Have e-Readers been superseded by Tablets and Phones

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by Ripplinger

I agree with Salgueiros, how can people stand reading on tablets or any LCD backlit screen?

If you work on a pc at work or have one at home, then that is no different from reading a tablet. If you can look at, and read off of a pc all day then you can do the same thing with a tablet.

How often are you reading posts on this board and responding to them every day, and then go on to other sites to do it some more.

I can read equally comfortable on any and all technology that will allow me to read my books. I never even thought about the differences because there aren't any at least for me, and I'm not about to let some marketing hype convince me that one is superior to the other. What is truly important to me is being able to adjust the text size.

This is coming from a woman who has worn glasses ever since she was two years old. One who is smart enough to know her limitations like if I can't see in the dark than it doesn't make sense to try to read in the dark with just a little light.

We are not designed to read in the dark so if you choose to do so, then you are simply asking for that eyestrain you keep going on about.

I like light and lots of it. Most of my reading is done indoors so having enough light to read by is crucial. Why do you think einks with light are so popular? The only time I will read outside is if I'm out for a walk and then will sit down at a bench to rest and read. Only then will I bring my T1 with me. The rest of the time I'm reading off of my phone when out and my pc when home.

Read on whatever you like, but for the love of god please stop trying to convince everyone that one is better than the other.

[catlight]

Originally Posted by Fluribus

The resolution is better on a high-quality LCD screen. The contrast is better also. I find reading on a Paperwhite much easier. The difference is the backlight. It's not the text, it's that bright white screen. If I'm playing a console game and the screen goes mostly white, I have to look away from the TV.

I don't see anywhere that the study looked at people who have problems reading on a backlit screen. If the backlight doesn't bother you, then it's not going to bother you. If you study a group of people who aren't bothered by backlights, then the conclusion will be that the backlight doesn't cause any problems.

I'm not sure about the resolution. An Aura HD has a 265 dpi resolution, as well as the best lighting system I have seen. It is actually quite good with ridiculously small fonts (when my eyes are not tired!).

[AnotherCat]

Originally Posted by catlight

...The best GPS is not a smartphone, it is a dedicated GPS.

The best e-reader is not a tablet, it is a dedicated e-reader with an e-paper screen and a battery life that will let you read five books with the back-light on between charges, and doesn't wash out in bright light...

There is, in fact, only one GPS and so by default that is the best. Perhaps you meant "GPS navigation device"?

Personally, I would have thought that the best e-reader (or GPS navigation device) was that which suited each individual user's specific needs and circumstances best, rather that which some unrelated third party proclaims to be the best. Why such proclamations as to what is best for all come mostly from those seemingly married to E ink is something I ponder over?

[Ripplinger]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

If you work on a pc at work or have one at home, then that is no different from reading a tablet. If you can look at, and read off of a pc all day then you can do the same thing with a tablet.
...
Read on whatever you like, but for the love of god please stop trying to convince everyone that one is better than the other.

I'm working on my PC on and off all day long at all hours of the day (and night). But I do it indoors and I'm very comfortable with it and e-ink would be a crappy substitute for my power-hog of a PC for those tasks.

In my case though, I read probably close to 50% of my time outdoors (I'm referring to my time spent reading novels for enjoyment, not my work nor graphics editing nor browsing websites nor looking up information, all of which e-ink would be a crappy and far inferior device to do those tasks on). And in my case guess what... e-ink is better than any backlit LCD device when you're reading out in the sun.

The title of this thread, "Have e-Readers been superseded by Tablets and Phones," means that when someone disagrees with that idea, they're going to state why. If you disagree with the statement in the title, the nature of your response is going to be defending e-ink over LCD for reading. Don't take that to mean that's there's not room for all devices. I could care less what anyone else reads on. If you prefer tablets or phones and never read outdoors, by all means buy a tablet or use your phone for reading. It will be perfect in your instance.

I'm simply stating why for how and when I read, e-ink is a must for me and it will never be superseded by a tablet or phone in my case (at least until a better technology comes out that will let me read in all light situations including direct sunlight with long battery life on those devices).

I didn't think that needed to be stated as a disclaimer on every post for this thread. But again, read on whatever you're comfortable reading on and be happy that you enjoy your reading time. Reading on tablets and phones is here to stay, as is reading on specialized e-ink devices. It's good to have a lot of choices so everyone's needs are met to make reading as enjoyable as possible under all conditions. Best of all worlds.

[meeera]

Originally Posted by Catlady

Every time I hear people sing the praises of e-ink and complain about LCD screens, I wonder how they can blithely accept the horrible flashing you get when you turn a page with an e-ink device. When I was first looking for an e-reader just a few years back, I looked at Kindles and Nooks in B&M stores; when I tried them out, that page flash was an immediate deal breaker.

I absolutely hated the flash in the shop, also. I was very sceptical that it would functionally "disappear" for me. And yet, it did, within an hour or two.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by Catlady

Every time I hear people sing the praises of e-ink and complain about LCD screens, I wonder how they can blithely accept the horrible flashing you get when you turn a page with an e-ink device. When I was first looking for an e-reader just a few years back, I looked at Kindles and Nooks in B&M stores; when I tried them out, that page flash was an immediate deal breaker.

I haven't looked an e-ink device since. That flashing was headache-inducing and annoying as heck. For me, that outweighs anything else that might be a possible advantage of e-ink over LCD.

Headache inducing? Then you cannot watch a CRT screen at all, I presume. And get headaches when in an office building with those tube lightning fixtures... They flash for more often than you turning a page...

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

It still flashes, but not usually with every page turn no more. The duration of the flash is greatly reduced with each new generation - tried my prs300 the other day and that flash is horribly long and annoying compared to what my PW does. It becomes less notiveable/annoying with time, but don't believe anybody that tells you it goes away and you tune it out completely. You will always notice.

I hope you won't ever read a paper book anymore, because that flash is even logner than the one on my BeBook Mini...


The problem I have with most reading software on tablets is that they insist in implementing a fake page turning animation. In my eyes, that's about a thousand times worse than any flashing even an antiquated e-ink device does. Especially since it's absolutely not required...

[Luffy]

Originally Posted by pidgeon92

I disagree. I don't notice it at all. Haven't for years now.

Originally Posted by mbovenka

Perhaps you do; I certainly don't. I notice it as much as I notice the turning of a page when reading a paper book: i.e. not at all.

I thought the flash was actually cool, but I no longer notice it these days. I stopped noticing it after 2-3 months of use.

[cromag]

Originally Posted by catlight

I'd be curious about the model - your description would fit at least three generations of Kobo.

My first Kobo had a flash, but I got used to it very quickly. My latest (Aura HD) has a whiter background - though still a tad gray, higher resolution, a really good back light that takes surprisingly little power (600 page book, with back light = 15-20% of battery), faster processor, and I don't notice a flash - which may or may not be there. I usually just leave the back light on and ignore changes in ambient lighting...

Hi there, catlight. The Kobo has "N647" on the base. Plugging that into Google came up with this:

http://www.amazon.com/Kobo-N647-KBU-.../dp/B00519FBTK


I got it for $10 (US) plus $7 shipping and handling, so I'm thrilled with its performance!

[Ripplinger]

The flash never bothered me either, and unless I was looking for it, I didn't even notice it. It's certainly less disruptive to reading than turning the page of a physical book.

[Yapyap]

One of the reasons I like reading on my eInk reader so much is precisely that I spend the entire day staring at my LCD monitor (and it's a very good quality Eizo monitor, which is orders of magnitude better and more comfortable and easier on the eyes than the cheap and horrible TN-panel BenQ I have to put up with on my one office day every week).

I noticed already some years ago that I just wasn't able to comfortably read fanfic, never mind ebooks, in the evenings, off the computer, after ~10-12 hours of using the LCD monitor. I was tired. My eyes were tired. Lots of eye-watering, and headaches.

I can't even easily read forums or web pages in the evenings any more, after a long day of work on the LCD monitor.

Trying to read on my tablet (3rd generation iPad, retina display - it's a really nice display!) leads to the same issues - still tired, still eye-watering. I'm okay with the tablet in the mornings, same as with the computer, after a night's rest and in good ambient lighting (preferably angled in a way that I don't constantly see my own reflection on the screen, which is a problem when I try that for my evening reading setup). By the evening, in artificial lighting and after a day of screen-staring, it's not at all comfortable any longer. I can, however, leave the computer and continue reading on eInk just fine (not in a dark room, but in normal ambient artificial lighting, with my Paperwhite light turned to level ~7-8).

So that is my experience. Other people's experience is different. I envy those who can easily read well into the evening/night on the LCD screen; I like my tablet, I'd be very happy if I could read with comfort on it. Sepia/beige background helps a bit, but it's still nowhere eInk level comfort for me.

Also, and this is also where people's preferences differ, lowering the brightness/contrast on LCD (from where it is where I use it, still comfortably, during the day) just makes it much, MUCH worse. I need contrast and light to read - it can make my eyes water and itch, but if I turn them down to where they won't cause this much strain, I just plain can't see the text any more, not without squinting and a lot of effort that makes things much worse. Sigh.

So the argument of "if you can use a computer, you can read on an LCD screen" is ... well, no. Or rather "to an extent". I suspect this is the case for a lot of us who prefer extended reading on eInk - we can deal with backlit LCDs for part of the day, but after 5-6-8-12 hours of it, not in the evening, not for leisure any more.

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

I hope you won't ever read a paper book anymore, because that flash is even logner than the one on my BeBook Mini...

I haven't read any paper books in quite a while. And while I notice every time that my PW flashes, it is not disruptive. Well it takes a little bit longer than the non flash page turns, but it is still better than turning a real page.

The problem I have with most reading software on tablets is that they insist in implementing a fake page turning animation. In my eyes, that's about a thousand times worse than any flashing even an antiquated e-ink device does. Especially since it's absolutely not required...

Yeah, when it should be easy to add an option in the settings to disable it. If the apps is trying to look like I read books now, they should flash every so often - like my book does.

[DiapDealer]

I can easily turn off the page-turning animation in my preferred reading app (Mantano Premium).

I prefer it to be on, though, to tell the truth. Not because I want to pretend it's a physical book, but because I want to be absolutely certain I actually DID turn the page. Some apps and newer devices are getting so quick with page turns that I can't really see that anything happened. I prefer to know immediately that I fumbled the page-turn tap, instead of wondering why that first paragraph on the "new" page seems so familiar; and instead of instinctively turning another page because I didn't think the first one "took." So I actually find the tiny disruption quite useful.

[sl42]

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

A reader is a one-function tablet, optimised for that one job.

But if you need (or just enjoy) all the OTHER things a tablet does, and are going to carry one around and charge it daily anyway.... well, it really isn't as bad at reading ebooks as some of you like to believe.

For limited/moderate reading at least. My craptastic Android tablet gets, at best (with the screen dimmed to its lowest setting, wifi/gps/sound off) five to six hours between charges. Nowhere near good enough for an ebook reader, though it is what I relied on for a couple of years. Also, only useful indoors - absolutely impossible to read in sunlight. Basically, I hated the thing from the day I bought it, though it was a great upgrade from reading on my netbook.

About a month ago, I *FINALLY* got a Kobo Mini. Not only has my tablet not been turned on and used since, but honestly I don't even know where it is - probably under a stack of papers or lobbed in a box somewhere.

I'm blown away by the display quality of e-ink. Yes, I knew it would have a higher DPI than my tablet - but I am amazed by the fact that I cannot see pixels *at all* no matter how hard I squint. It's far better, in fact, than magazine print (where the dots of the print are plainly visible) let alone a traditional raster display. And, of course, many pricier readers have a higher DPI than my mini, but really I don't see the point since it really couldn't be improved any as far as my one good eye can tell.

Other than the visual quality, I would agree that a tablet is probably fine for someone that reads at most a few hours a day indoors, or doesn't mind spending much of their time chained to a power outlet so they can charge while reading.

That being said, the battery limitation probably isn't significant for the vast majority of people - most of whom will only read a handful of books in the course of a year and will almost never read anywhere near six hours in a day. So for most people the only limitation presented by a tablet is sunlight readability, which is far less of an issue.

This means that dedicated ereaders are definitely niche market devices, but it would take a *massive* improvement in tablets before they could fill that niche.

[Catlady]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

Headache inducing? Then you cannot watch a CRT screen at all, I presume. And get headaches when in an office building with those tube lightning fixtures... They flash for more often than you turning a page...

Your comparison makes no sense to me; I've never seen a CRT or a lighting fixture flash the way an e-ink screen does. Flicker, yes, but that's not the same thing.

Why is it that I'm supposed to take it as an absolute fact when people say flatly that LCD causes more eye strain than e-ink, but my statement that e-ink's page flash gives me a headache is greeted with apparent skepticism?

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I'm curious. If you're talking straight-up LCD vs eInk, I fail to see what could be relevant other than eyestrain/glare/sunlight. Unless you're talking stuff like "more distractions" or battery life. Battery life's a valid beef (just not one that affects me), but somehow I don't think that's what many people have in mind when they knee-jerk all; "OMG. How can you read on an LCD screen?!" I was mainly addressing those who seem quick to balk at the screen technology alone.

I don't care if I have to charge every couple of days, I don't get eyestrain, I almost never read outdoors, my Nexus 7 is lighter than the eInk reader I had for years, and I put the device in airplane mode if I don't want to be distracted. I don't mean to imply that you're not entitled to your preference or anything, but I'm genuinely curious what's left on your list of advantages.

Battery life and glare from reading outside happen to both be relevant to me. I'd imagine that is the reasoning behind most fans of dedicated ereaders, but I could be horribly wrong.

Somehow I think that what many people have in mind when they knee-jerk all; "OMG. How can you read on an LCD screen?!" they are really wondering "OMG. How can you not value reading outside and not having to charge your books every day or two?!"

On a more important note, I think everyone here can more or less agree that:

• Purely for reading, the only real advantage of a tablet over an ereader is the ability to have multiple ecosystems available. Which is only for lazy people, not Mobile Readers.
• There is nothing wrong with reading on a tablet (barring medical conditions), so long as you don't mind charging much more often, don't mind the extra weight (negligible) and don't plan to read outside (at least, not without switching to a dedicated ereader, in which case, ).
• This is especially awesome if you intend to do a lot of internet browsing/watching movies/playing games in addition to reading.

Thus, I declare this thread as silly and a waste of time, since it is based on click-bait from That Well-Known Rag, goodereader.com, and because nobody actually disagrees with each other.

And next time, could Kozlowski waste peoples' time with FUD about The Death of E-Ink somewhere private -- or at say something meaningful in the process?