Vegetarian?

[DixieGal]

Originally Posted by griffonwing

You'll have to make me one special

Sure, do you prefer the eyeballs or cloven hooves? (The other dark meat?)

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by krisk

you are clueless about dairy farms and dairy cows. as was the person clueless about shearing (sheep are NOT killed by shearing!)

this thread has become a litany of unfacts being strewn about at will.

Actually, shearing can lead to sheep deaths:

http://medical-dictionary.thefreedic...y.com/shearing

[krisk]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Actually, shearing can lead to sheep deaths:

http://medical-dictionary.thefreedic...y.com/shearing

you really are displaying your troll side. having attended numerous shearing sessions on the reservations and seen literally thousands of sheep shorn, I'd be happy to answer any legitimate questions about the dangers of shearing to sheep.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by krisk

you really are displaying your troll side. having attended numerous shearing sessions on the reservations and seen literally thousands of sheep shorn, I'd be happy to answer any legitimate questions about the dangers of shearing to sheep.

Are sheep at greater risk of dying from hypothermia after shearing, if the weather turns bad in the Yorkshire fells, than they would be if they hadn't been shorn?

[griffonwing]

You can knit them wool sweaters!!!

[griffonwing]

Dixie

I was referring to the Falafel, not the gyro

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by griffonwing

You can knit them wool sweaters!!!

- luckily there is a different solution.

http://www.agriculture.gov.fk/october_2007.pdf

"Imagine being left outside in freezing weather without any clothes on or standing naked for hours under a fierce sun. It's not much fun for newly sheared sheep in Australia, some of whom die of hypothermia or heat stress within days of having their fleeces removed. Help may be at hand, however, after a chemist claimed yesterday to have developed a spray to protect delicate sheepskin from the harsh Australian elements. Henry King said his biodegradable lanolin-based spray acts like an invisible raincoat on shorn sheep and can also be used as a sunscreen."

[DixieGal]

Can it be used by humans? I love what lanolin lotion does to my skin, but it is getting rare in US lotions.

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by DixieGal

Can it be used by humans? I love what lanolin lotion does to my skin, but it is getting rare in US lotions.

Have you tried asking for it with a sheepish expression?

[ShortNCuddlyAm]

Originally Posted by DixieGal

Can it be used by humans? I love what lanolin lotion does to my skin, but it is getting rare in US lotions.

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Have you tried asking for it with a sheepish expression?

[griffonwing]

You could always use eBay. It's the best place to purchase stuff you normally can't get here in the states.

I just purchased a new phone that you can't get here. It should be in tomorrow, thenI'll activate it. Then I'll call me mum. She'll be so happy. And she'll freak when she sees it.

[DixieGal]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Have you tried asking for it with a sheepish expression?

Baaa! Baaa!

Speaking of sheep, how come whenever you visit your in-laws in the country, there are always goat footprints on the car when you get ready to leave? Or doesn't everyone's in-laws have goats running around in their yards?

And is it kosher to let said goats eat the fiberglass insulation from under your house, you know, where the wheels were when it was delivered. Because they do, you know.

[griffonwing]

Originally Posted by DixieGal

Baaa! Baaa!

Speaking of sheep, how come whenever you visit your in-laws in the country, there are always goat footprints on the car when you get ready to leave? Or doesn't everyone's in-laws have goats running around in their yards?

goats love to climb. simple as that

[disney_mommy]

Originally Posted by griffonwing

Actually, let me restate again, but this change the inflection.

ANIMALS
Yes, some/many/most of the huge meat farms don't give a toss about the care of the animal in question. After all, they will soon be out of their misery, and in my casserole dish, so really, what should it matter? I'm sure this is the point of view of most people in the trade, from chicken farms, to turkey farms, to cattle farms. They raise animals solely to use for food.

I never said it was how I thought, but how those in the trade might think.

I never meant to imply that was how you felt. I was simply responding to your comment.

Originally Posted by griffonwing

Just as there are organically 'pure', pesticide-free veggie gardens, so are there smaller, even substantial-sized, organic free-range chicken farms that do not mistreat their stock. But the doesn't mean that the other, darker side of both veggies and meat don't exist.

Nobody is denying they exist. They will continue to do so until enough people stand up and demand change.

Originally Posted by griffonwing

I won't even get into the argument you ended with, about how we 'just happened' to get to the top of the food chain. That, to me, is not even worth pursuing.

Why?

I completely agree - we are all free to make our own decisions, and I certainly do not condemn you for yours. I thought we were just having a spirited debate.

Originally Posted by griffonwing

PS, the battle of wits comment. You took that entirely out of context as well. I wasn't expecting an argument or tirade from anyone. It was merely a little quip meant to draw out a chuckle and to kind of nudge people against throwing a fit.

I nudged back. Apparently my joke wasn't as obvious as I thought!

Originally Posted by krisk

you are clueless about dairy farms and dairy cows. as was the person clueless about shearing (sheep are NOT killed by shearing!)

this thread has become a litany of unfacts being strewn about at will.

Please explain.

Originally Posted by krisk

I wasn't name calling. y'all know whan I am. I grew up on and around farms and ranches. and yes I deplore the big industrial spreads, the small places are very neat, clean and healthy. that doesn't get around the FACT that a stressed cow will not milk. milk cows are treated extremely well even by the jerks.

Did you grow up on all of the farms and ranches? Have you been to every one and can verify that they treat their animals humanely? If so, then I take it back. However, I am certain there are people out there that do whatever they can to make the almighty dollar. And that includes everything I mentioned above. I also forgot to mention the fact that once the milk production has declined, which it does, even with the most powerful hormones, the cows are artificially inseminated so they can lactate all over again. That is, the cows that aren't slaughtered to make room for the new young cows who can produce more milk.

[Laz116]

Originally Posted by disney_mommy

Did you grow up on all of the farms and ranches? Have you been to every one and can verify that they treat their animals humanely? If so, then I take it back. However, I am certain there are people out there that do whatever they can to make the almighty dollar. And that includes everything I mentioned above. I also forgot to mention the fact that once the milk production has declined, which it does, even with the most powerful hormones, the cows are artificially inseminated so they can lactate all over again. That is, the cows that aren't slaughtered to make room for the new young cows who can produce more milk.

You're starting to paint a picture that farmers are evil or something like that. I disagree. Most of them just try to get by imo. The responsibility lies just as much at the big corporations of the food industry, the governments for failing to regulate the industry and ultimately at the end consumer, who in most cases don't really care that much about the well being of the animals. If we aren't willing to pay for quality, we end up with crap. It's as simple as that. However if we were willing to pay for quality we still need the government to make sure that we're actually not just fattening the wallet of the food industry but are getting a better product.

As I mentioned earlier in this thread a farmer in Denmark got about 23 pence pr chicken in the fifties, today he gets twenty pence. That is an enormous difference when you take inflation into account. The only way for the farmer to make a living today is to increase volume and lessen the time it takes to grow a chicken - at the cost of animal welfare. Ultimately the reason for this is that there seems to be a higher demand for chickens that costs 4$ but are treated badly, than there is for chicken that costs 15$ and are treated well.