Downloaded books cost how much? - Page 3

HarryT · 07-31-2007, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlauzon

Yes, I have a large number of them sitting on my hard drive, ready to be read. So I do know how long it takes and it takes about 3 clicks of the mouse.

And did you write these books yourself? If not, do you believe that the people who did write them did so free of charge, and don't expect to be paid for doing so?

HarryT · 07-31-2007, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

Speaking for myself, when I convert a book of mine into an e-book format, I have to:

Alter the text file with appropriate headers, chapters, etc for the format;
Possibly doublespace the paragraphs, or substitute paragraph tabs with an extra hard space;
Input text into e-book creation software;
Input cover (a whole 'nother ball game);
Format the e-book meta-files with title, subject, author, copyright data, etc;
Create e-book;
Go back and proof the file, to make sure everything came out properly, and looks right. If something is wrong, I may have to go back to the original text file and start over;
Repeat for the other 5 formats I save each book in.

You couldn't even macro that into just 3 clicks. And every serious publisher is going to have to go through at least all of those steps on each book they format. It may not be a time-consuming process (other than writing and proofing time), but it is step-intensive.

Another very important element is the editor who works with the author. I'm sure that you can write good, grammatical English, Steve, but as you know, people who can are in the minority. Most authors need serious help from an editor to convert the mess they turn out into something that can be published. Good editors spend a lot of time with authors, and that doesn't come cheap - it all has to be recouped as a part of the price of the book.

Jack B Nimble · 07-31-2007, 02:53 PM

Wow... I don't even want to get into some of the arguments floating around here... It's getting pretty silly. To get back to the subject of the thread...

I will say that I think ebooks would do best as another step in the hardcover-paperback chain. Hardcovers starting at $18-30. Wait 12-18 months and get the paperback for $7-15. Wait another year or so for another chunk off, say $4-8.

JSWolf · 07-31-2007, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlauzon

Then you are using a poor tool.

Let's say I give you an RTF file with NO bookmark links. How will you get it formatted into LRF with ToC links properly in the file?

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Another very important element is the editor who works with the author. I'm sure that you can write good, grammatical English, Steve, but as you know, people who can are in the minority. Most authors need serious help from an editor to convert the mess they turn out into something that can be published. Good editors spend a lot of time with authors, and that doesn't come cheap - it all has to be recouped as a part of the price of the book.

But it's still not an excuse for pricing an eBook the same as a pBook.

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack B Nimble

Wow... I don't even want to get into some of the arguments floating around here... It's getting pretty silly. To get back to the subject of the thread...

I will say that I think ebooks would do best as another step in the hardcover-paperback chain. Hardcovers starting at $18-30. Wait 12-18 months and get the paperback for $7-15. Wait another year or so for another chunk off, say $4-8.

The only problem is that before 2 years goes by, it will be available as a pirated eBook.

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Let's say I give you an RTF file with NO bookmark links. How will you get it formatted into LRF with ToC links properly in the file?

Since LRF is a closed, Sony-proprietary format, I won't.

JSWolf · 07-31-2007, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlauzon

Since LRF is a closed, Sony-proprietary format, I won't.

Then you know it's a lot more then 3-6 clicks to do this conversion. You won't do it because you know I'm right. And by the way, LRF is DRM free.

I bet even Adobe will have Digital Editions DRM protected up the wazoo.

RWood · 07-31-2007, 05:46 PM

I think all of us are overestimating the cost of the physical media for a book. Most of the wholesale cost of a book is not the physical book itself but the author's piece, the publisher's overhead, and the staff to prepare the book.

rlauzon is correct that ebooks cost less to produce but they still have to contribute to the general expenses of the book. The marginal expense per ebook is very low. The publishers see an ebook sale as a replacement sale for a pbook and still want to recover the general expenses from it.

There was an old joke in the publishing industry about $1 books. "The first copy is $1,000,000. After that they're $1 each. Now we just have to find someone to buy that first copy."

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Then you know it's a lot more then 3-6 clicks to do this conversion. You won't do it because you know I'm right. And by the way, LRF is DRM free.

Given an LRF file, can I "decompile" it? Can I change that LRF file into an open format?

If the answer is "no", then it's the same as having DRM on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I bet even Adobe will have Digital Editions DRM protected up the wazoo.

Won't touch that trash either.

RWood · 07-31-2007, 05:54 PM

There is a free program called ABC Amber Sony Converter that will convert an LRF file to RTF, PDF, DOC, TEXT, etc.

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWood

There is a free program called ABC Amber Sony Converter that will convert an LRF file to RTF, PDF, DOC, TEXT, etc.

Free as in beer, not free as in freedom (sorry, I just watched a Stallman video 8-)).

The utility does not come with source code and requires that you use a buggy, insecure, proprietary operating system. Useless.

RWood · 07-31-2007, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlauzon

Free as in beer, not free as in freedom (sorry, I just watched a Stallman video 8-)).

The utility does not come with source code and requires that you use a buggy, insecure, proprietary operating system. Useless.

Very true; but then I've had problems getting DEC TOPS-10 or IBM MVS/370 opsys to run on Intel chips.

JSWolf · 07-31-2007, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rlauzon

Given an LRF file, can I "decompile" it? Can I change that LRF file into an open format?

There is a Python program called lrf2lrs and you could modify the Python code to output into any format you wanted from the LRF. So yes you CAN decompile it.

rlauzon · 07-31-2007, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

There is a Python program called lrf2lrs and you could modify the Python code to output into any format you wanted from the LRF. So yes you CAN decompile it.

The output from it leaves much to be desired since LRS is not a standard format. I suppose I could write a XSL for it into something useful.

But, yes, it does decompile it into something that can be converted to something useful.

But I'll restate once again: Support of closed formats only sends the wrong message to the eBook manufacturers. It tells them that we like re-converting our eBooks every time we get a new reader.

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07-31-2007, 02:53 PM	#33
Jack B Nimble Groupie Posts: 154 Karma: 672 Join Date: Oct 2006 Device: Tapwave Zodiac, eBookwise 1150	Wow... I don't even want to get into some of the arguments floating around here... It's getting pretty silly. To get back to the subject of the thread... I will say that I think ebooks would do best as another step in the hardcover-paperback chain. Hardcovers starting at $18-30. Wait 12-18 months and get the paperback for $7-15. Wait another year or so for another chunk off, say $4-8.

07-31-2007, 05:46 PM	#39
RWood Technogeezer Posts: 7,233 Karma: 1601464 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Virginia, USA Device: Sony PRS-500	I think all of us are overestimating the cost of the physical media for a book. Most of the wholesale cost of a book is not the physical book itself but the author's piece, the publisher's overhead, and the staff to prepare the book. rlauzon is correct that ebooks cost less to produce but they still have to contribute to the general expenses of the book. The marginal expense per ebook is very low. The publishers see an ebook sale as a replacement sale for a pbook and still want to recover the general expenses from it. There was an old joke in the publishing industry about $1 books. "The first copy is $1,000,000. After that they're $1 each. Now we just have to find someone to buy that first copy."

07-31-2007, 05:54 PM	#41
RWood Technogeezer Posts: 7,233 Karma: 1601464 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Virginia, USA Device: Sony PRS-500	There is a free program called ABC Amber Sony Converter that will convert an LRF file to RTF, PDF, DOC, TEXT, etc.