Article mentioning Paperwhite flaws

PodPeople · 11-06-2012, 08:45 AM

I came across this article in the Australian Financial Review which discusses the Paperwhite flaws that have been bothering people.

http://afr.com/p/technology/kindle_p...mnf5hKNsoq0zgK

sparklemotion · 11-06-2012, 09:35 AM

Interesting. Thanks for posting. It's good to see the color hue defect given more attention.

ddave7 · 11-06-2012, 02:18 PM

But you do realize the point this article is making..... If you are in the minority who is sensitive to the lighting issues, you will never be satisfied by the Paperwhite..... ever.

No matter how many replacements Amazon sends you, these lighting issues are intrinsic to the PW. It is only a matter of degree between units, not the issues being there on some, absent on others.

Unfortunately, there will be a small minority of users for who the PW will just not be satisfactory.

NNolan · 11-06-2012, 02:32 PM

And yet....I'm satisfied by the lighting/screens on both my Nook Glowlight and my new Kobo Glo. If Nook and Kobo can do it why can't Amazon make a screen that I consider good?

ddave7 · 11-06-2012, 02:46 PM

The key is what constitutes acceptable for "you". Your visual acuity and color perception is specific to you, no one is exactly the same as you. Because of the different lighting technologies used, another person could find the PW perfectly acceptable and the Nook Glowlight and Kobo Glo unacceptable.

The point is if you are not happy with the way the PW looks you will never be happy with it. No matter how many calls you may make to CS, no matter how many replacements they may send you. The underlying technology simply just does not match up to your eyes and how they specificaly perceive lighting and color.

My personal opinion is that all of those reflectors on the nano imprinted layer are acting like thousands of prisims, refracting light and creating colors. Personally, those colors don't bother me, but that doesn't mean that they don't drive other people crazy.

Unfortunatley, until Amazon changes the underlying technology for lighting screens, some people will just never find it acceptable.

jswinden · 11-06-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NNolan

And yet....I'm satisfied by the lighting/screens on both my Nook Glowlight and my new Kobo Glo. If Nook and Kobo can do it why can't Amazon make a screen that I consider good?

Yours might be a good one, but all of the Nook Glowlight photos I've seen look even worse than the PW. The Kobo Glo looks good though.

tmf2 · 11-06-2012, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddave7

But you do realize the point this article is making..... If you are in the minority who is sensitive to the lighting issues, you will never be satisfied by the Paperwhite..... ever.

\

Yes that sensitivity theory has been battered around a little in a couple of the forums. Problem with that is Amazon considers the screen coloration as a defect and has stated to others here via CS that they are working on a solution. Saying its a small minority is based on what, actual data from Amazon, what percent? Please enlighten to any info you have. I think stating its a "small minority" is understating the problem but that's my opinion. I bet Amazon wishes it was a small minority.

shanghaichica · 11-06-2012, 03:22 PM

I do think its all down to personal tolerability. Some of the pics I saw of 'defective' screens over at amazon.com were pretty bad to me and I probably would have returned them, yet most of the pics posted on this forum are acceptable to me and I would have accepted them. I have no idea if my paperwhite is faulty or as amazon designed it to but its perfectly acceptable to me. Although the Kobo glo probably has a more uniformly lit screen, I still prefer the paperwhite flaws and all. The reasons being that, the Kobo glo that I had gave off a strong blue glow in well lit situations, this could be removed my turning up the light. However the light needed to be turned up to a level that was too bright and became LCD like. I can find a setting on the paperwhite in well lit rooms that is nice to read with, does not give off colored glows and does not start to resemble an LCD display. At night time I can have the. PW setting very low at 3 or 4, the colour is uniform across the screen but is more yellow than white at that setting. This is perfect for me when I'm in bed as I don't want a harsh white light, I Want something duller and more comfortable. On the Kobo glo the lowest setting at night is a lot brighter and whiter, nothing wrong wIth this but its just not as comfortable as reading on my paperwhite.

ddave7 · 11-06-2012, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmf2

\

Problem with that is Amazon considers the screen coloration as a defect and has stated to others here via CS that they are working on a solution. Saying its a small minority is based on what, actual data from Amazon, what percent? Please enlighten to any info you have. I think stating its a "small minority" is understating the problem but that's my opinion. I bet Amazon wishes it was a small minority.

I do not believe the Product people within Amazon have acknowledged a defect. Undocumented conversations with CS can tend to be somewhat inaccurate (think the telephone party game).

You know, forums are a bad place to collect statistical data. They are self selected groups of enthusaists, with no statistical relationship to the overall user base of customers.

A few bad reviews, and the same issue getting recirculated by small groups on a forum give the impression of huge problems, when in reality the vast majoity of the customer population goes on in ignorance of user forums even existing.

Why would anyone who is happy with their new PW actively try to find a forum to express their satisfaction. They simply enjoy their new device. It is the unhappy users who actively seek out a platform to express their displeasure.

If you go back to any new release of a product you will always find the forums are full of small groups of users complaining about the new product. This goes beyond Kindles and applies to virtually any new product with a forum to discuss that product.

I don't have any secret internal return numbers, but if Amazon was receiving an excessive number of returns they would have issued an internal stop ship order. It would not make business sense not to, and heads would be rolling if bad product continued to go out the door to only worsen the situation. The fact that they continue to ship PWs, and there is a backorder, points to a healthy percentage of satisfied users.

The original point I was trying to make, and what the referenced article discusses, is that there are going to be some people who will never bond with the display technology on the PW.

sparklemotion · 11-06-2012, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddave7

I do not believe the Product people within Amazon have acknowledged a defect. Undocumented conversations with CS can tend to be somewhat inaccurate (think the telephone party game).
.

The product people, maybe not. I can tell you that the rep I have spoken to numerous times has told me they are aware of the color hue defect. He did refer to it as a defect too. So you can take that however you like.

We have spoken about it over 5+ phone conversations.

hawhill · 11-07-2012, 08:27 AM

Having worked in technical support, I can tell you that the "reps" (which aren't "reps" at all, they are typically not even connected to the company they provide support for!) will develop their own view of it all, too. Like end-users in a forum, these people also will come into contact mainly with users of defective devices, so they will have a different empirical perception, too. Plus, it's easier to just tell "well, it seems we have had (!) a bigger problem there, should be gone now, let me send you another device, please" that discussing for 15 minutes whether there's a problem, on what scale it might be and so forth. You just have to put the price of a Kindle in relation to the work cost of the support people to realize that they are not paid for technical discussions, or even any kind of discussions, actually. (My experience was that it's always good to excuse for every problem the customer comes up with. It gives them a warmer feeling and they will lose interest in bickering all the time. Ah, tech support in a call center, what a horrible job that was...)

Michele · 11-07-2012, 02:37 PM

The article states that once a person doesn't like the display, they'll never like the display on any unit. If this is the case, then that doesn't explain the people who have been bothered by blotches, but ended up receiving a replacement that they're happy with, having no blotches.

I'm heading to Best Buy to see what their display unit looks like.

edit: I can't believe I'm still attracted to the PW idea after all my returns this last couple weeks.

sparklemotion · 11-07-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michele

edit: I can't believe I'm still attracted to the PW idea after all my returns this last couple weeks.

Ha, I know what you mean. Join the club.

Michele · 11-07-2012, 05:32 PM

I went to Best Buy, looked at the display model, and pointed out the pinkness and blue blob with a sales rep, who saw it too. I'm officially not crazy, and cured of the I-want-PW disease.

sparklemotion · 11-07-2012, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michele

I went to Best Buy, looked at the display model, and pointed out the pinkness and blue blob with a sales rep, who saw it too. I'm officially not crazy, and cured of the I-want-PW disease.

When you get one that looks a bit better, it really is a very nice device. The one I saw at my local BB looked awful with the color hues too though.

11-06-2012, 08:45 AM	#1
PodPeople Connoisseur Posts: 94 Karma: 134 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Houston, TX Device: Nook Simple Touch, iPad 3, Kindle 4B	Article mentioning Paperwhite flaws I came across this article in the Australian Financial Review which discusses the Paperwhite flaws that have been bothering people. http://afr.com/p/technology/kindle_p...mnf5hKNsoq0zgK

11-06-2012, 02:46 PM	#5
ddave7 Junior Member Posts: 8 Karma: 122170 Join Date: Jul 2012 Device: Kobo Touch	The key is what constitutes acceptable for "you". Your visual acuity and color perception is specific to you, no one is exactly the same as you. Because of the different lighting technologies used, another person could find the PW perfectly acceptable and the Nook Glowlight and Kobo Glo unacceptable. The point is if you are not happy with the way the PW looks you will never be happy with it. No matter how many calls you may make to CS, no matter how many replacements they may send you. The underlying technology simply just does not match up to your eyes and how they specificaly perceive lighting and color. My personal opinion is that all of those reflectors on the nano imprinted layer are acting like thousands of prisims, refracting light and creating colors. Personally, those colors don't bother me, but that doesn't mean that they don't drive other people crazy. Unfortunatley, until Amazon changes the underlying technology for lighting screens, some people will just never find it acceptable. Last edited by ddave7; 11-06-2012 at 02:55 PM.

11-07-2012, 02:37 PM	#12
Michele Addict Posts: 209 Karma: 999496 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: California Device: Kindle 3	The article states that once a person doesn't like the display, they'll never like the display on any unit. If this is the case, then that doesn't explain the people who have been bothered by blotches, but ended up receiving a replacement that they're happy with, having no blotches. I'm heading to Best Buy to see what their display unit looks like. edit: I can't believe I'm still attracted to the PW idea after all my returns this last couple weeks. Last edited by Michele; 11-07-2012 at 02:43 PM.

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11-06-2012, 09:35 AM	#2
sparklemotion dangerous when cornered Posts: 1,855 Karma: 22891237 Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: USA Device: Kobo H2O, Kindle Paperwhite	Interesting. Thanks for posting. It's good to see the color hue defect given more attention.

11-06-2012, 02:18 PM	#3
ddave7 Junior Member Posts: 8 Karma: 122170 Join Date: Jul 2012 Device: Kobo Touch	But you do realize the point this article is making..... If you are in the minority who is sensitive to the lighting issues, you will never be satisfied by the Paperwhite..... ever. No matter how many replacements Amazon sends you, these lighting issues are intrinsic to the PW. It is only a matter of degree between units, not the issues being there on some, absent on others. Unfortunately, there will be a small minority of users for who the PW will just not be satisfactory.

11-06-2012, 02:32 PM	#4
NNolan Compulsive Gadget Geek Posts: 406 Karma: 4219324 Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: South Central Virginia Device: One of each, and two in some cases	And yet....I'm satisfied by the lighting/screens on both my Nook Glowlight and my new Kobo Glo. If Nook and Kobo can do it why can't Amazon make a screen that I consider good?

11-06-2012, 03:22 PM	#8
shanghaichica Guru Posts: 991 Karma: 5782970 Join Date: Jul 2010 Device: Scribe,Kindle Oasis 3, iPad Pro 11,15 Pro Max,iPad mini 7,colorsoft	I do think its all down to personal tolerability. Some of the pics I saw of 'defective' screens over at amazon.com were pretty bad to me and I probably would have returned them, yet most of the pics posted on this forum are acceptable to me and I would have accepted them. I have no idea if my paperwhite is faulty or as amazon designed it to but its perfectly acceptable to me. Although the Kobo glo probably has a more uniformly lit screen, I still prefer the paperwhite flaws and all. The reasons being that, the Kobo glo that I had gave off a strong blue glow in well lit situations, this could be removed my turning up the light. However the light needed to be turned up to a level that was too bright and became LCD like. I can find a setting on the paperwhite in well lit rooms that is nice to read with, does not give off colored glows and does not start to resemble an LCD display. At night time I can have the. PW setting very low at 3 or 4, the colour is uniform across the screen but is more yellow than white at that setting. This is perfect for me when I'm in bed as I don't want a harsh white light, I Want something duller and more comfortable. On the Kobo glo the lowest setting at night is a lot brighter and whiter, nothing wrong wIth this but its just not as comfortable as reading on my paperwhite.

11-07-2012, 08:27 AM	#11
hawhill Wizard Posts: 1,379 Karma: 2155307 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Goettingen, Germany Device: Kindle Paperwhite, Kobo Mini	Having worked in technical support, I can tell you that the "reps" (which aren't "reps" at all, they are typically not even connected to the company they provide support for!) will develop their own view of it all, too. Like end-users in a forum, these people also will come into contact mainly with users of defective devices, so they will have a different empirical perception, too. Plus, it's easier to just tell "well, it seems we have had (!) a bigger problem there, should be gone now, let me send you another device, please" that discussing for 15 minutes whether there's a problem, on what scale it might be and so forth. You just have to put the price of a Kindle in relation to the work cost of the support people to realize that they are not paid for technical discussions, or even any kind of discussions, actually. (My experience was that it's always good to excuse for every problem the customer comes up with. It gives them a warmer feeling and they will lose interest in bickering all the time. Ah, tech support in a call center, what a horrible job that was...)

11-07-2012, 05:32 PM	#14
Michele Addict Posts: 209 Karma: 999496 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: California Device: Kindle 3	I went to Best Buy, looked at the display model, and pointed out the pinkness and blue blob with a sales rep, who saw it too. I'm officially not crazy, and cured of the I-want-PW disease.

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