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Old 06-21-2017, 10:49 AM   #1
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Question amazon families, households etc

so there is the family thing for sharing kindle books - 2 adults 4 children, various hoops to jump thorough and restrictions to understand
seems to be defined very similarly to how amzon households is defined for sharing prime benefits....
two consenting adults link their accounts and cannot "re-marry" for 180 days . menage a trois are not catered for ...

but now there's amazon unlimited music family deal ( their anything spotify can do we can do better deal ? )
this says 6 people over 13 can play- no definition of family anywhere that I can find ( so does my Married daughter living with her husband get to join ?, and my distant cousin twice removed... )
and the rules say that anyone of the 6 can shop , for digital goods, 1 click ,on the shared payment method. [ which seems insane - I have trolled them with questions about how to stop a 14 year old buying that m***r-f*****g rap music or some 18R videos but I doubt they'll answer ]

£15 pm for unlimited music content for 6 looks attractive, but managing it looks nightmarish.
The parental control on amazon devices would give some protection but on a PC any accidental , non refundable purchase is only 1 click away. And there's no 7 days to change your mind, like with Kindle books

anyone have any real life experience of the service. which is on offer in both USA and UK
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Old 06-21-2017, 11:27 AM   #2
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Now this is strictly my opinion, but if you can't trust someone not to misuse the account, do not give them access.
My oldest daughter, I would share with. The boy and youngest daughter, no way would I give either one of them access to my Amazon.
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Old 06-21-2017, 12:51 PM   #3
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I got some answers from amazon.
1.Family is anyone I say is family. That is good.

2.Purchases can only be made via the music app,says the reply, but that seems to contradict stuff written elsewhere

3. Device limits is ten per user so sixty total. that is plenty

4. The shared payment card has to be the one I allocate for I click generally. I can work with that. I don't use one click normally so could set up account with two cards. Use one for physical goods, assign the other to one click

That is probably enough info to survey the family, plus I will poke around the music app to see how easy it might be to accidentally buy, not stream
where it scores over the alternative spotify family - is the far better alexa integration, so it may depend on how many echoes we get. 1 echo so far, plus a just ordered dot.

really , when you think its about the cost of 1 , maybe 2 ,full price CDs per month, it is ridiculously cheap.

now if you could have any 6 users on a shared Kindle library plan - where do I sign up

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Old 06-21-2017, 04:06 PM   #4
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4) Amazon insists on having a card on file for one-click.
What I do is have a (now voided *) card number on file.
That way, if I or anyone else tries to buy something with my one-click account feature, I get an e-mail asking me to update my payment info.

That does slow down the one-click process by a request and a reply to the 'please change payment' e-mail, but it gives me positive control of any charges made to my account by one-click.

* The card was valid when I listed it, so it would pass their card checks.
Then a day or two later, I called my bank and ask them to issue a new card number for my 'lost' card.
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Old 06-21-2017, 04:16 PM   #5
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Very smart.
I had looked into voiding a card by altering it's expiry date but systems do not allow that field to be edited
.
I quit amazon seller program in a sulk this month over them mandating 2 step verification to loginto it, and I wanted to invalidate the payment method on my way out the door but no joy
.funny part of that was we,d swapped several support ticket messages, me refusing to buy an sms device and saying close the account instead ,if sms is now going to be mandatory, Eventually some guy agreed to close the seller account , & wrote " it has been an absolute pleasure to help you today",& I think he was being serious, not sarcastic.
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Old 06-21-2017, 05:08 PM   #6
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Very smart.
I had looked into voiding a card by altering it's expiry date but systems do not allow that field to be edited
.
I quit amazon seller program in a sulk this month over them mandating 2 step verification to loginto it, and I wanted to invalidate the payment method on my way out the door but no joy
.funny part of that was we,d swapped several support ticket messages, me refusing to buy an sms device and saying close the account instead ,if sms is now going to be mandatory, Eventually some guy agreed to close the seller account , & wrote " it has been an absolute pleasure to help you today",& I think he was being serious, not sarcastic.
Well, at least you exited your seller account voluntarily. I haven't listed anything in an age, I'm an occasional seller at best, but I was thinking of starting to sell books on Amazon again, tried to log in to find my seller account with 100% positive feedback was POOF, gone.

And never even an email with a warning that not listing for a while would cause my seller account to vanish into thin air.




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Old 06-22-2017, 12:59 AM   #7
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->knc1
i looked at my payment and 1 click settings
I entered another card - a valid card but i fudged the expiry date to next month, as a test
but amazon UK wants me to associate a card with each address on file
I don't see an option for use this card if its 1 click and that card if its not
for each address I can toggle show / do not show 1 click in drop down methods but I doubt that is any use for digital purchases where the is no send to addresss needed or asked for
last time I bought a kindle book there was no who is it for/ is it a gift or how would you like to pay - it was buy now -> done.
& last time I asked, amazon UK does not have a buy as gift option on kindlebooks . I wanted to buy one for a grand-daughter to go to her mother's device but I was not allowed to
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Old 06-22-2017, 01:10 AM   #8
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Well, at least you exited your seller account voluntarily. I haven't listed anything in an age, I'm an occasional seller at best, but I was thinking of starting to sell books on Amazon again, tried to log in to find my seller account with 100% positive feedback was POOF, gone.

And never even an email with a warning that not listing for a while would cause my seller account to vanish into thin air.




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i argued that I'd been an occasional seller for 15 years, and it was stupid to from july 1st demand an sms code whenever I logged in, but no.. wife has sms and texts all the time but on principle I will not do it

I fight my grumpy old crusty / losing luddite battles over having to adopt sms, having to have contactless payment on my credit cards, and other irksome "improvements to life" that I don't want or need, but more and more financial sites are now insisting on sms based security features
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Old 06-22-2017, 09:16 AM   #9
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- - - - -
more and more financial sites are now insisting on sms based security features
That is only "warm and fuzzy security" features.
Since sms is not encrypted for transmission.
It could be. *

In fact, voice is often not encrypted, although it can be.
That just depends on how cheap your cell phone and your service provider is.

- - - -

* Which gives the financial institution "plausible deniability" if you suffer a loss based on something they send via sms.
I.E:
Not their fault, it is the fault of (pick one or more):
Your service provider (not encrypting sms when they could have),
Your cell 'phone (not supporting encrypted sms because it is too cheap a model)
Your fault (you picked the cell 'phone and the service provider)

And who in the world ever thought a cell 'phone was a secure repository of sensitive information?
It isn't, it can't be, unless physically secured by the owner (which makes it sort of hard to use - unless you can get into the safe in time to answer the call).

The basic of basics:
"No computer system of security can exist when the computer system is itself physical insecure."

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Old 06-22-2017, 10:05 AM   #10
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i know we are drifting off topic, but what I object to with those sites is the design assumption that everyone has/wants a cell phone ( as you americans call them ) so it's ok to design a system that locks out the morons and luddites who are holding out. As customers , they are obviously not worth having. I had a huge row with Brit institution J Sainsbury when they implied that I'd need a mobile in future to get my money back out of their savings account.... when there was not such requirement for putting the money in

same goes for contactless credit cards, why assume that everyone needs to be able to wave their card at a barman to pay for drinks, or are so time starved that they cannot spare 4 seconds to type in a PIN....
rant over
have to go, there are Looms to smash.....
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Old 06-22-2017, 11:36 AM   #11
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i argued that I'd been an occasional seller for 15 years, and it was stupid to from july 1st demand an sms code whenever I logged in, but no.. wife has sms and texts all the time but on principle I will not do it

I fight my grumpy old crusty / losing luddite battles over having to adopt sms, having to have contactless payment on my credit cards, and other irksome "improvements to life" that I don't want or need, but more and more financial sites are now insisting on sms based security features
I finally got a smartphone just over a year ago, so I could've dealt with the SMS requirement. Now, though, I'm annoyed. It's a heck of a way to treat a good seller with never a claim against my account! Worked hard for the feedback I had.



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Old 06-22-2017, 12:03 PM   #12
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I finally got a smartphone just over a year ago, so I could've dealt with the SMS requirement. Now, though, I'm annoyed. It's a heck of a way to treat a good seller with never a claim against my account! Worked hard for the feedback I had.



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My stepdad got my mom a smartphone back in March. So far, she is very good at misplacing it and running the battery down. No, she really didn't want one.
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Old 06-22-2017, 12:15 PM   #13
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i know we are drifting off topic, but what I object to with those sites is the design assumption that everyone has/wants a cell phone
. . . . .
Same here.
I gave up using cell 'phones back in '84 for very good (for me) reasons.

It is at least a generation or two, too early to presume that everyone has one.
Once all of the baby boomers die off....
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Old 06-22-2017, 03:37 PM   #14
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It is at least a generation or two, too early to presume that everyone has one.
Once all of the baby boomers die off....
Also once the entire world has cellphone coverage. Right now there are places in the UK only a few miles outside major tourist towns with no coverage at all...
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Old 06-23-2017, 02:40 AM   #15
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Also once the entire world has cellphone coverage. Right now there are places in the UK only a few miles outside major tourist towns with no coverage at all...
Perhaps worth noting, though, that you don't need a mobile phone. You can send an SMS to a landline (in the U.K., at least) and it'll speak it to you. Two-factor authentication is a very good idea, from a security perspective.
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