In AMERICAN English.. OK or Okay? - Page 2

tompe · 09-19-2013, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhadin

For American usage, the "bible" today is Garner's Modern American Usage. Professional editors rely on its guidance and Bryan Garner is affiliated with many of the leading language resources, including the Chicago Manual of Style.

Garner's Modern American Usage (3rd ed. 2009) states (p. 588):

Bottom line is either is acceptable although one will predominate based on context.

How can O.K. be OK? The guide I read explicitly said O.K. is wrong since it is not an abbreviation of two word.

VydorScope · 09-19-2013, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tompe

How can O.K. be OK? The guide I read explicitly said O.K. is wrong since it is not an abbreviation of two word.

Actually it might be. All though the history of the work is not certain, one contender is that it is short for "all correct" which was spelled as "Oll Korrect" or even "Ole Kurreck" by many people in the mid-1800's who were not exactly as literate as general population is today.

Whether or not that history is correct is unknown. There are several other contenders such as a political campaign (OK was initials of the guy running) and Choctaw (Native American tribe) word (okeh). So in short, no one knows

So that is why O.K. can be okay

doubleshuffle · 09-19-2013, 07:56 AM

Always thought it was "m'kay". Shouldn't learn foreign languages from cartoons...

samhy · 09-19-2013, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VydorScope

Actually it might be. All though the history of the work is not certain, one contender is that it is short for "all correct" which was spelled as "Oll Korrect" or even "Ole Kurreck" by many people in the mid-1800's who were not exactly as literate as general population is today.

Whether or not that history is correct is unknown. There are several other contenders such as a political campaign (OK was initials of the guy running) and Choctaw (Native American tribe) word (okeh). So in short, no one knows

So that is why O.K. can be okay

I've always thought it was coming from "zero killed" -> 0 Killed -> O.K.

Pulpmeister · 09-19-2013, 11:12 PM

First appeared in popular print--the US press-- as 'O.K.' It is an abbreviation, but not of 'okay'. The "Oll Korrect" version of its origin is most likely the real one, as it first surfaced in print as fad wordplay in the first half of the 19th century in north-east USA. The game was to come up with improbable abbreviations through jocular mis-spellings. There were quite a few other similarly derived abbreviations, but they died out. It was then reinforced by a political campaign where O.K. was part of the slogan. It never died after that, and the 'okay' version is in effect a phonetic spelling-out of the word.

An analagous example is snafu. It is an acronym, one of many which arose in WW2 using the letters 'fu'. They have all faded away except snafu (although fubar lingers as a barely visible ghost).

I'm inclined to doubt the liklihood of Choctaw (okeh), which has quite a different meaning, or Scottish (och aye), which means 'oh yes' as the origin. O K doesn't have a clear path of propagation from these sources.

You can doubtless find words/phrases sounding very much like "okay" in several other languages, but the NE USA fad wordplay origin fits the proven growth pattern of "OK/okay" usage.

Not that it matters. Both are historically correct, and usage would depend on context. My own instinct, specially in dialogue, would be to go with okay, and in narrative, for consistency, stick with okay.

A character might easily use OK, and so would the author, if it is quoting say a hastily scribbled note by a character--or a text message. Whether you do it as O. K. with spaces, O.K. without, or just OK, is a matter of choice.

You could of course use "okelly dokelly"....

Anna Drake · 09-21-2013, 11:32 AM

Fascinating discussion. Especially the word history part. You can put me down as in the okay camp. It blends in better with all of the lower case words around it, IMHO.

gmw · 09-22-2013, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anna Drake

Fascinating discussion. Especially the word history part. You can put me down as in the okay camp. It blends in better with all of the lower case words around it, IMHO.

Definitely this. I see "OK" and think: what's Oklahoma got to do with it? And I'm not even American. (Okay, so that's a bit of an exaggeration, but still close.)

I'd also add that there can be a contextual aspect to this. Some people talk in abbreviations, or in abrupt syllables, so there are some places where I might use "OK" to emphasise how it is said."

Canuck_in_Japan · 09-22-2013, 03:25 AM

The way I see it, OK is acceptable in a single word sentence.
For example, "Let's go to the movies tonight!" "OK".
However, it is not okay to use in a full sentence like the one you have just read.
That's just my own personal feeling though. I don't expect anyone to agree with me.

GlenBarrington · 09-22-2013, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canuck_in_Japan

That's just my own personal feeling though. I don't expect anyone to agree with me.

That's funny, I expect EVERYONE to agree with me. And those who don't, should probably re-examine their lives to figure out where they went wrong.

QuicksilverKite · 01-21-2014, 05:33 AM

Either spelling is fine, the key is consistency through-out the manuscript.

MichelleLouring · 01-21-2014, 06:37 AM

I never write OK, since it bugs me, but it's entirely my own personal opinion. I see 'okay' as a word, not an abbreviation(which it originally was).
I'm pretty sure they are both technically correct.

Bilbo1967 · 01-21-2014, 07:16 AM

Looks like I'm in the minority, but I always prefer 'OK'. 'Okay' just looks weird to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuicksilverKite

Either spelling is fine, the key is consistency through-out the manuscript.

I think that QuicksilverKite has it right though. Use whichever variant takes your fancy (they're both understood), just do it consistently.

HarryT · 01-21-2014, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bilbo1967

Looks like I'm in the minority, but I always prefer 'OK'. 'Okay' just looks weird to me.

Perhaps a British/US English thing? "OK" looks right to me, too.

Barbara1955 · 01-21-2014, 10:25 AM

I think it would depend on how its being used. Normal conversation Okay Non sentance but quicker answer OK

Lemurion · 01-21-2014, 03:53 PM

Quick check of my references indicates either "OK" or "okay" is fine, but no guides I've found support "Okay," with the word spelled out and an initial capital, except at the beginning of a sentence.

Hope that helps.

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09-19-2013, 07:56 AM	#18
doubleshuffle Unicycle Daredevil Posts: 13,944 Karma: 185432100 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Planet of the Pudding Brains Device: Aura HD (R.I.P. After six years the USB socket died.) tolino shine 3	Always thought it was "m'kay". Shouldn't learn foreign languages from cartoons...

09-19-2013, 11:12 PM	#20
Pulpmeister Wizard Posts: 2,822 Karma: 29145056 Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Perth Western Australia Device: kindle	First appeared in popular print--the US press-- as 'O.K.' It is an abbreviation, but not of 'okay'. The "Oll Korrect" version of its origin is most likely the real one, as it first surfaced in print as fad wordplay in the first half of the 19th century in north-east USA. The game was to come up with improbable abbreviations through jocular mis-spellings. There were quite a few other similarly derived abbreviations, but they died out. It was then reinforced by a political campaign where O.K. was part of the slogan. It never died after that, and the 'okay' version is in effect a phonetic spelling-out of the word. An analagous example is snafu. It is an acronym, one of many which arose in WW2 using the letters 'fu'. They have all faded away except snafu (although fubar lingers as a barely visible ghost). I'm inclined to doubt the liklihood of Choctaw (okeh), which has quite a different meaning, or Scottish (och aye), which means 'oh yes' as the origin. O K doesn't have a clear path of propagation from these sources. You can doubtless find words/phrases sounding very much like "okay" in several other languages, but the NE USA fad wordplay origin fits the proven growth pattern of "OK/okay" usage. Not that it matters. Both are historically correct, and usage would depend on context. My own instinct, specially in dialogue, would be to go with okay, and in narrative, for consistency, stick with okay. A character might easily use OK, and so would the author, if it is quoting say a hastily scribbled note by a character--or a text message. Whether you do it as O. K. with spaces, O.K. without, or just OK, is a matter of choice. You could of course use "okelly dokelly"....

09-21-2013, 11:32 AM	#21
Anna Drake Zealot Posts: 104 Karma: 2175016 Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: rural Illinois, USA Device: Kindle	Fascinating discussion. Especially the word history part. You can put me down as in the okay camp. It blends in better with all of the lower case words around it, IMHO.

09-22-2013, 03:25 AM	#23
Canuck_in_Japan Wizard Posts: 1,476 Karma: 14328611 Join Date: May 2009 Location: Tokyo, Japan Device: Aura, Aura H2O, Kindle PW3	The way I see it, OK is acceptable in a single word sentence. For example, "Let's go to the movies tonight!" "OK". However, it is not okay to use in a full sentence like the one you have just read. That's just my own personal feeling though. I don't expect anyone to agree with me.

01-21-2014, 05:33 AM	#25
QuicksilverKite Junior Member Posts: 1 Karma: 10 Join Date: Jan 2014 Device: kindle	Either spelling is fine, the key is consistency through-out the manuscript.

01-21-2014, 06:37 AM	#26
MichelleLouring Owl Lady Posts: 34 Karma: 23716 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Denmark Device: Android Tablet	I never write OK, since it bugs me, but it's entirely my own personal opinion. I see 'okay' as a word, not an abbreviation(which it originally was). I'm pretty sure they are both technically correct.

01-21-2014, 10:25 AM	#29
Barbara1955 Non-Techy Posts: 4,455 Karma: 15499273 Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: WV---USA Device: Samsung Cell Phone & Amazon Fires & Kobo eReaders	I think it would depend on how its being used. Normal conversation Okay Non sentance but quicker answer OK

01-21-2014, 03:53 PM	#30
Lemurion eReader Posts: 2,750 Karma: 4968470 Join Date: Aug 2007 Device: Note 5; PW3; Nook HD+; ChuWi Hi12; iPad	Quick check of my references indicates either "OK" or "okay" is fine, but no guides I've found support "Okay," with the word spelled out and an initial capital, except at the beginning of a sentence. Hope that helps.