Massive wave of ebook piracy?

[sabredog]

You really want to know?

Vocal to the point of being rude. Just because one does not agree with your point of view means they do not have to grow a pair.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by sabredog

You really want to know?

Vocal to the point of being rude. Just because one does not agree with your point of view means they do not have to grow a pair.

I was referring to the passivity you were referring to.

[AlbertaCowboy]

Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald

Or maybe the middle group will grow a pair?

I never get too involved in this (pointless) argument, but as a staunch middle grouper, I have a question. Why does the refusal to join into a dead end debate with absolutely no chance of comprimise constitue not having a pair? To me it's just common sense to avoid being insulted and/or denigrated for my opinion by either end of the spectrum.

[Barcey]

Commenting on the origin of the thread...

I don't see a massive wave of ebook piracy coming to ebooks the way it hit the music industry. The main difference that I see is that there has always been alternative options for reading books for free. Libraries are well stocked with free books, people share by custom and "take a book / leave a book" sites are all over the place. The relatively small percentage of the general population that buy books do it because they want to, because it's more convient or they think it's the right thing to do. These aren't people that are quick to jump to piracy.

The music industry was fertile ground for piracy. Their consumers were not happy but the industry didn't care. People thought CD's were over priced, they didn't like that they had to buy entire albulms to just get one song they liked, they didn't like that they were expected to rebuy their music libraries. When a free alternative presented itself people jumped all over it.

I don't see the same conditions with ebooks. The consumers don't have the historical resentment and they've always had the ability to read free books for the rest of their lives. The current practices of the big publishing houses is creating the same fertile grounds for piracy but I think it will be a gradual change and not a massive wave.

From what I've observed it won't be one of downloads either. I think it will be massive ebook library exchanges between people.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by J. Strnad

Most people would like to be compensated in some way for their hard work, and authors are no different. I would like to think that most people would say to themselves, "If I spent six months or a year or ten years writing a book, would I want people to download it for free, or would I prefer that they pay me a few bucks?" and then act accordingly.

The choice isn't download it or buy it. The choice is download it or don't download it (and by extension don't read it). Which of those would you prefer?

[jessicalynn]

Originally Posted by AlbertaCowboy

I never get too involved in this (pointless) argument, but as a staunch middle grouper, I have a question. Why does the refusal to join into a dead end debate with absolutely no chance of comprimise constitue not having a pair? To me it's just common sense to avoid being insulted and/or denigrated for my opinion by either end of the spectrum.

yeah....I'm a middle grounder as well. Like I don't see myself turning to ebook piracy anytime soon, because I love books and reading and I want authors to get the money from my purchases. But then again, I have used libraries before, and authors don't get any money from me checking a book out of the library....but I guess they do get the money from the initial purchase of the book. But then again someone probably had to purchase the initial file that is pirated. hmm. Regardless, I don't see people who pirate as the scum of the earth or something the way some people in this thread do!
This thread is way to snarky for my tastes though. I feel like if I see this: smiley one more time I will scream!! lol.

[GA Russell]

Barcey, one difference I can think of between music and books is the availability of the material.

It has always been my impression that the typical music pirate has been a teenager who wants a new hit for free.

But it is my impression (and this could be just plain incorrect) that book pirates are mostly downloading eBooks which are not available legitimately - a lot of back catalogue that the publishers haven't gotten around to yet (i.e., Perry Mason) and in a few cases recent books like the Harry Potters, and geographically restricted books.

I think the difference is important because if the publishers did their job and released these eBooks at reasonable prices, much of the book pirating would then consist of folks who would not buy the book and therefore then not constitute a lost sale. I do believe that the music pirating has resulted in lost sales (although I also believe that the music people have been issuing a lot of stuff the public doesn't want to buy).

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by AlbertaCowboy

I never get too involved in this (pointless) argument, but as a staunch middle grouper, I have a question. Why does the refusal to join into a dead end debate with absolutely no chance of comprimise constitue not having a pair? To me it's just common sense to avoid being insulted and/or denigrated for my opinion by either end of the spectrum.

The same reason why people shoplift, litter, are rude, go through the 10 items or less line with 50 items, etc. They know that no will have the nerve to speak up. Your silence is the same as approval to them and is a form of cowardice. One person objecting may not make a difference. Neither may ten people. But if a large majority had the courage to standup to the wrogdoers, it just might make a difference. Say nothing and it will only get worse.

[AlbertaCowboy]

Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald

Say nothing and it will only get worse.

I prefer to follow the advice from an old saying: "It is better to stay silent and have the world wonder if you are a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt".

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by AlbertaCowboy

I prefer to follow the advice from an old saying: "It is better to stay silent and have the world wonder if you are a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt".

Call me a coward if you will. I'll call you a self righteous rhetoric spewer. Everyone wins.

Whatever.

[ManosHandsOfFate]

Originally Posted by GA Russell

It has always been my impression that the typical music pirate has been a teenager who wants a new hit for free.

But it is my impression (and this could be just plain incorrect) that book pirates are mostly downloading eBooks which are not available legitimately - a lot of back catalogue that the publishers haven't gotten around to yet (i.e., Perry Mason) and in a few cases recent books like the Harry Potters, and geographically restricted books.

I am the latter.

I make a decent middle class living and can definitely afford (and am willing) to pay for my entertainment.

I buy a Nook and K3. I now want to read books on an ereader. I don't want pbooks collecting in the house.

I buy Risen for $2.39 for my Kindle and consider it a huge bargain. Heck, I'd easily pay triple that price. Thanks Jan!

I want to read a Doctor Who book published 15 years ago. There's no electronic copy for sale.

I could purchase a used copy, have it sent to my home, download a pirated copy and then chuck the paperback. It may be the right thing to do but it's also retarded and conflicts with my plan not to mess around with pbooks.

Am I a young-ish whippersnapper who doesn't understand how it was back in the day when you couldn't have whatever you wanted instantly? Maybe. But there's a lot of us and we're not going away.

All I'm saying is, publishers, give me a way to pay you for that electronic copy of the Doctor Who book!

[Xanthe]

Originally Posted by GhostHawk

Society is deciding if going to the darknet for ebooks is ok or not.
There are obviously 2 very heated camps for this issue.

It doesn't in my opinion at least, fall into the same category as rape, slavery, murder etc. It falls more into the category of cheat on your taxes, speed, rolling through stop signs, etc.

Is there anyone out there who really thinks they have never broken the speed limit?

I concur with your comparison. I laugh to myself as I read the dire statements that pirating an ebook is akin to stealing a car, walking into a home and robbing it, shoplifting, etc.

I, too, have wondered if all those who are lamenting about "piracy" have never driven above the speed limit, have never fudged on their tax returns, have never run a red light, have never bought something that "fell off a truck", have never not returned incorrect change given to them by a cashier, have never made up an excuse as to why their homework or their work wasn't done on time, have never lied about anything in their lives, have never taken advantage of a situation for their own benefit, never taped a movie from the TV onto VHS when we were still being told by the Motion Picture Association that it was illegal to do so, never taped songs onto a cassette from the radio or a record when they were younger, etc.

As far as I'm concerned, only a person who's never done ANY of those things in their lives is the only one who can cast any aspersions on anyone who gets their reading material from alternative sources.

One point that I think is being constantly over-simplified is that "piracy" is an either/or proposition. That someone either gets all of their movies, music, books via alternative sources or that they get none of them that way. That is simply not true. Just because one gets items that way doesn't mean that books, CD's and DVD's aren't still being purchased, too - by those same people. Of course there are going to be people who will never pay for anything; they are the same people who were always going to do things on the cheap their entire lives anyway - that's just their mentality.

But speaking for myself, just because I can get any book that I want via alternative sources doesn't mean that I have stopped buying books; on the contrary, I still buy books so that my favorite authors keep producing them. But I'm not going to look with horror at people who get the majority of their books via alternative means. To me they are the same as people who only read books via the public library system; both groups are not adding any money to the authors' pockets. Just as I personally don't see the difference between downloading an ebook to try out a new author, and parking my butt in Borders or B&N for hours just to read the same book without paying for it.

The only difference is two of the methods of reading a book are socially acceptable forms of "piracy" while the other method isn't.

[ManosHandsOfFate]

Originally Posted by Xanthe

As far as I'm concerned, only a person who's never done ANY of those things in their lives is the only one who can cast any aspersions on anyone who gets their reading material from alternative sources.

Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?

- Matthew 7:3

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by AlbertaCowboy

I prefer to follow the advice from an old saying: "It is better to stay silent and have the world wonder if you are a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt".

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came...

[John F]

Originally Posted by kennyc

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law