R.I.P. The English Novel 1485 - 2009 - Page 2

HarryT · 08-10-2009, 03:28 AM

Just to be "picky", "Morte d'Arthur" is generally not categorized as a "novel". The first English novelist is widely regarded as having been Samuel Richardson, with "Pamela", published in 1740. The earlier works, such as Morte d'Arthur, Robinson Crusoe, etc, are normally called "Romances", to distinguish them from novels.

Sparrow · 08-10-2009, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

She is famous for her enormous (fake) breasts. Used to be a "glamour model".

The phrase 'tit for tat' springs to mind.

sorry, couldn't resist.

ShortNCuddlyAm · 08-10-2009, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow

The phrase 'tit for tat' springs to mind.

sorry, couldn't resist.

I almost spat my tea over my keyboard, but resisted

vivaldirules · 08-10-2009, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moejoe

I was just venting.

I put my heart and soul into writing, it's really important to me, as are readers, and this wazzock comes along and flashes her boobs, the next thing she's at the top of the breast-seller list. It's so disheartening for anybody who loves the written word, of any language, and I wonder if this kind of crap happens anywhere else, or is it a particularly Anglo/American thing.

Fixed that for ya.

Moejoe · 08-10-2009, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Just to be "picky", "Morte d'Arthur" is generally not categorized as a "novel". The first English novelist is widely regarded as having been Samuel Richardson, with "Pamela", published in 1740. The earlier works, such as Morte d'Arthur, Robinson Crusoe, etc, are normally called "Romances", to distinguish them from novels.

You have a point, but still, romance or novel, it's still better than the toilet paper the big publishing companies dare to call 'fiction' these days.

Peverel · 08-10-2009, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moejoe

I was just venting.

I put my heart and soul into writing, it's really important to me, as are readers, and this wazzock comes along and flashes her boobs, the next thing she's at the top of the best-seller list. It's so disheartening for anybody who loves the written word, of any language, and I wonder if this kind of crap happens anywhere else, or is it a particularly Anglo/American thing.

Not to take this way off topic but isn't this just another symptom of our celebrity fuelled society. The very fact that anyone can be famous for being famous and make a living at it amazes me. I guess the only solice I take from this is that at least the people that buy this and other similair books are reading something rather than reading nothing..........

Moejoe · 08-10-2009, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peverel

Not to take this way off topic but isn't this just another symptom of our celebrity fuelled society. The very fact that anyone can be famous for being famous and make a living at it amazes me. I guess the only solice I take from this is that at least the people that buy this and other similair books are reading something rather than reading nothing..........

Aren't they, in essence, reading nothing when that writing is coming from a soulless ghost? The book may as well be filled with crossword puzzles because its not being bought for its contents but its association with that dumb waste of oxygen.

Who are you? · 08-10-2009, 08:55 AM

In movies it is well accepted to have actors and actresses who are famous only for their physique to not write their own lines, but to have the text be written by a scriptwriter. As in an assembly line in this way everyone contributes their own strength to the final product: good looking performers making the movie more attractive to view and a soulless ghost to provide an entertaining story.

Why should this not work in book writing?

Sparrow · 08-10-2009, 08:58 AM

I'm no fan of Katie Price, but if other people get some enjoyment out of what she does it doesn't bother me, I'm glad it makes them happy.

rhadin · 08-10-2009, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pholy

. . . just the death of the Sunday Times Bestseller list as an indicator of quality.

Note that it is titled Bestseller list, not Best Quality or Finest Literature list. Bestseller = great literaure is an oxymoron -- always has been and always will be.

Just like equating the New York Post with great newspaper or Fox News with impartiality.

All any bestseller list indicates is that more copies of the listed books were sold than copies of any other book during the past 7 days.

Moejoe · 08-10-2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Who are you?

In movies it is well accepted to have actors and actresses who are famous only for their physique to not write their own lines, but to have the text be written by a scriptwriter. As in an assembly line in this way everyone contributes their own strength to the final product: good looking performers making the movie more attractive to view and a soulless ghost to provide an entertaining story.

Why should this not work in book writing?

Well fine, if you want the whole industry to be just that. Well, hell why not have our novels sponsored by Coca-Cola while we're at it and have every other page an advert? I mean, it's just literature after all, it's not important. It's just entertainment. It's not like reading is important or anything.

Coming soon, The Grapes of Wraith 2 - The Wrathening (by a faceless conglomeration of US sitcom writers hiding behind the face of a celebrity)

next up: 1985 - The Year After (by David Hasselhof)

If you're seriously suggesting fiction and literature should be run like the soulless TV & movie industry then I have to wonder if you have actually read a book before, if that is the esteem with which you hold literature.

rhadin · 08-10-2009, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moejoe

. . . I wonder if this kind of crap happens anywhere else, or is it a particularly Anglo/American thing.

It happens everywhere, not just in Britain and America. People want relief from their daily toil and do not want to be made to think (something great literature generally demands). People at the bottom want to believe that they, too, can rise, and they live vicariously through the gossip columns.

Moejoe · 08-10-2009, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhadin

It happens everywhere, not just in Britain and America. People want relief from their daily toil and do not want to be made to think (something great literature generally demands). People at the bottom want to believe that they, too, can rise, and they live vicariously through the gossip columns.

I'm not talking about 'great' literature, I'm talking about 'real' literature. I'm talking about fiction written by individuals with something to say, with a point of view and an outlook on life. Doesn't have to be Steinbeck, but I can't accept it being some vacuous bimbo who didn't even write her own book. Doesn't that worry you? That a person who can barely speak, a person who spelled her own name wrongly when she chose it, is at the top of the most-read list? Christ, can we dumb down our culture any more before we stand up and say 'no'?

HarryT · 08-10-2009, 09:14 AM

Bread and circuses, mate. That's what the plebs wanted 2000 years ago, and it's what they want today.

Steven Lyle Jordan · 08-10-2009, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verencat

I sincerely believe that flashing your boobs is the only honest way to make a living these days, that is why I'm doing it as much as I can!

Hmm... maybe I should get a set of those...

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08-10-2009, 03:28 AM	#16
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	Just to be "picky", "Morte d'Arthur" is generally not categorized as a "novel". The first English novelist is widely regarded as having been Samuel Richardson, with "Pamela", published in 1740. The earlier works, such as Morte d'Arthur, Robinson Crusoe, etc, are normally called "Romances", to distinguish them from novels.

08-10-2009, 08:55 AM	#23
Who are you? Groupie Posts: 184 Karma: 300001 Join Date: May 2009 Device: 505	In movies it is well accepted to have actors and actresses who are famous only for their physique to not write their own lines, but to have the text be written by a scriptwriter. As in an assembly line in this way everyone contributes their own strength to the final product: good looking performers making the movie more attractive to view and a soulless ghost to provide an entertaining story. Why should this not work in book writing?

08-10-2009, 08:58 AM	#24
Sparrow Wizard Posts: 4,395 Karma: 1358132 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: UK Device: Palm TX, CyBook Gen3	I'm no fan of Katie Price, but if other people get some enjoyment out of what she does it doesn't bother me, I'm glad it makes them happy.

08-10-2009, 09:14 AM	#29
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	Bread and circuses, mate. That's what the plebs wanted 2000 years ago, and it's what they want today.

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