Tired of ebook pricing

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by FinancialWar

I legally download books, books without copyright. You know the really old ones from project Gutenberg.

A valuable source, certainly, but personally I enjoy reading more modern books as well as the classics.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by HarryT

That still doesn't make it "mad" to pay for books. If nobody paid for books, there wouldn't be very many new books to read.

If it is mad to pay $6 for a book if you can lie and cheat buy using VPN to buy it for $3 or so then we have re-defined the word mad a bit.

Also if you want to support authors it seems to me it is mad to wait for lower prices. Then you should just pay the "hardcover" price and never borrow a book and never buy a book second hand.

[dip166]

I can understand your frustration as I've felt that myself. Guess as customers, we're used to see (and made to see in a sense for marketing purposes) Amazon as a single store, but it's really not. It's Amazon US, Amazon CA, Amazon UK, etc., all separated and attending different markets and, in case of books, different copyrights. Although they supposedly work as a brand and have this quality standards and whatnot.

A similar good example in my opinion would perhaps be McDonalds; I doubt you expect prices and even menus to be the same everywhere?

I'm living in Japan now and had to open a new account here which is not connected to the one in US. If I buy books from the US account, I cannot access them on my Japanese Kindle and vice-versa. Japan doesn't have Kindle for PC, so even if I install the English version, cannot access my Japanese account on it.
Recently, there was even a pathetic talk about being able to join Japanese and US accounts, but I never saw the advantage to the customer and even the customer sale guy couldn't explain it to me, so I never did.
Bottom line, you just have to create a new account on Amazon US, no big deal. Actually, I'm under the impression you just have to sign in?...

[theducks]

Originally Posted by FinancialWar

I legally download books, books without copyright. You know the really old ones from project Gutenberg.

SOMEONE compensated (paid) those Authors (sometimes, not fairly . Hollywood accounting existed long before movies ).

It was just a long time ago.

Some folk have inflated ideas on how much their repackaging ([of PD books] efforts are worth.

[Lazybones]

My pricing complaint has to do with the long tail of eBook publishing. I'm willing to pay top dollar for a new book from an author I like, but it takes a really long time for the price to drop. I was looking at Amazon for some older fantasy/sci-fi books (20-30 years since original publication, in some cases), and the publisher was still asking $5-8 for the eBook. I think that publishers need to start looking at the model that Steam pioneered for video games, where older items are extremely deeply discounted during occasional sales. I have read several stories that suggest they more than make up in volume what they lose in per-item price. There's a ton of stuff I would likely pick up if it was in the "impulse buy" range of a buck a title.

[hoichi]

Originally Posted by Lazybones

My pricing complaint has to do with the long tail of eBook publishing. I'm willing to pay top dollar for a new book from an author I like, but it takes a really long time for the price to drop. I was looking at Amazon for some older fantasy/sci-fi books (20-30 years since original publication, in some cases), and the publisher was still asking $5-8 for the eBook. I think that publishers need to start looking at the model that Steam pioneered for video games, where older items are extremely deeply discounted during occasional sales. I have read several stories that suggest they more than make up in volume what they lose in per-item price. There's a ton of stuff I would likely pick up if it was in the "impulse buy" range of a buck a title.

I think the sellers are afraid that a lot of people will buy a lot of sci-fi or other classics cheap and their net sales will drop.
Games are a bit different, I think. Yes, a lot people buy a lot of old gems at Steam or GOG.com, but if we're talking AAA mainstream genre titles, modern games are obviously more attractive, if only for graphics and animation alone. Whereas books don't benefit that way from advances in technology, so the pressure from the older, well-established works is much stronger.

[HarryT]

Pricing books at $1 is completely undervaluing the inherent worth of the product, to my mind. I have no objection whatsoever to paying $5 for a 20-yo book.

[hoichi]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Pricing books at $1 is completely undervaluing the inherent worth of the product, to my mind. I have no objection whatsoever to paying $5 for a 20-yo book.

Me neither. If it's a good book I might end up reading it a few times and get close to 100 hours or more out of it. But even a measly 10 hours worth of pleasant reading for 5 bucks is not too shabby.
Of course, you could run into a bad book not worth reading even once, but one could argue the odds of that happening are even higher with the modern titles. Should they be priced less for that reason? Work from the bottom until they prove themselves?

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Lazybones

My pricing complaint has to do with the long tail of eBook publishing. I'm willing to pay top dollar for a new book from an author I like, but it takes a really long time for the price to drop. I was looking at Amazon for some older fantasy/sci-fi books (20-30 years since original publication, in some cases), and the publisher was still asking $5-8 for the eBook.

Well, the cost for producing and sell the ebook is probably much higher than for a 20-30 years old ebook that was an ebook from the beginning.

There are older sf and fantasy books that are re-issued in differernt series like the Fantasy Masterwork series and you do not expect them to be cheaper. So it should depend on the book if it is cheap or not. A classic that will sell will not be cheap and why should it be cheap?

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Lazybones

My pricing complaint has to do with the long tail of eBook publishing.
.

The problem is, with ebooks the long tail is where the profits (and author royalties) lie. The reason ebooks can be priced low in the first place is because they don't have to pay for themselves over the 3 month release window or be deemed a failure (with all that implies for the author's future prospects).

The long tail means publishers have to stop their current pbook inspired pricing practices, which are based on a big sales spike near launch followed by removal from many is not most bookstores, returns, and then a tiny trickle of sales until the print run is exhausted. It *also* means consumers need to give up the expectation of massive time-based ebook list price drops. A twenty year old ebook you haven't read is no different than a 20 day-old recent release as long as both are appropriately priced in the first place.

One forward-thinking publisher of note has a simple ebook pricing policy: ebooks are list priced at $9.99 while/if the pbook edition is a hard cover, $6.99 if/when there is a paperback edition. Retailers get to discount from there but the list price doesn't change with time.

As we move forward into the ebook era the bulk of author earnings are going to come from the long tail simply because, even for tradpub titles, the launch window spike is going to decline drastically as print runs and shelf space decline and buyers' habits and mindset change to adjust to the always-in-print model. The urgency to buy an interesting book before it goes out of print or becomes hard to find will be replaced by adding titles to wishlists and just-in-time buying when you're ready to read. It already is happening and has been happening for five years.

The only relevant question for ebook pricing is: how does it compare to its genre peers? If it is a tradpub SF title, the bulk of its peers (regardless of publishing date) will run between $4 and $10 and average about $7. Romance titles may average lower, litfic titles higher, but comparisons should be oranges to oranges.

[hoichi]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

The problem is, with ebooks the long tail is where the profits (and author royalties) lie. The reason ebooks can be priced low in the first place is because they don't have to pay for themselves over the 3 month release window or be deemed a failure (with all that implies for the author's future prospects).
...

I wonder if the longer tail means the publishers will become more cautious and risk-aversive, like movie studious, preferring to bet on sure hits. Or try to pay less to authors upfront, еffectively being a 'thinner' intermediate and getting a writer closer to self-publishing.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by hoichi

I wonder if the longer tail means the publishers will become more cautious and risk-aversive, like movie studious, preferring to bet on sure hits. Or try to pay less to authors upfront, еffectively being a 'thinner' intermediate and getting a writer closer to self-publishing.

Even less.

Everything you say is happening. Has been happening since the giant multinationals took over in the 80's. It is "merely" getting increasingly worse.
They outsourced most of their services. And fired the inhouse staff.
They reduced advances. And reduced effective royalties. And laid claim to even more book rights.
They pour money into a few pre-designated "bestsellers" and starve everything else.
They need to satisfy their HQ beancounters in NY, London, Paris, Germany, etc. As long as they meet their numbers they get to keep their glass tower offices and high salaries. At least until the next merger.

As long as they keep finding willing takers for their predatory contracts, the corporate publishers will keep on squeezing until they stream of submitters starts to dry up.
Which isn't just yet.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

They reduced advances. And reduced effective royalties. And laid claim to even more book rights.
They pour money into a few pre-designated "bestsellers" and starve everything else.

It's the "few bestsellers" that finance everything else. Most books that are commercially published don't make back their advance.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by HarryT

It's the "few bestsellers" that finance everything else. Most books that are commercially published don't make back their advance.

No support = no sales.
A lot of those midlist failures do just fine when reverted to the author.
That 3 month launch window doesn't allow for books to build up a reputation through reader reviews or word of mouth. It is sink or swim and it is hardly shocking that most titles sink.

Now, the logical next step, of course, is for the BPHs to stop even trying to produce books from authors, franchises, and sub-genres that aren't surefire bestsellers. There's enough established authors and celebrities floating around that this is an effective strategy.

Disney is, in fact, doing just that; they palmed off Hyperion and staff so they can focus on milking corporate franchises. Pearson got rid of Penguin to focus on education and academia; no need to deal with fickle unpredictable consumers, just staid, predictable bureaucrats.

The big boys will do fine; they'll find a way to survive without trade books.

[theducks]

Originally Posted by HarryT

It's the "few bestsellers" that finance everything else. Most books that are commercially published don't make back their advance.

Then why are the advances so big?
With smaller advances, the royalty checks should just start sooner.

Or is it ...
When there is a 'Winner', the publishers keep a lions share?