To speak or not to speak the local language when visiting other countries?

[vivaldirules]

Originally Posted by HarryT

But suppose you did come across a visitor from a different country looking for help. Would such a person be better off asking in even the most "broken" of English, or in French, Japanese, or whatever their native language happens to be?

No doubt, one of us would best need to know the other's language - and would unlikely to be me!

[Bilbo1967]

Have to say that I always try to learn at least a few words ('please', 'thankyou', 'hello', 'goodbye', 'a large beer please' - you know, the essentials). Having said that though, I couldn't manage even that in Finland in February and I'm only getting there in Slovakian because I've been there 4 times this year!

I do get quite annoyed though when I try to speak the local language and the local responds in English. This normally happens to me in France and Germany and I guess they are just trying to be helpful but I feel like it should be me making the effort, not them.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by HarryT

But suppose you did come across a visitor from a different country looking for help. Would such a person be better off asking in even the most "broken" of English, or in French, Japanese, or whatever their native language happens to be?

If somebody were to come asking me for directions, only speaking in French, Japanese, or whatever his native language happens to be, I doubt if I'll respond (at least usefully). If they try even in broken English, at least I'll know what he's asking and can try to help him.

I can give an example of that...

Way back when, when I was still young, we went interrailing (3 weeks, going by train all across Denmark, Germany, Austria and Switzerland). We first went to Denmark. At the train station in Copenhagen there was an interrail "office" (run by students mostly, to help interrailers find lodging and other interesting things in Copenhagen). We had just asked for directions (in English, we first asked which language they wanted to use, as we didn't speak Danish) for lodging when two French guys came in. They started talking in French (and those French can talk fast!), but those two behind the counter made clear they didn't speak French at all. But those two French guys apparently only spoke French as they never switched language... If they had only spoken a little bit of English or German, they would have been able to get their questions across, even with broken sentences only.

Originally Posted by Bilbo1967

I do get quite annoyed though when I try to speak the local language and the local responds in English. This normally happens to me in France and Germany and I guess they are just trying to be helpful but I feel like it should be me making the effort, not them.

Usually, once they see you tried at least, they're generally very helpful and most often don'd mind making the effort.

Those two French guys didn't even try and the two Danish guys finally just ignored them...

[mores]

Originally Posted by Bilbo1967

I do get quite annoyed though when I try to speak the local language and the local responds in English. This normally happens to me in France and Germany and I guess they are just trying to be helpful but I feel like it should be me making the effort, not them.

I guess they wish to "reward" you for your efforts. Then again, maybe your german or french is so bad they feel you will probably not understand them

I appreciate it when someone tries, at least, to speak in my native language, but sometimes, when I reply and get a blank stare, I offer to switch to something we both understand better. No use giving directions when all the other guy understands is the general direction you indicate with your hand.

That said, I went to france 2 weeks ago and was at one time pretty annoyed when the french lady in the store tried to speak english to me. My french is pretty good, and I was asking for a "thingie for an allergic nose". I mean, doesn't it count for anything that I can say "thingie" in french?

[Bilbo1967]

Originally Posted by mores

I guess they wish to "reward" you for your efforts. Then again, maybe your german or french is so bad they feel you will probably not understand them

I think you may be right - maybe my French/German isn't as good as I thought (mind you, I never thought it was that good!) and its just common courtesy on the part of the people I'm talking to.

What we need is one common language; Esperanto, anyone?

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Madam Broshkina

When I lived in Italy (Napoli) I used to think that my grasp of Italian was pretty darn good. I learned I was wrong on a trip to Rome. I was driving around the city trying to find my hotel and was hopelessly lost. I decided to ask a gentlemen "Scuzi Senor, dove Albergo Royal Palace" (Sir where is the Royal Palace Hotel.) He pointed left and said "Sinistra." I thanked him and was on my way to a street called Via Sinistra. Drove about 30 more minutes and could not find Via Sinistra. Asked another gentlemen "Dove Sinistra" and he looked at me strangely and pointed left. I am getting closer I thought to myself. After asking two more people which way Sinistra was and getting the same answer I finally decided to break out my Italian/American Phrase book to learn that sinistra means left. So I spent about 3 hours asking Italians which way is left. I finally did find my hotel and had a wonderful time. Later my grasp of Italian was so good that I had a job calling Bingo at an American and Italian club. B two, B DOO-eh I could say with confidence.

brilliant story madam b.

Originally Posted by mores

I guess they wish to "reward" you for your efforts. Then again, maybe your german or french is so bad they feel you will probably not understand them

I appreciate it when someone tries, at least, to speak in my native language, but sometimes, when I reply and get a blank stare, I offer to switch to something we both understand better. No use giving directions when all the other guy understands is the general direction you indicate with your hand.

i usually switch to english if a tourist seems not to speak much french (but did make the effort) for the same reasons.

That said, I went to france 2 weeks ago and was at one time pretty annoyed when the french lady in the store tried to speak english to me. My french is pretty good, and I was asking for a "thingie for an allergic nose". I mean, doesn't it count for anything that I can say "thingie" in french?

well, i'm very impressed, if that makes you feel better.

[Stitchawl]

It's simply polite to make an effort to speak another person's language, no matter if you are in their country or they are in yours. It's communication. But there is no real need to learn more than 3-4 'polite' words. The rest can always be done with pictures.

Pictures usually work. I never leave the house without a small pocket notebook and a pen. I might not know the local word for 'post office' but I can draw a picture of a letter with a stamp on it. (This gets a bit dicey when trying to find a gynecologist.) A quick 'excuse me' in the local language for good manners, then a picture, and finish with 'thanks,' again in the lingua franca and you're on your way. No one is embarrassed or upset and perhaps you'll make a friend!

Stitchawl

[Greg Anos]

This is why I don't tour in most foreign countries. My language skills are terrible, (not for lack of trying) and the most important thing of touring a foreign country is meeting the people (or so it seems to me). And you can't do it without learning at least some of the language. Or so this "ugly American" feels.

(I can never sort out another language in my mind. It always becomes an auxillary vocabulary to English to me. and after I tried to learn two languages (German after Spanish), they both got lumped into the same "aux vocabulary" and get mangled together. The result are..ahem...interesting, to say the least. But I can sound like I'm from the barrios, a la Cheech and Chong, mainly because I am...)

[GraceKrispy]

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

Pictures usually work. I never leave the house without a small pocket notebook and a pen. I might not know the local word for 'post office' but I can draw a picture of a letter with a stamp on it. (This gets a bit dicey when trying to find a gynecologist.)
Stitchawl

And people wonder why I'm so gender confused. I only just found out this morning that *you* are male, then you go and write something like this! What's a person to think? Either you are a male with a unique set of equipment, or you like to help your wife/gf/so'random women off the street find gynos in foreign countries? I could come up with a few more guesses, but they're grossing me out, so I'll stop.

STOP GENDER CONFUSION!

[Stitchawl]

Originally Posted by GraceKrispy

And people wonder why I'm so gender confused. I only just found out this morning that *you* are male, then you go and write something like this! What's a person to think? Either you are a male with a unique set of equipment, or you like to help your wife/gf/so'random women off the street find gynos in foreign countries? I could come up with a few more guesses, but they're grossing me out, so I'll stop.

STOP GENDER CONFUSION!

The problem is.... I've spent the past 20 years abroad...


Stitchawl

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

It's simply polite to make an effort to speak another person's language, no matter if you are in their country or they are in yours. It's communication. But there is no real need to learn more than 3-4 'polite' words. The rest can always be done with pictures.

Pictures usually work. I never leave the house without a small pocket notebook and a pen. I might not know the local word for 'post office' but I can draw a picture of a letter with a stamp on it. (This gets a bit dicey when trying to find a gynecologist.) A quick 'excuse me' in the local language for good manners, then a picture, and finish with 'thanks,' again in the lingua franca and you're on your way. No one is embarrassed or upset and perhaps you'll make a friend!

Stitchawl

Originally Posted by GraceKrispy

And people wonder why I'm so gender confused. I only just found out this morning that *you* are male, then you go and write something like this! What's a person to think? Either you are a male with a unique set of equipment, or you like to help your wife/gf/so'random women off the street find gynos in foreign countries? I could come up with a few more guesses, but they're grossing me out, so I'll stop.

STOP GENDER CONFUSION!

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

The problem is.... I've spent the past 20 years abroad...


Stitchawl

[Wetdogeared]

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

The problem is.... I've spent the past 20 years abroad...


Stitchawl

[pshrynk]

Originally Posted by mores

I guess they wish to "reward" you for your efforts. Then again, maybe your german or french is so bad they feel you will probably not understand them

I appreciate it when someone tries, at least, to speak in my native language, but sometimes, when I reply and get a blank stare, I offer to switch to something we both understand better. No use giving directions when all the other guy understands is the general direction you indicate with your hand.

That said, I went to france 2 weeks ago and was at one time pretty annoyed when the french lady in the store tried to speak english to me. My french is pretty good, and I was asking for a "thingie for an allergic nose". I mean, doesn't it count for anything that I can say "thingie" in french?

It's "thingie", right? I thought that was one of those universal words, like TV and puckee...

[kazbates]

Originally Posted by Stitchawl

The problem is.... I've spent the past 20 years abroad...


Stitchawl

Arggg! You just had to say it, didn't you?!?!?

[vivaldirules]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

This is why I don't tour in most foreign countries. My language skills are terrible, (not for lack of trying) and the most important thing of touring a foreign country is meeting the people (or so it seems to me). And you can't do it without learning at least some of the language. Or so this "ugly American" feels.

I gotta say that some of my most enjoyable times I have ever spent were with people who don't understand a word I say (and neither I them - kinda like MR?). A year ago I spent half an hour in an Amsterdam cafe with a guy drinking beer. It was clear he didn't understand English and the only word he said I recognized was "volcano" (spoken after a table had been knocked over by a waiter). We had a great time using gestures, enjoying the wonderful weather, and drinking our beers. I think I learned a fair amount about him and him me. Sure, it would have been nice to have been able to converse with him, but it was a half hour I'll never forget.

Another time I was in a train station in Den Haag buying a ticket to Schipol. The lady behind the counter was trying to tell me something but couldn't figure out the words and I struggled to no avail with the very few Dutch words I knew. She grabbed a coworker who was also unable to explain. The three of us spent a few minutes laughing our heads off in the process. (I later learned they had been trying to tell me transfer to another train at the next stop.) Again, it was unforgettable. And the worst result would have been that I was lost for awhile. Maybe that's why I don't consider the need to learn the language as so crucial. Who cares if I get lost? More fun!