The Education Bubble

kennyc · 04-14-2011, 07:56 AM

...
But Thiel’s issues with education run even deeper. He thinks it’s fundamentally wrong for a society to pin people’s best hope for a better life on something that is by definition exclusionary. “If Harvard were really the best education, if it makes that much of a difference, why not franchise it so more people can attend? Why not create 100 Harvard affiliates?” he says. “It’s something about the scarcity and the status.

Here:

http://techcrunch.com/2011/04/10/pet...her-education/

DixieGal · 04-14-2011, 08:54 AM

I have to agree, but hesitantly. In my city, a college degree will qualify you for exactly the same jobs as a high school diploma. B'ham is an anomaly with empty desks sitting for months and years because there are more jobs than applicants. If you can type 35 wpm and conduct yourself professionally, the Univ of Ala B'ham is looking for you!

Meanwhile, it is next to impossible to find skilled laborers, because the entire population is extending childhood by staying in school as long as possible. I could not get any contractor to take my bathroom remodel job, so I ended up doing it myself. My own brother-in-law is a contractor, but he could not do it because he has so many large jobs in his book. I want a plumber to replace some old pipes under my house, and when we finally found one who would accept a small job, it has been a 3 week wait. He is supposed to come tomorrow, but so are more tornadoes, so it may be more weeks of waiting.

All this to finally ramble around to my point, which is that in my area, there is a shortage of skilled laborers. There is even a TV commercial about it! Mike Rowe, the loveable handyman on"Dirty Jobs" and the Ford commercials, and pretty much everything right now, is doing the commercial, saying that in Ala, plumbers and electricians and so forth start out earning $25 per hour, and why not skip college for a job paying more than college grads make?

My other Brother-in-law lost his job in a pipe mill last year when the factory closed. It took several months for him to find a job. But just last evening when they were at my house, he said that he is getting a big raise. He got another job offer, but when he gave his notice, they countered with a bunch more money and a future running the machine maintenane dept of the new 2nd plant that his company is building. All this with a trade school high school co-op educ. And 30 years experience. He always earned more than Tim and I combined.

phenomshel · 04-14-2011, 02:24 PM

This scares holy crap out of me. I read the article last night - and it's my worst nightmare. I went back to school to get OUT of retail, and it's always disturbed me that I've had women with Master's degrees in teaching working with me because they couldn't find anything else.
So help me, if I have gone into I don't even know how many thousands of dollars in student loan debt and STILL can't get out of retail, there's going to be a seriously unhappy person over here.

beppe · 04-14-2011, 04:59 PM

The problem is known since a while. At least since 1927.

In 1927 in fact, E.M. Forster delivered his famous lectures at The Clark Lectures, sponsored by Trinity College of the University of Cambridge. This passage is meaningful. I always suspected this.

... As long as learning is connected with earning, as long as certain jobs can only be reached through exams, so long must we take the examination system seriously. If another ladder to employment was contrived, much so-called education would disappear, and no one be a penny the stupider ...

6charlong · 04-14-2011, 07:12 PM

Plumbers are hard to find everywhere, DixieGal. In my community to learn the plumbers' trade you have to get into the union; to get into the union you have to know someone in the union and that person has to have friendly relations with the right people in the union.

The trouble with using supply and demand to determine labor costs, housing prices, international trade, the true value of investments or any number of other things is that someone will always find a way to circumvent the mechanism in order to have the whole garden to themselves.

I've come to think the theory of supply and demand is flawed; we all have to endure periodic shortages and gluts as a result. In reality, an education is little more than a fishing license, a chance to hope.

kennyc · 04-14-2011, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phenomshel

This scares holy crap out of me. I read the article last night - and it's my worst nightmare. I went back to school to get OUT of retail, and it's always disturbed me that I've had women with Master's degrees in teaching working with me because they couldn't find anything else.
So help me, if I have gone into I don't even know how many thousands of dollars in student loan debt and STILL can't get out of retail, there's going to be a seriously unhappy person over here.

Here's hoping that doesn't happen!

hidari · 04-14-2011, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phenomshel

This scares holy crap out of me. I read the article last night - and it's my worst nightmare. I went back to school to get OUT of retail, and it's always disturbed me that I've had women with Master's degrees in teaching working with me because they couldn't find anything else.
So help me, if I have gone into I don't even know how many thousands of dollars in student loan debt and STILL can't get out of retail, there's going to be a seriously unhappy person over here.

Unfortunately, There are alot of people everywhere in the same boat. I even know several people with PHDs in physics that have had trouble finding jobs. University education in general is overpriced and in some ways overrated. In many countries there are too many people with tertiary or higher education that cannot find a job in their field.C'est la vie.

wodin · 04-14-2011, 09:21 PM

I remember back during the days of the aerospace bust where aeronautical engineering PHDs were driving taxicabs.

ebusinesstutor · 04-18-2011, 04:10 PM

Great article. I truly believe in lifelong learning, but the assumption that a college degree will make you successful is one assumption that needs to be knocked down.

I am passionate about entrepreneurship and more jobs are created by entrepreneurs than by big business - a reason why I am against big business bailouts.

I think a program to get our best and brightest to launch their own business is fantastic. Let's couple them with real life mentors who can help them be successful.

If colleges can adapt to helping people actual create businesses instead of working for them, great. If not, they will give way to new methods...

04-14-2011, 07:56 AM	#1
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,897 Karma: 119230421 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	The Education Bubble ... But Thiel’s issues with education run even deeper. He thinks it’s fundamentally wrong for a society to pin people’s best hope for a better life on something that is by definition exclusionary. “If Harvard were really the best education, if it makes that much of a difference, why not franchise it so more people can attend? Why not create 100 Harvard affiliates?” he says. “It’s something about the scarcity and the status. Here: http://techcrunch.com/2011/04/10/pet...her-education/

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Historical Fiction Hough, Emerson: The Mississippi Bubble. V1. 22 July 2010	crutledge	Kindle Books	0	07-22-2010 03:56 PM
Historical Fiction Hough, Emerson: The Mississippi Bubble. V1. 22 July 2010	crutledge	BBeB/LRF Books	0	07-22-2010 03:55 PM
Historical Fiction Hough, Emerson: The Mississippi Bubble. V1. 22 July 2010	crutledge	ePub Books	0	07-22-2010 03:53 PM
Article: Bubble Bursts for E-Books	sUnShInE	News	1	01-13-2004 06:57 AM
Education	dillon65	Feedback	5	05-27-2003 09:52 PM

04-14-2011, 08:54 AM	#2
DixieGal Hi There! Posts: 7,473 Karma: 2930523 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Ft Lauderdale Device: iPad	I have to agree, but hesitantly. In my city, a college degree will qualify you for exactly the same jobs as a high school diploma. B'ham is an anomaly with empty desks sitting for months and years because there are more jobs than applicants. If you can type 35 wpm and conduct yourself professionally, the Univ of Ala B'ham is looking for you! Meanwhile, it is next to impossible to find skilled laborers, because the entire population is extending childhood by staying in school as long as possible. I could not get any contractor to take my bathroom remodel job, so I ended up doing it myself. My own brother-in-law is a contractor, but he could not do it because he has so many large jobs in his book. I want a plumber to replace some old pipes under my house, and when we finally found one who would accept a small job, it has been a 3 week wait. He is supposed to come tomorrow, but so are more tornadoes, so it may be more weeks of waiting. All this to finally ramble around to my point, which is that in my area, there is a shortage of skilled laborers. There is even a TV commercial about it! Mike Rowe, the loveable handyman on"Dirty Jobs" and the Ford commercials, and pretty much everything right now, is doing the commercial, saying that in Ala, plumbers and electricians and so forth start out earning $25 per hour, and why not skip college for a job paying more than college grads make? My other Brother-in-law lost his job in a pipe mill last year when the factory closed. It took several months for him to find a job. But just last evening when they were at my house, he said that he is getting a big raise. He got another job offer, but when he gave his notice, they countered with a bunch more money and a future running the machine maintenane dept of the new 2nd plant that his company is building. All this with a trade school high school co-op educ. And 30 years experience. He always earned more than Tim and I combined.

04-14-2011, 02:24 PM	#3
phenomshel ZCD BombShel Posts: 4,793 Karma: 8293322 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: The Frozen North (aka Illinois, USA) Device: iPad, STB Kindle Oasis	This scares holy crap out of me. I read the article last night - and it's my worst nightmare. I went back to school to get OUT of retail, and it's always disturbed me that I've had women with Master's degrees in teaching working with me because they couldn't find anything else. So help me, if I have gone into I don't even know how many thousands of dollars in student loan debt and STILL can't get out of retail, there's going to be a seriously unhappy person over here.

04-14-2011, 04:59 PM	#4
beppe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,161 Karma: 81026524 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Italy Device: Kindle3, Ipod4, IPad2	The problem is known since a while. At least since 1927. In 1927 in fact, E.M. Forster delivered his famous lectures at The Clark Lectures, sponsored by Trinity College of the University of Cambridge. This passage is meaningful. I always suspected this. ... As long as learning is connected with earning, as long as certain jobs can only be reached through exams, so long must we take the examination system seriously. If another ladder to employment was contrived, much so-called education would disappear, and no one be a penny the stupider ...

04-14-2011, 07:12 PM	#5
6charlong friendly lurker Posts: 896 Karma: 2436026 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: US Device: Kindle, nook, Apple and Kobo	Plumbers are hard to find everywhere, DixieGal. In my community to learn the plumbers' trade you have to get into the union; to get into the union you have to know someone in the union and that person has to have friendly relations with the right people in the union. The trouble with using supply and demand to determine labor costs, housing prices, international trade, the true value of investments or any number of other things is that someone will always find a way to circumvent the mechanism in order to have the whole garden to themselves. I've come to think the theory of supply and demand is flawed; we all have to endure periodic shortages and gluts as a result. In reality, an education is little more than a fishing license, a chance to hope.

04-14-2011, 09:21 PM	#8
wodin Illiterate Posts: 10,279 Karma: 37848716 Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: The Sandwich Isles Device: Samsung Galaxy S10+, Microsoft Surface Pro	I remember back during the days of the aerospace bust where aeronautical engineering PHDs were driving taxicabs.

04-18-2011, 04:10 PM	#9
ebusinesstutor Star Gawker Posts: 526 Karma: 6944314 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Spruce Grove, AB Canada Device: Kindle Paperwhite	Great article. I truly believe in lifelong learning, but the assumption that a college degree will make you successful is one assumption that needs to be knocked down. I am passionate about entrepreneurship and more jobs are created by entrepreneurs than by big business - a reason why I am against big business bailouts. I think a program to get our best and brightest to launch their own business is fantastic. Let's couple them with real life mentors who can help them be successful. If colleges can adapt to helping people actual create businesses instead of working for them, great. If not, they will give way to new methods...

Advert

Advert