies which treat their employees or partners badly, I make it more likely that others who pay decent wages, care about working conditions etc. will fail. That increases the risk of myself and others I care about getting worse working conditions in the future. Also, if I give my money to multinational companies who avoid taxes instead of local companies who pay tax to my country, there will be less tax money to pay for the infrastructure I use.

And, as others have mentioned here: If the authors I love can't earn a decent wage, they may stop publishing books.

I definitively won't claim that I always research the ethics of the companies I buy from. Life's too short, and most of the big companies act badly in some ways. Also, if the price difference is too big, I'll probably fall for the temptation to save money rather than buying from the most ethical company.

But if big companies misbehave, that's ultimately going to be my problem. Yours too. We share this planet, others' behaviour affects us all.
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Old 01-03-2015, 05:52 AM   #116
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Lot's of people state this, but I don't get that way of seeing the world. As a consumer, I definitively care about the ethics and behaviour of the companies I give money to.
In what way do you consider KU to be unethical?
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Old 01-03-2015, 06:31 AM   #117
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I should perhaps have said more clearly that I was talking generally about the view that "the behaviour of the businesses I give my money to isn't my problem" (paraphrased, not quoting any poster), not specifically about KU.

The only thing I know about the business side of KU is Scalzi's blog post. Based on that, "unethical" may be too strong a word. But it looks like it's bad for many authors because of the "sharing a fixed pool of money" model, and bad for readers because it encourages authors to split up books into lots of small parts, which makes for more annoying reading.

I avoid Amazon as much as possible because I don't think it's in my interest that any single actor in the book market is as powerful as Amazon is, and also because I've read some horrifying stuff about working conditions for Amazon's employees.


"too strong a word" looks clumsy. Is "a too strong word" better? Any suggestions for saying that in a better way?
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Old 01-03-2015, 06:40 AM   #118
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Wouldn't the question of "how authors get paid" be best left to those who hold the rights to the ebooks, and presumably granted permission for those ebooks to be lent by KU? I hear that Amazon "exclusivity" is required for some authors' works to be included, so I doubt the rights holders have been blind-sided by any of terms/conditions. The only thing left is to see if it works out for them (authors) financially. Yay if it does. If not, pull out as soon as the terms allow--if you control the rights. Or lobby those who DO control the rights to your work if you don't. How on earth is this turning into another "Amazon is screwing authors" scenario for some? Are they forcing participation on KDP uploaders? I've heard at least one indie author (in this thread) say they're not participating, so I don't think that's the case. Was it a surprise "opt-out" situation that KDP author's didn't have time to react to?
You sign up for Amazon exclusivity for 3 months at a time so if KU was introduced just after you renewed, it would be another 3 months before you could opt out.
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Old 01-03-2015, 06:57 AM   #119
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Lot's of people state this, but I don't get that way of seeing the world. As a consumer, I definitively care about the ethics and behaviour of the companies I give money to. Partly from an ethical point of view (if I give money to someone I know use them to behave unethically, I share part (admittedly a small part) of their guilt), but mostly from a practical point of view. If I support companies which treat their employees or partners badly, I make it more likely that others who pay decent wages, care about working conditions etc. will fail. That increases the risk of myself and others I care about getting worse working conditions in the future. Also, if I give my money to multinational companies who avoid taxes instead of local companies who pay tax to my country, there will be less tax money to pay for the infrastructure I use.

And, as others have mentioned here: If the authors I love can't earn a decent wage, they may stop publishing books.

I definitively won't claim that I always research the ethics of the companies I buy from. Life's too short, and most of the big companies act badly in some ways. Also, if the price difference is too big, I'll probably fall for the temptation to save money rather than buying from the most ethical company.

But if big companies misbehave, that's ultimately going to be my problem. Yours too. We share this planet, others' behaviour affects us all.

There are a lot of reasons to care what companies do and why they do it. In addition to the ethical concerns (and I very much do care about the ethics of a company) there are practical considerations. If you understand what a company is trying to accomplish, you can decide if that is in your long term best interest or not.
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Old 01-03-2015, 08:04 AM   #120
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I should perhaps have said more clearly that I was talking generally about the view that "the behaviour of the businesses I give my money to isn't my problem" (paraphrased, not quoting any poster), not specifically about KU.

The only thing I know about the business side of KU is Scalzi's blog post. Based on that, "unethical" may be too strong a word. But it looks like it's bad for many authors because of the "sharing a fixed pool of money" model, and bad for readers because it encourages authors to split up books into lots of small parts, which makes for more annoying reading.

I avoid Amazon as much as possible because I don't think it's in my interest that any single actor in the book market is as powerful as Amazon is, and also because I've read some horrifying stuff about working conditions for Amazon's employees.


"too strong a word" looks clumsy. Is "a too strong word" better? Any suggestions for saying that in a better way?
"Unethical" isn't the word that you need to be concerned about. "Horrifying," by any stretch of the imagination, is a gross misrepresentation of the "working conditions" for Amazon employees--even IF you take everything said by disgruntled employees and pot-stirrers at face value.
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