Idiotic writers...

[Donnageddon]

And I hope your company doesn't go out of business. Insurance is a real expensive luxury when you are out of work.

[Donnageddon]

I am done here. The healthcare debate is not going to be settled on MobileRead.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

I am done here. The healthcare debate is not going to be settled on MobileRead.

No, but I've found it enlightening.

[GeoffC]

Originally Posted by Patricia

This is also true in the UK. If a person doesn't want NHS treatment then they are free to go for private treatment. And there are insurance companies, such as BUPA, which organise private healthcare schemes.

I'm quite happy with NHS treatment, though occasionally have private dental work because I prefer my old amalgam fillings to be replaced with more aesthetically pleasing white ones.

Yes there are issues with the NHS that could be improved. But medically my family and I have had to call on these services and rarely have we found them lacking.
Dental treatment and opticians are the only ones where we have experience with the 'private' options and the main complaint would be they are costly.....
£600.00 for a main pair of spectacles and supposedly 'free' back-up pair !

[Laz116]

Originally Posted by kazbates

Some of my best friends live in trailer parks.

Laz116, your first question about healthcare in this country seemed to imply that you had an open mind and were seeking information as to why the opposition to standardized healthcare felt the way that they do. However, when Nate and others tried to explain it, you digressed into calling them narrow minded and bashing the policies of the United States and, indeed, pulled out the racist card.

I call them narrowminded, if the answer is that the USA already has the best system in the world, and all the data that says otherwise are just corrupt.

I didn't bring up race. Madam Broskina did.

If the message is that the US is just the best whether it comes to Health care, education, tolerance etc., while all other countries with their backwards "socialized" medicine is far worse off, then it's hard to take seriously.

I've worked as both a federal and state employee. I've seen how government agencies work and the LAST thing I want is some government bureaucracy running my healthcare. For the record, I don't like the way my insurance company runs it either, but they've at least got some experience doing it.

But it doesn't have to be one or the other. It's quite possible to have both private and public health care side by side. What you are arguing, is that the system should be totally static, because every change involves someone without experience taking on a new field of work.

Finally, as a teacher in what you call "socialized" education, I would love to get the bureaucrats out of my hair and let educators run the system. At least they would know what actually happens in the classroom.

That is indeed a problem. Also here in Denmark.

Anyways: This thread was somewhat enlightening after all. Although I still fail to understand the level of emotion brought into this topic. But that's probably because I live in a country where we are used to the government sticking its nose into everything.

[Laz116]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

I am done here. The healthcare debate is not going to be settled on MobileRead.

No debate is ever settled over the internet. But still even when the waves get high and people are at their most stubborn position, I find that I think about the opinions afterwards. Even those I immediately dismiss in the actual ongoing debate.

[pking36330]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Health services are like armed forces - everyone thinks there's is the best in the world. .

But everyone KNOWS their is one 'best in the world' armed forces. Not a very similar comparison.

[rhadin]

I find it interesting that many opponents of healthcare reform in the U.S. are anti-socialized medicine but can't wait to get on Medicare, which is government-run medicine that works very well.

Part of the problem is that too many Americans are sheltered from the true costs of medical insurance and medical treatment and do not realize or understand its impact on their wages. When helath insurance costs a single worker $25 per month because the employer is picking up the remaining $450 of the monthly premium, there is no grasp of the real costs. OTOH, those of us who have to pay the full premium or do without have a different perspective, just as those who have to pay the full costs of medical treatment have a different understanding of the problem than do those who pay a small copay only because they are insured.

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by corroonb

Am I misinformed that one of the main causes of debt in the US is healthcare?

No, you are not misinformed. Health care costs are the leading cause of personal bankruptcy in the U.S.

Many of the subsidized programs fail to meet the needs of the struggling middle class because the middle class cannot qualify for coverage. Nate is correct about our taxes already supporting healthcare; the problem is that the programs are not open to large segments of the population who are currently uninsured or underinsured, are subject to funding whims depending on whether conservatives or liberals control the fiscal purse, and are necessary because we do not have universal healthcare. Although no panacea, universal healthcare would probably stabilize, possibly even reduce, the taxes we pay toward providing healthcare for the uninsured.

[kazbates]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

Kaz, in what way does your insurance company "run your healthcare". What is their "experience" with healthcare? How does their involvement effect your healthcare?

In what way do you think "government" would "run your healthcare" under the current proposals?

Wouldn't it be nice to get the Insurance company bureaucrats out of your doctors hair?

I should have been more clear in my comments about the insurance company. At the moment, I am going through some extensive dental procedures that are very costly. I have 2 dental insurance policies, one which is primary, the other which is considered supplemental. They periodontist has filed claims, but because the supplemental happened to receive it before the primary, they denied the claim. It's all frustrating and it was that situation that I was thinking about when I made my post. As far as my medical coverage is concerned, they have always taken care of everything with very little input from me.

I absolutely do feel that there needs to be healthcare reform in this country. The system is a mess. I just don't think we need to rush through reform because the democrats control congress. I think we should look at all the other healthcare systems around the world, pick them apart to find their strengths and weakness and develop a plan that makes the most of the strengths. If I felt my government was doing that, I would support it 100%. Unfortunately, I think too many are letting emotions and personal interests get in the way and I think there is a great deal of misinformation coming from both sides of the argument. When my husband lost his job 6 years ago, we were forced to buy health insurance. When my daughter reached 22, she was no longer eligible for healthcare on my husband's plan, so we had to pay $250 a month for her health insurance until she started her job. So you can see, I have been in the same situation as many of middle class Americans. I want my congress to stop all the negative rhetoric and get down to business that helps everyone, not just those who they think are supporting their ideologies.

Bottom line, I honestly don't know what the proposals in both of the houses of congress look like, nor do I think most of the members of congress have a good enough handle on them. I'm willing to hold my judgment until I have a chance to read the proposals.

Originally Posted by Laz116

I call them narrowminded, if the answer is that the USA already has the best system in the world, and all the data that says otherwise are just corrupt.

I didn't bring up race. Madam Broskina did.

If the message is that the US is just the best whether it comes to Health care, education, tolerance etc., while all other countries with their backwards "socialized" medicine is far worse off, then it's hard to take seriously.


But it doesn't have to be one or the other. It's quite possible to have both private and public health care side by side. What you are arguing, is that the system should be totally static, because every change involves someone without experience taking on a new field of work.



That is indeed a problem. Also here in Denmark.

Anyways: This thread was somewhat enlightening after all. Although I still fail to understand the level of emotion brought into this topic. But that's probably because I live in a country where we are used to the government sticking its nose into everything.

Narrow-minded is still a negative comment and unnecessary in a debate.

Madame B. brought up our election of Barack Obama as a way to respond to your comment: "After all: what other measurement is there for developed nations, other than how you treat the minorities and the weak?" And it was your comment: "You elected a man half black, half white. And it was and still is a big controversy. A lot of people in the us still thinks he is the devil incarnate.", to which I was referring. I don't believe our president's race is as big an issue here in the US as you seem to think.

I am not arguing for a "static" system. I want change, too. I just want to make sure that it is well thought out and planned change.

I'm sorry you have such a negative view of my country. I think it's a pretty special place and the majority of people here are good and caring. What you see in the media or read in blogs is little more than a snapshot and usually skewed to a particular viewpoint. One of my favorite sayings to my students is, "Don't judge a book by it's cover." If you read only liberal news, you will think that conservatives are destroying the country and vice versa. The majority of Americans are centrists. We walk that narrow line right down the middle and try to make the best decisions for our families based on our own views and opinions and what lies in our hearts.