Kobo - We need to have a talk

Originally Posted by Cottser

then there's clearly not enough testing going on.

It's funny reading this and similar comments in this forum. When Kobo had a longer update cycle so that they could fully test what they were changing they kept being "slagged-off" for taking to long. Now they get "slagged-off" for releasing early and releasing often with the inevitable side-effect of bugs.

[kiwipippa]

Originally Posted by Cottser

... there's clearly not enough testing going on.

Yes, when you release a product in a new country, then discover that no one can set that product up, well, someone missed a fairly basic test....

[Cottser]

Originally Posted by shall1028

It's funny reading this and similar comments in this forum. When Kobo had a longer update cycle so that they could fully test what they were changing they kept being "slagged-off" for taking to long. Now they get "slagged-off" for releasing early and releasing often with the inevitable side-effect of bugs.

I can live with the bugs, I applied to be a beta tester. Users who are less technically inclined or just less patient aren't going to be quite as forgiving.

[cgromte]

The question is WHY do the devices have so many issues? Yeah it's great that they follow up but it seems the things are never stable. It's one fix after another. Far more than the competition it seems. I'd like to try a KT but don't want to risk having the issues so many seem to. At some point a device and it's firmware should be stable over the masses. Kobo reminds me of some Nokia phones that never work "right". They are always fixing bugs...I have had those phones and it was a headache. If other companies can make their phones and e-readers work I don't see why these can't.

[ejav4]

Hello Kobo,

I agree with the above poster.

Unfortunately, my Kobo auto-updated when I purchased something from the Kobo store; sadly, it now freezes often, requires resets and basically, doesn't perform anywhere nearly as well with the older 18 series firmware. BTW, both my husband and I have our separate Kobo Touches, and they both
have problems now, with the update.

I don't know if this has anything to do with it, but the problems seem amplified with the insertion of a micro SD card; then, if I remove the micro SD card, it improves, but isn't the point being able to have a microSD card inserted to given you choice? So I took out the microSD but, it still hangs
and won't update the turned corner and freezes then crashes.

If I could load an older version firmware (without the language options would be good, I don't need them), most of the problems would be gone.

I just want my old, reliable, basic reader back. I really loved it, but it just isn't the same now.

[moffattm]

Originally Posted by cgromte

The question is WHY do the devices have so many issues? Yeah it's great that they follow up but it seems the things are never stable. It's one fix after another. Far more than the competition it seems. I'd like to try a KT but don't want to risk having the issues so many seem to. At some point a device and it's firmware should be stable over the masses. Kobo reminds me of some Nokia phones that never work "right". They are always fixing bugs...I have had those phones and it was a headache. If other companies can make their phones and e-readers work I don't see why these can't.

Just for kicks I had a look at the Kindle forum on here to see if the grass really is greener on the other side. I found people having the following problems:

Kindle keeps reindexing books which runs the battery down fast
WiFi issues
Bricked Kindle
Books vanishing
Can't see files on the Kindle through Windows
Kindle been black-listed

This was just in the first few pages of the Kindle forum. Admittedly some of these problems were user created and easily fixed, but I think that you can't really say that nobody every has a problem with a Kindle.

[HarleyB]

I think all ereaders have issues.
My original Kobo has suffered "impact damage" - a techie way of saying my daughter dropped it and now it is dead!
As Kobos are impossible to buy in Australia I have been considering the new Sony but a quick read of the Sony forum and I thought I was on the Kobo forum!
Lots of complains and questions about Sony rushing the release and that the new PRS-T1 wasn't stable.

The grass is always greener on the other side - until you get there.

[moffattm]

Originally Posted by HarleyB

The grass is always greener on the other side - until you get there.

Definitely agree with you there!

I don't know how often Sony, Amazon, etc issue updates, but in the past I've been stuck with buggy hardware/software that hasn't been quickly fixed because the company insisted that they only issue updates once every six months. So I for one am very happy that Kobo at least are being quick with their updates!

Also, coming from a programming background myself, I fully understand the difficulties Kobo faces in testing their updates. There are just so many variables involved that there is bound to be a few problems that slip through the testing process.

[thp1017]

Originally Posted by Cottser

... then there's clearly not enough testing going on.

and testing software is very hard to do, let alone hardware, I'd imagine. I worked on a project a few years back, where my tester, or later the users came back saying different pieces didn't work quite right, or were buggy, whatever. I tried and tried to reproduce the error, and oftentimes simply couldn't.

When I went to sit down with the users, though, they were clicking things out of order, or had extra clicks, or something that, to me, wasn't a logical step in performing the specified task. Testers can often catch a lot of these types of bugs, but I'd imagine even they get proficient enough with a system that they don't get the errors that are showing up after an update is released.

I guess for me, the moral of the story is to include as much information as possible when you send a bug report to kobo... if it is something really obnoxious, I'd be tempted to back up my kobo (everything, incl the sqlite database), do a factory reset, update the firmware, then drop the troublesome book or books on the device, then send whatever steps I took to get the error to kobo, along with the books in question - that should make it easier for them to reproduce the error.

[moffattm]

Originally Posted by thp1017

... I guess for me, the moral of the story is to include as much information as possible when you send a bug report to kobo ...

Exactly. Testing is quite an art form and it's essential that the tester is able to tell the developer the exact steps they used before they encountered the error, even if they think they are totally unrelated. Those double page taps you're seeing may have something to do with the fact you were using the browser 5 minutes earlier, but unless you tell the developer everything you've done leading up to the problem he can't follow the trail.

And the description of the error is important too. Simply saying "Can't open book" isn't very helpful. The developer wants to know exactly what happens when you try to open the book; does it come up with an error message and if so what is it, does the book open and then close straight away, does the power light flash to indicate that the reader is doing something but then nothing happens? All of these may give the developer the clue he needs to track down the bug.

In the time that I've spent supporting my own software I've lost count of the number of times I get a bug report that simply says "It doesn't work". Not very helpful at all!

[baronrus]

Originally Posted by cyvros

One of the issues is that the problems are often internal and not influenced by stuff like the e-books themselves or SD cards. The storage error hit a lot of us not using SD cards, but also those who were (I only started using an SD card because of the storage error resulting in a wipe). The text cut-off wasn't consistent. Some books had it, some didn't, and nobody I saw could figure out whether there was some trigger in the book's format or content.

It would be easier to accept the various issues if it weren't for the fact that it's a single platform with a single set of hardware, often malfunctioning all by itself.

(Man, now I'm getting all negative. I would like to note that yes, I still love my Kobo, even though it doesn't remember all my reading stats anymore.)

Although it is a single platform I would be interested to know how many people are getting thier books form 'dodgy' sources. I realize that some (or perhaps many) of the issues are related to the kobo firmware. But at least some of the issues are also realted to users getting their books from dodgy sources.

[moffattm]

Originally Posted by baronrus

Although it is a single platform I would be interested to know how many people are getting thier books form 'dodgy' sources. I realize that some (or perhaps many) of the issues are related to the kobo firmware. But at least some of the issues are also realted to users getting their books from dodgy sources.

I've seen several people mention 'dodgy sources' on this forum being the cause of problems, but I'm not sure I see the connection between pirated ebooks and having problems with your e-reader.

EPUB's are basically just XHTML files. I can understand that a corrupted file or a poorly put together file may cause problems for the e-reader, just as a poorly put together HTML file can sometimes display fine in one browser but not in another. But even ebooks from legit sources can become corrupted, and we all know that even big publishers can skimp on testing their ebooks on various devices and create ebooks that are broken or that work on one device but have problems on another.

I don't think that 'dodgy sources' are any worse at creating good ebooks than legit sources. And I would imagine that 'dodgy sources' probably just make available for free the exact same files that legit sources are charging for. Or am I wrong in this assumption? Do they instead create the ebooks from scratch (which seems like a lot of work to me)??

And just to make it perfectly clear, I in no way condone pirating ebooks. While I may disagree with greedy publisher practices I think that authors should definitely earn a decent return on their hard work!

[Dimwit]

What I'd really like to see is a plain jane version that's archived somewhere. Lose a lot of the fripperies and extras. Just a solid working version. It would be nice to be able to go back and reset to a base and then upgrade or not.

What are everyone's "must haves" for their reading pleasure? Mine would be the ability to change fonts, sizing and leading and a library utility. That's it. No prizes/awards, Reading Life, browsing or even a dictionary or notepad if that upsets the stability.

I can't speak for anyone else, since I switched to stripping DRM from all my purchases before I got my Touch, but I'm using legit books I've mostly purchased from Kobo (some of the remainder from Amazon and stripped/converted, some from DRM-free stores).

[baronrus]

Originally Posted by moffattm

I've seen several people mention 'dodgy sources' on this forum being the cause of problems, but I'm not sure I see the connection between pirated ebooks and having problems with your e-reader.

EPUB's are basically just XHTML files. I can understand that a corrupted file or a poorly put together file may cause problems for the e-reader, just as a poorly put together HTML file can sometimes display fine in one browser but not in another. But even ebooks from legit sources can become corrupted, and we all know that even big publishers can skimp on testing their ebooks on various devices and create ebooks that are broken or that work on one device but have problems on another.

I don't think that 'dodgy sources' are any worse at creating good ebooks than legit sources. And I would imagine that 'dodgy sources' probably just make available for free the exact same files that legit sources are charging for. Or am I wrong in this assumption? Do they instead create the ebooks from scratch (which seems like a lot of work to me)??

And just to make it perfectly clear, I in no way condone pirating ebooks. While I may disagree with greedy publisher practices I think that authors should definitely earn a decent return on their hard work!

when I say dodgy I mean books that you download from some torrent site that may have been in a different format initially and converted who knows how. I dont know if that is the source of some of the problems people are having but I do know that I have been beta testing since the first updates to the kobo touch and with the exception of the line cut of problem in the last release (now fixed for me) I did not run into anyof the problems that others have been reporing (edit I do get the double tap issue from time to time). but by and large my KT has worked very well with minimal issues and the issues that it has had have ben either fixed or are unobtrusive.

When I had the line cut off issue I only noticed it in some books?

I will also add that by 'dodgy' I really meant poor quality, poorly formated or potentially corrupted epubs irrespective of where they came from. I guess I am assuming that when you buy a book from kobo or amazon or whereever that the quality issues would be minimized but perhaps that is not a good assumption.