Getting depressed

[Argel]

Having recently made up my mind to move from the grab-bag of devices I have used in the past to a dedicated ebook reader, I now find myself getting quite depressed over the alternatives.

At first I was very excited over the Kindle. It has a bunch of wonderful features, but the prospect of not being able to move books onto the desktop/laptop when I am working with them I find extremely unattractive. And I know that there are ways to change Kindle protected files into Mobi but I don’t put it past Amazon to close the loophole and, in any case, I don’t want to spend my time chasing down elusive (and probably illegal) scripts on the internet.

So I started to look at something like the Cybook – being a spendthrift I’d be quite happy if it kept me going for a year until something better came along. I already have fair stock of Mobi format files anyway. But then I don’t trust Amazon not to begin tipping the market towards Kindle by slowing the introduction of material for non-Kindle devices. I think it’s quite possible that when the dust settles from the format wars only Kindle will remain standing for those who want as near as possible a complete choice of titles. Anybody want to by a second-hand Betamax machine?

If I really went over from paper to a handheld I would be investing a lot of money – I spend a lot on books and would probably spend more because the space limitations would be lifted. (My wife would kill me if I put up another set of bookshelves – so it’s more a personal safety than a space issue). Would I be left with a bunch of expensive redundant files a couple of years down the line. Which is what is happening to my eReader and MSReader files if I move to Kindle or Cybook.

I find myself quite unable to see a safe route into the future and, amazingly for someone who buys more gadgets than is quite healthy, I find myself turning away from the idea of protected ebooks entirely. I’ll still read Dickens on the smartphone but I can’t see myself continuing to pay out for files I can’t transport to other devices and can’t guarantee will last longer than my current gadget. And it’s mostly because I don’t trust Amazon, which seems a ridiculous thing to say given how much I spend with them and how happy I am with the service.

And when will publishers begin to realize just how much the current DRM mess is costing them when a gadget addict like me is actually thinking of walking away.

A depressed Argel

[Taylor514ce]

I was in the same boat, and decided:

1. Get what you can get today, realizing full well that things, they are a-changin'.
2. Read what you can read on it, rather than bemoan what you can't.
3. If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with.

That second is hypocritical, because of course I still bitch about publishers and DRM and so on, but I don't let it spoil my enjoyment of the device.

[Argel]

Originally Posted by Taylor514ce

I was in the same boat, and decided:

1. Get what you can get today, realizing full well that things, they are a-changin'.

I'm really glad that works for you but I spend, in most months, between $100 and $200 on books. That's too much to walk away from if they become redundant in a couple of years, as has happened with my eReader files.

Most of all, though, it's the loss of the concept of the library. My shelves groan with books I have bought over four decades and the collection gives me great pleasure. I would be happy to have a digital library as long as it, too, is a lasting possession. We bought one of the very first CD players to come to the UK - 25 years later the disks that ran on it still work, but now on a player designed primarily for DVDs! Their contents are anyway digitally stored and backed up - they are mine for life. Is it asking too much that the same should be true of my books?

I may buy a cheap E-ink device to read free content - still have some Dickens to go - but that's a far cry from the dream of carrying my library in my pocket. But, as I say, I'm glad it works for you.

Argel

[Taylor514ce]

I spend about the same. I still do. Nothing is redundant. If a title I want is available as an ebook, that's how I buy it. If not, I buy the printed version. No redundancy. The key to happiness with an e-book (reader) is setting the proper expectation level. Things aren't ideal, but many, many people have managed to become quite happy with e-book ownership.

[Elsi]

As a very satisfied Kindle owner, I'll encourage you to take Taylor's advice and go ahead and purchase a device, even if it's not the Kindle.

At first I was very excited over the Kindle. It has a bunch of wonderful features, but the prospect of not being able to move books onto the desktop/laptop when I am working with them I find extremely unattractive.

Well, on your PC you can't *read* the DRMed .azw files you purchase from Amazon, but you can read the DRM-free books you purchase from elsewhere. (I actually don't like reading on the PC any way.)

And you can move books onto the PC from the Kindle and then back to the Kindle from the PC. I even back up my books on two external hard drives. Amazon says they will keep a permanent backup on their servers, and so far that's been true, but I just like knowing that I have a safe backup. And, since I've been purchasing from other vendors, I don't want to count on one of them to allow me to download the book later and discover that they don't offer that service.

I spend quite a bit for books each month -- I'm afraid to track how much because my hubby might realize how much it is and try to impose curbs. I also actively trade books both online and in person. I have several hundred TBR books in my family room and a smaller set of "keep forever" books in my spare bedroom. If you were to explore my bookshelves on BookCrossing, you'd see that I have owned multiple copies of quite a few books. That happens to me if I've purchased a book & not yet read it and then find it in the store again.

Since I keep very few books for the long term, I'm not too worried about my eBooks -- but I also try to buy few of them with DRM protection. The few "new release" books I buy at Amazon are typically much less than 1/2 price of the hardback edition. This offsets the cost of the Kindle itself and gives me immediate gratification to read them *now* instead of having to wait for them to come out in paperback at the same price.

The question really boils down to:
** Will I enjoy using the book reader with whatever content I choose to get?

The current devices aren't perfect. And the current publication and distribution isn't perfect. But I'm still having fun.

[ProfJulie]

I have a Cybook that I like quite a lot. As you know the Cybook handles DRM Mobipocket books very well. I have had some concerns about getting so fully vested in Mobipocket format, especially since they are owned by Amazon and I share some of your thoughts about how Amazon might handle Mobipocket in the future.

There is software - you can look through these forums to find it - that allows you to convert MSReader, Mobipocket & eReader books to a different format. Worse case scenario for me would be that Amazon makes it impossible for me to continue purchasing and reading Mobipocket books on my Cybook. If that happens, I'll just switch over to MSReader books and use this software to convert it to a format I can use on my Cybook. I don't like DRM and would prefer not to have to deal with circumventing it, but if it comes down to me being able to freely read books that I invested money in or being locked out of those books....well I'm glad for the tools that remove that concern for me.

I have book cases a plenty. About every 10 years I go through a painful purge of books. Now I am evaluating software that I can use to catalogue my books (paper & electronic) - creating a virtual book case, if you will. I am close to making my selection and am looking forward to getting all my books inventoried and organized in my new software. Some of this software provides a really beautiful user interface.

Right now, I feel a bit disoriented, because my eBook collection is not in any kind of format that I can view and reflect on. But I think it will be very gratifying to "see" all my books on my computer. And a nice benefit is that I will always know what books I have, what books I want to buy, the status of books I've lent out (well I don't lend books so much these days), and since a benefit of having an electronic catalogue is that I can carry it around on my pocket pc, I won't buy a book because I've forgotten that I already have it.

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by Argel

At first I was very excited over the Kindle. It has a bunch of wonderful features, but the prospect of not being able to move books onto the desktop/laptop when I am working with them I find extremely unattractive.

One question I would ask... Why do you need to put the books (read) on the PC? You can have your Kindle with you while you work on your PC. It will also free up the PC screen for things other than that book.

That said, you could decide to by .lit books and "downconvert" them, then transfor them to any type of archive format you prefer... .txt or .mobi seem like good choices. (Is this illegal, perhaps in some countrys? Some people would say it isn't illegal since it is a civil offense. However, the way I feel, if I pay for an eBook, I should have the "right" to read it on the device I own. I also speed sometimes which is also illegal.)

If you do the above (convert to text) you can read pretty much any book you buy on just about any reader (does Kindle support .txt?). Also, you will have a library that is not device or DRM provider dependant.

If I hadn't bought the Sony (got as a Cristmas gift) I would have got a Kindle. I like it for two main reasons... 1) Content... Kindle seems to have the most avilable for it... what you can't find on Amazon you can get other places. I think Fictionwise will send stuff to your Kindle and Feedbooks can get your public domain books. 2) The digital library... (which I admit I do get on fictionwise but not in the format the my Sony can consume.)

Do you actually re-read or sell your books? I've gotta admit, the majority of books I buy (fiction) get read (perhaps by one or two people) then get donated and/or trashed. Sometimes sold in a yard/garage sale. The exception here is some tech/reference books. But, even those get outdated for the most part. (Yes I know there is a whole other thread about this.)

Comeon... join the club. I think Amazon gives you a 30day return policy too. Once you start reading on an eInk device you will probably feel different about the "downsides" to it.

BOb

[=X=]

Hi Argel,
Life's too short to get depressed over such issues. Hopefully my 411 below get you back to "Getting excited" about life

Currently you place a importance on being able to read on he PC and on an EINK device. I think once you get your device you will find it hard to read on the PC. However since you ask...

The I know of two formats that allow a user to read on the PC and on an EInk First is the Mobi format. There are a few EBook Readers are Cybook and the Illiad that handle this format natively. Mobi is also supported on blackberrys and Win CE(WM5/WM6)

Second is the SONY reader, the online reader is quite nice. The reader features (search/bookmark) work on all supported formats (PDF, txt, Doc,.etc..), but I don't use it as I find it hard to read eBooks on the PC

Currently many SONY buy LIT/Mobi format and convert it to LRF. Of course that requires hunting down apps/scripts that you mentioned above.
The side benifit is here you can read LIT/MOBI/BeBB on the PC as well as on your reader.

--
Hope this helps
=X=

[Ervserver]

Likely there will never be a perfect device, or just when you think you found one a new one will come out and be even better.

[Argel]

OK, OK, I give in. Thanks for all the replies, though I think that many of you have a very different attitude to the buying and owning of books. My idea of the bare essentials would be the complete contents of the Bodleian Library (for starters).

I think I’m going to have to fall into the arms of Bezos, because it seems to me inevitable that he is going to win and, as a result, that is the only place where I’m going to be able to get anything close to all the books I want, when I want them. I say that with a certain heaviness of heart because I do mistrust Amazon’s motives in the long term.

It’s for that very reason that I won’t be buying any protected work in other formats, including Mobi. I can’t see that Amazon will allow loopholes in uploading to continue once the Kindle is established as market leader. Given that the Millennium Act provides for fines of $500,000 and five years in prison for circumventing DRM, I am amazed at the optimism of people who are cheerfully doing just that and then putting the files onto a device that is in constant radio contact with a company which relies on DRM to protect its bottom line. Good luck with that.

In any case, in stark financial terms, from the titles I’ve been looking at, the difference in price between Kindle editions and others is significant, and not just for best-sellers. I will even save money over my current paper-based buying.

And so, with grim resignation I have to say ‘Give me the contract Mr Bezos, I’m ready to sign over my soul. What’s that? I can’t buy the Kindle in the UK and you can’t tell me if and when I might be able to?’

Now I'm really depressed.

FX: Sound of sobbing fades into the distance....

Argel

[Elsi]

Originally Posted by Argel

I am amazed at the optimism of people who are cheerfully doing just that and then putting the files onto a device that is in constant radio contact with a company which relies on DRM to protect its bottom line. Good luck with that.

*MY* Kindle has an on-off switch on the back of the device that allows me to disable the cellular antenna. Due to the regulations requiring that transmission facilities be disabled during flights, it is highly unlikely that the Kindle would have the ability to turn on the cell feature when the switch is in the off position. I have no DRMed content except that purchased from the Kindle store, but even if I did, I could make sure that none of it were on the Kindle when the radio is active. Of course, there may be an activity log of some kind which is sent to the big Kindle server in the sky ...

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Argel

It’s for that very reason that I won’t be buying any protected work in other formats, including Mobi. I can’t see that Amazon will allow loopholes in uploading to continue once the Kindle is established as market leader.

95% of the world's population can't buy a Kindle. Given that MobiPocket is a world-wide business, compared with the Kindle's very limited single-country market, Amazon would have to be raving lunatics to shut down Mobi. They paid a lot of money for it, and they did so for a very good reason - it's a highly-profitable business.

[Argel]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Amazon would have to be raving lunatics to shut down Mobi.

Never said that Amazon would shut down Mobi, but it does make sense for them to ensure that Mobi DRMed books don't open on the Kindle - or at least those which were bought from other vendors - and vice-versa. It's one of the ways in which they will seek to make the Kindle a 'must have'.

Argel

[ProfJulie]

So dramatic! If that is truly your view of Amazon and the Kindle, why in the world would you want to contribute to it?

Aw well, whatever you decide will probably ultimately work for you.

Good luck on your decision.

[Argel]

Originally Posted by ProfJulie

If that is truly your view of Amazon and the Kindle, why in the world would you want to contribute to it?

Good question. Same reason we buy from Amazon even though it means the little bookshop down the road is going to disappear, along with the owner who devoted his life to spreading the love of books. Or from the supermarket even though it kills off the small shopkeeper who treated us like a friend.

It's better for me.