The $15 Boycott: Will you be participating?

[windylim]

If the price is too expensive, then I would rather buy a paper book then. I don't agree Apple had little to do with pricing change. Apple was a catalyst to this whole mess.

[Pardoz]

Originally Posted by llreader

It is an interesting theory, one I will keep track of. No one else seems to believe that Apple, who isn't even in the market yet, is imposing prices on the publishers.

Just to be clear, nobody (as far as I know) is suggesting Apple is 'imposing' prices on the publishers. As I've already said, the story was fairly widely reported at the time; it's since been overshadowed by the actual launch announcement of the tablet, and then the Macmillan ultimatum and Amazon's response, but Apple's role still gets discussed here and there.

If they proposed this, they have an angle, and I don't understand why they would want to jack up prices on what is already a marginal product.

Presumably they have a reason they think is good. And remember: Apple isn't in the book market in this scheme, they're just a distribution agent, so if the market tanks they lose nothing. If they can get anything at all (even just extra publicity) they win. They could, for example, see offering to sell e-books as a loss-leader to get into another market they think will be more profitable (all of the Big Six are just tentacles of much larger media conglomerates).

It isn't clear that Apple was pushing for higher prices, even from that article (assuming these rumors are an accurate representation of what really happened).

I don't see how "Sell through us for $15 instead of through Amazon for $10" classifies as anything other than pushing for higher prices, myself. As far as accuracy goes, so far the article's spot on. That article was published before Macmillan handed Amazon their ultimatum, and the price structure it talks about matches precisely the price structure Sargent's letter laid out.

Also, the article says the price would only be for bestsellers, and that isn't what seems to be happening now, so there is some sort of information missing.

The article doesn't say it would only be for best-sellers; best-seller prices are the only thing it mentions, there's a difference. Note that all the public statements we've seen from both Amazon and Macmillan also only mention best-seller prices.

As somebody who can count the number of "best-seller" hardcovers I've bought in the past ten years on the fingers of one hand and have enough digits left over to make the fig at John Sargent, if those were the only titles affected I wouldn't care in the slightest.

[AdamGott]

You forgot to add an option for 'I already am boycotting $15 books.'

I haven't paid this much for a book (paper or electronic) in a long long time, probably never when it comes to fiction books.

[llreader]

This is really getting nit-picky, but I don't think you understood me on a couple of points.

Originally Posted by Pardoz

I don't see how "Sell through us for $15 instead of through Amazon for $10" classifies as anything other than pushing for higher prices, myself.

But I said this:

"It isn't clear that Apple was pushing for higher prices, even from that article (assuming these rumors are an accurate representation of what really happened). We don't know what the publishers were offering - they could have wanted to set the ebook prices to the same as hardcover prices. "

The implication being that $15 is more reasonable (and cheaper) than $25, although I thought that was clear. Again, Apple has no motivation to kill the ebook market. It gains them nothing but potential ill-will and headaches. Better to ignore it completely. The perpetrator needs motivation in a murder case.

Believe whatever you like. I am still not convinced that some vague, second-hand version of the negotiating position of one side in a multi-party agreement implicates Apple as the architect of this mess.

[Lemurion]

The problem I see is that there are a number of misconceptions going around.

1) Macmillan's plan means all ebooks will instantly jump to $15.
2) The going price for all new hardcovers is also $15.

Neither one is completely accurate. Macmillan's announcement listed two prices for ebooks of new hardcovers under the agency model, $14.99 and $12.99; and new hardcovers are often steeply discounted only for the first few weeks before returning to their list price of approximately $25 (possibly with a small discount).

[Pardoz]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

The problem I see is that there are a number of misconceptions going around.

1) Macmillan's plan means all ebooks will instantly jump to $15.
2) The going price for all new hardcovers is also $15.

Neither one is completely accurate.

Indeed. The available evidence indicates that most existing Macmillan e-books will instantly jump to $14, regardless of how many years a $7 mmpb has been available. It seems to be their default backlist e-book price at the moment. Some individual titles may drop below that by accident, of course, and some books that have been available in mmpb for years will go all the way up to new hardcover list, but overall it looks like $14 is the new $6.99.

Myself, I'm hunting down the last few non-Topaz Macmillan e-books on my list. I figure if I pay $7.19 for Emma Bull's Territory right now, John Sargent's telling the truth, and the price drops to $5.99 in a month, I'm only out a buck twenty. But if he's l/y/i/n/g t/h/r/o/u/g/h h/i/s t/e/e/t/h shading the truth and the price shoots up to the $24.95 Macmillan currently has the digital list price at I'm saving almost 17 dollars.

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by bookwurm70

I don't think I've ever paid more than $15 for an ebook. Maybe I've paid $16, but that is about my limit. I know some books have been priced at $7.99 for print and $14.00 for ebooks. I won't buy those either. What I do instead is order them from PaperbackSwap.com and get them for free. You'd think the publisher would rather sell me the book for $8.00 than have me get it for free but that seems to be the choice they are making. I love PBS! It is like a legal "darknet".

I've paid $15 for E-ARC editions from BAEN, but for most e-novels I've usually paid under $10. And yes, this new pricing policy *WILL* force me to drastically cut my ebook purchases. (Do the publishers NOT get that we're in a depressed economy? That many readers don't have that much discretionary income and will NOT choose to forego food or utilities in order to continue to by 'X' number of ebooks at these higher prices?)

Derek

[llreader]

Originally Posted by Pardoz

But if he's l/y/i/n/g t/h/r/o/u/g/h h/i/s t/e/e/t/h shading the truth and the price shoots up to the $24.95 Macmillan currently has the digital list price at I'm saving almost 17 dollars.

LOL, I hear you. That seems like a sound strategy. Luckily, I am all "booked up" at the moment, and can't get through what I have already for a good while.

[Hellmark]

For me, $15 is over the price I am willing to pay. Generally, I limit my ebook purchases to the same price as my paper book purchases, which is $5. I got into ebooks because there was a large number of cheap/free books. Yeah, I know that ruffles some feathers around here, but when you make minimum wage, and reading is one of your primary sources of entertainment, you really cannot afford to drop $15 every couple days on a book. Every now and again, I will pay more than $5 for a book, but it isn't regular habit, and the quality and length of the book comes into play. For instance, on Jim Butcher's books, those usually go between $6 and $8, and I am more than happy to pay for those. Does this limit mean I cannot find many books to read? Not at all. Plenty of great public domain books that can be had for free (always been a fan of the classics), and it introduced me to a large number of small and independent authors. Hanging around here, I see tons of great books get recommended on the cheap, that if I relied on book store ads, literary ads, or the publishers I would have never known about.

While I realize that much of the same work and expenses go into creating an ebook compared to paperbooks, I still refuse to pay more for an ebook than the paper book prices. It isn't uncommon for me to find books at borders or <insert your local bookstore> for quite a bit cheaper than the cheapest ebook price.

[MilDoc]

Many books that are priced at $15 for the Kindle, are $7.99 for the paperback version. I REFUSE to pay a $7.01 markup when "publishing" costs are MUCH lower for ebooks.

If this keeps up, my Kindle will soon be gathering dust as I revert to reading paperbacks.

Reminds me of the first CDs available in the 80s, all at $15.99 or more while LPs were $7.99. "Oh, the price will drop as more players are sold." Uh huh, sure. Most of my favorite singers are still above $15 for new releases.

Don't buy into this ripoff folks. At least, not until paperbacks disappear and go the way of LPs.

[HamsterRage]

Originally Posted by tompe

But they are in the long run and in the process they will destroy publishing and cause less good books to be published.

I can't agree with that. What they will do is destroy traditional publishing which is on borrowed time now that ereading is starting to really pick up steam. They'll follow pretty much the same model as the recording industry has, but way, way faster.

And the result won't be less good books published, but way more good books published as those big publishing houses will lose their status as the gatekeepers for the publishing industry. There will also be a ton more crud published, for sure, but there are going to be more and more on-line communities that help readers find the good stuff.

[BenLee]

I'm gonna do for this what I do for every other book.

Look at how much the paper versions go for.
Look at the value I could potentially get out of the content (some books are worth waaay more than $15 in their actual value)
Make a decision.

I'm not gonna totally boycott a company just to prove a point. It might hurt me more than them because I will miss out on books I would have otherwise read.

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by BenLee

I'm gonna do for this what I do for every other book.

Look at how much the paper versions go for.
Look at the value I could potentially get out of the content (some books are worth waaay more than $15 in their actual value)
Make a decision.

I'm not gonna totally boycott a company just to prove a point. It might hurt me more than them because I will miss out on books I would have otherwise read.

I just LOVE when common sense is applied in real life!!!

[DawnFalcon]

Doesn't mean you need to buy the book NEW, though.

[Fbone]

Originally Posted by BenLee

I'm gonna do for this what I do for every other book.

Look at how much the paper versions go for.
Look at the value I could potentially get out of the content (some books are worth waaay more than $15 in their actual value)
Make a decision.

I'm not gonna totally boycott a company just to prove a point. It might hurt me more than them because I will miss out on books I would have otherwise read.

For myself I'll add library availability to the list.