Future of PDF format

[webroot]

Does anybody sees a good future of PDF?, some have claimed that PDF is the best format for data archiving or general purpose e document storage, it may be true but not sure how they support this statement.

PDFs are still the best for paper printing but now they are in decline. Other than printing they seem to have little usefulness. It awful when I try to read books on mobile devices scroll every-line and zoom. They contain just drawing instructions, totally incompatible with other formats, text selection or search not easily possible. Some items like Tables and list do not export to other format at all.

Still one area when I see their importance when we need to save web pages, or some form of rasterized visual data their inbuilt security is good but now fixed layout epubs are catching up and they show math formula can hold images fonts and styles in a single file still there is lack of fine grained control but it may nit be desirable is many cases.

[Terisa de morgan]

I don't see a professional environment (business, engineering and so on) sending offers, specifications and so on, when a no modification approach is needed, sending epub format.

[webroot]

Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan

I don't see a professional environment (business, engineering and so on) sending offers, specifications and so on, when a no modification approach is needed, sending epub format.

Thats where it holds ground, today when many of those professionals try to open spec doc on their cell phones they will have tough time, one reason for epub not being used is first they cannot be produced quickly and second there is no good fixed layout reader at the moment but apart from that should pdf be used for books?

[WillAdams]

Let me know when you can do an ePub w/ the animations and other special features of http://motionmountain.net/

[webroot]

Originally Posted by WillAdams

Let me know when you can do an ePub w/ the animations and other special features of http://motionmountain.net/

Perhaps these animations are embedded flash objects and now flash support is dropping from browsers engines (aka epub renderer), but there are other better ways for supporting animation here with all that html5 and javascript stuffs but not yet fully supported. so from my angle your question boils down to absence of good epub reader.

[faltradl]

Where are your problems? PDF ist one world an ebooks is an other. The fact epub etc. is better for ebooks is no reason to damn PDF. You say by yourself: "PDFs are still the best for paper printing." And for archiving, when you must submit paper with files. Then of course PDF/A.

[ManDay]

I don't think PDFs do any good, at all. In my opinion, PDFs are to document formats what MS Windows is to operating systems. Long deprecated, dysfunctional, and only around because society is too rigid to change and embrace better alternatives. On top of that, PDF (which I wouldn't say of Windows, despite being a great opponent of it) are ill-designed from the start.

I don't see any purpose for PDFs, not even the excuses you mention. If you want to store an arbitrary mix of pictures and text, use vectorgraphics, if you really must, but not PDFs.

PDFs are an awful way to convey content. The only thing that's probably worse is if you store your document as a BMP file. PDFs should never have been intended for long term use. They served a useful purpose as a transitory document format until someone would come up with something real. People came up with real, semantic document (markup) languages a long time ago (HTML, EPUB). PDF should have died at this point, but unfortunally, it stuck around. Even worse, it became so popular that semantically meaningul formats are nowadays converted into PDFs just because people expect PDFs.

[markom]

Originally Posted by webroot

...

PDFs are still the best for paper printing but now they are in decline. Other than printing they seem to have little usefulness. It awful when I try to read books on mobile devices scroll every-line and zoom. They contain just drawing instructions, totally incompatible with other formats, text selection or search not easily possible. Some items like Tables and list do not export to other format at all.

....

Get your non-searchable 500-600 page pdf into an Adobe Acrobat (using Clearscan) or Abbyy Finereader and after an hour or two you will have a lot smaller, searchable pdf file.

I can easily search, select, annotate, scribble etc. pdfs and also easily read A5 pdf on 6" screen in landscape (margins cropped, two or three screens per page) or A4 multi-column pdf using multi-column mode.

When using Adobes's Clearscan, pdf files are also pretty small e.g. 500 page scanned A5 book without pictures should take about 10 MB and can be quickly flipped through on any average 6" reader.

I would never spend days proofreading ocr-ed text for epubs, because I can get small sized, searchable, 100% exact image of scanned book for about hour or two of a computer time only, and then easily read/scribble/search/annotate those A5 books on my 6" reader whenever I want, because usually I would use iPad or Kindle DX (no need for margin cropping or zooming even for A4 one-column books).

I wouldn't mind using fixed epub/mobi instead though, if it would allow me to quickly get a small sized, searchable, exact image of the scanned material, with virtually no effort on my part.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by webroot

Perhaps these animations are embedded flash objects and now flash support is dropping from browsers engines (aka epub renderer), but there are other better ways for supporting animation here with all that html5 and javascript stuffs but not yet fully supported. so from my angle your question boils down to absence of good epub reader.

Adobe Flash will of course be replaced by alternative builtins for legacy content, e.g. Mozilla Shumway.

[MartyTX]

Originally Posted by faltradl

... PDF is one world an ebooks is an other ...

I agree 100%. Every day, I use "print to PDF" to save web pages for temporary or permanent document storage. (Yes, I backup my PC daily.) Compared to pieces of paper, PDF's are easier to store, easier to find, and the ability to word-search is a big time saver.

However, when I sit down to read a good book, my first choice is ePub format, definitely not PDF. (For magazines and newspapers, I still prefer old-fashioned paper.)

[EowynCarter]

PDF will stay for it's good at, having a fixed layout for printing. Some tech books needs that.

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

PDF will stay for it's good at, having a fixed layout for printing. Some tech books needs that.

Yes. I download both PDF and EPUB versions of technical books from O'Reilly, and I usually end up using the PDF versions. The EPUBs will do in a pinch, but code examples, formulas and tables are just better in the PDFs.

[webroot]

Originally Posted by faltradl

Where are your problems? PDF ist one world an ebooks is an other. The fact epub etc. is better for ebooks is no reason to damn PDF. You say by yourself: "PDFs are still the best for paper printing." And for archiving, when you must submit paper with files. Then of course PDF/A.

PDF inherits its root and importance from the days of printers and now everywhere peoples are trying to go paperless be it publishing, newspaper, govt, business & organizations and I had the news other day that London police will use iPad for FIR. So I am not tossing the PDFs to a waste-bin but the pain comes from some PDF lover (writer) posted their work in a format which was well and better served using epub. But i admit that currently exporting to epub (and fixed layout) is not as easy as "print to pdf" Another thing they worry their work can be altered and PDF by default not editable.

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Adobe Flash will of course be replaced by alternative builtins for legacy content, e.g. Mozilla Shumway.

that was good to know!

[webroot]

Originally Posted by rkomar

Yes. I download both PDF and EPUB versions of technical books from O'Reilly, and I usually end up using the PDF versions. The EPUBs will do in a pinch, but code examples, formulas and tables are just better in the PDFs.

Fixed Layout authoring tools are still evolving but I am hopeful because Adobe InDesign now has a good FL EPUB export, who knows in immediate future we may have competing output from epub?

[markom]

Originally Posted by webroot

PDF inherits its root and importance from the days of printers and now everywhere peoples are trying to go paperless be it publishing, newspaper, govt, business & organizations ...

that was good to know!

In the near future (2-3 years) we may also have affordable lightweight 13" eink pdf readers or monitors around, and e.g. just print it (send a pdf) from our smartphone to 13" eink wirelessly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...HslmRrMEw#t=78

Hopefully also a reflective low-power color LCDs for lightweight e-paper 13" tablets.