Going Rogue

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

I'm not covered under the current system (and I like it that way).

You don't have health insurance? I hope you don't ever get sick.

A family member on my wife's side had to go to the emergency room. Because he has no insurance, he was not considered a priority patient. After several hours of agony, he left without treatment. Here's a man whose condition is so severe he can hardly stand or walk. To say he's fallen through the cracks would be an understatement.

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by WT Sharpe

I know what isn't covered under the current system: many members of my own family, including my eight-year old grandson.

You are only covered under 'the current system' if you are willing to make sacrifices to afford the health care premiums.

I gag each month I sen that $585 check to my insurance company......just for myself.

I'm also of the belief its my own responsibility to pay for my own insurance.......house, car, and health. Hey........I can't help the way I feel. I was raised that way.

I"d rather my government concentrate on keeping us safe from outside (and inside) attacks, put more money into education, cut the rampant corruption (HA!) and help those truly in need.

I'd also like to keep more jobs here.....but hey........as long as we're wishing......

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

... I'm also of the belief its my own responsibility to pay for my own insurance.......house, car, and health. Hey........I can't help the way I feel. I was raised that way...

I was watching a video this morning about a health-care worker who treated others in a free clinic, but couldn't afford health care for himself. He tried to get more hours but was unable.

There's got to be something wrong with these irresponsible people who chose to do other things with their money than spend $585.00 each month on health insurance -- like, for instance, wasting their money on trivialities like food and shelter.

[WT Sharpe]

I keep coming back to what Steven Waldman, Editor-In-Chief and Co-Founder of BeliefNet, said about the current status of health care in the U.S.:

* A system is immoral if it allows (or encourages) insurance companies to turn you away exactly when you need help most. (Thanks to exclusions for "pre-existing conditions.") That's unfair.
* A system is immoral if it allows (and incentivizes) insurance companies to write policies full of fine print that leaves shocked patients with devastating bills. That's dishonest.
* A system is immoral if it means that losing one's job means not only losing income but the ability to take your child to the doctor. That's cruel.
* A system is immoral if it forces people to stay in jobs that they hate because they don't want to lose their health coverage. That's tragic.

[pilotbob]

The economy does seem a bit better now than it did a year ago... but we don't know what would have happened if we didn't have massive bailouts and "stimulas" bills...

I mean, explain to me how when your broke spending MORE money that you don't have is the answer? Any business will tell you you have to:

1. Cut spending.
2. Be more effecient with the resources you have.
3. Bring in more money somehow.

As much as we all want lower taxes, how does cutting taxes and spending more money help (yes this was Bush for 8 years too).

Frankly, I think the FairTax will help with 2 and 3 quite a bit.

BOb

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by WT Sharpe

I keep coming back to what Steven Waldman, Editor-In-Chief and Co-Founder of BeliefNet, said about the current status of health care in the U.S.:

* A system is immoral if it allows (or encourages) insurance companies to turn you away exactly when you need help most. (Thanks to exclusions for "pre-existing conditions.") That's unfair.
* A system is immoral if it allows (and incentivizes) insurance companies to write policies full of fine print that leaves shocked patients with devastating bills. That's dishonest.
* A system is immoral if it means that losing one's job means not only losing income but the ability to take your child to the doctor. That's cruel.
* A system is immoral if it forces people to stay in jobs that they hate because they don't want to lose their health coverage. That's tragic.

And so you think having our government screw around with the current system is a better idea?

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

And so you think having our government screw around with the current system is a better idea?

At present, our health care system is the worst in the industrialized world, because it remains available only to those who can afford it. In no other Western country is a major illness practically a guarantee of poverty. This is disgraceful.

Those of you from other countries, let's hear from you. Would you trade what you have for the USA system?

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

And so you think having our government screw around with the current system is a better idea?

Yes. Because it's broke.

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Yes. Because it's broke.

Well, in that case let's have the government fix the health care systems it already runs. They're also broken. Then we can talk about it taking on another one.

[Moejoe]

Originally Posted by WT Sharpe

At present, our health care system is the worst in the industrialized world, because it remains available only to those who can afford it. In no other Western country is a major illness practically a guarantee of poverty. This is disgraceful.

Those of you from other countries, let's hear from you. Would you trade what you have for the USA system?

To be brutally honest, what you have in the USA scares the living hell out of me. My country isn't great by any stretch of the imagination, there's still a lot of inequity, but compared to what you have in the US, it's like a dreamland.

I just don't get it on a human level, how anybody could be refused treatment because of money. It's sickening, degrading, and yes... it's evil. When money comes before human beings then everything is wrong.

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

And so you think having our government screw around with the current system is a better idea?

Actually, it is the government that makes it so screwy in the first place actually. Something has to change... cause what we have sucks. You really think we should continue with the status quo? Could things get worse.. sadly yes.... but there is ALOT of room for improvement.

But, actually, I think we need to remove alot of regulation, not add more. For example, why can't health insurers compete over state lines? That's crazy.... if any company could provide insurance in all the states then there would be more competition.

My mom is a nurse and she claimed 30-40 years ago things were better because Drs all donated time at free clinics so that people that didn't have insurance could still get health care.

I don't think there is any one best answer.... but anything has got to be better than what we have now. And if we don't try we are stuck with it.

I'm sure you've heard the term, if you keep doing what you are doing, you'll keep getting what you are getting.

BOb

[kennyc]

To get a bit back on topic here's a Fact Check on the book:

http://www.mercurynews.com/politics-...nt/ci_13810300

Some interesting reviews showing up on Amazon

http://www.amazon.com/Going-Rogue-Am...8511998&sr=8-1

WSJ Review:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...681089404.html

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by WT Sharpe

Those of you from other countries, let's hear from you. Would you trade what you have for the USA system?

excuse me? Would you trade the freedoms, opportunities, lifestyle you have here for any other countries system?
As

Originally Posted by WT Sharpe

There's got to be something wrong with these irresponsible people who chose to do other things with their money than spend $585.00 each month on health insurance -- like, for instance, wasting their money on trivialities like food and shelter.

Oh please. The age old whine. What, you think people who have insurance don't make sacrifices? Its not just "for the rich". Its for those who are willing to have less, way less in some cases in order to guarantee no one else has to pay for their ill health.

[WT Sharpe]

[QUOTE=desertgrandma;660438]excuse me? Would you trade the freedoms, opportunities, lifestyle you have here for any other countries system?
As

Our health care system I would trade for any other Western democracy's; which, in context of the full post, is all I was speaking about.

[Nate the great]

[QUOTE=WT Sharpe;660444]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

excuse me? Would you trade the freedoms, opportunities, lifestyle you have here for any other countries system?
As

Our health care system I would trade for any other Western democracy's; which, in context of the full post, is all I was speaking about.

You are more than wlecome to move to one of those countries and use their system. There is no need to try to bring it here.