strange and worrying computer problem

[kazbates]

With my secretary's computer, we just plugged it into another outlet. David did say that there are inexpensive voltage detectors that you can purchase at the hardware store. He did think it was a power issue, either with the internal supply, the battery or the outlet. Good luck. Computers can be so incredibly frustrating!!

[ShortNCuddlyAm]

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

i am beginning to think it could be electrical. as i said, the electrical installation here is ancient and unreliable and i've had (other) problems with it before. how would i check the outlet, exactly ?

Do you have another socket (that's completely seperate to the one it's currently in) you can plug it into? It won't make any difference if all the cabling's unreliable, but it might indicate if the problem is just with the wiring to that socket?

[LazyScot]

To (partially) check out the outlet, do you have any item of electrical equipment that will tell you if it has been switched off. For example, I have a mains alarm clock that when the power fails forgets the time, (and another radio that does the same over programmed stations as its internal battery has failed). Plug them into the same outlet as the computer (via some form of multi-plug adapter), and if it is the power failing then there is a reasonable chance they will fail as well.

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by mklynds

If you know someone with a UPS and you could borrow it, there is a good chance that is your problem. There are some higher end power bars that will regulate the current to keep it nice and even. Monster Cable is a brand I highly recommend. They also make voltage regulators and UPS units as well so you should be able to find a power sollution that is in your budget.

If you can borrow a UPS for a test and find it doesn't help I would pursue getting warranty coverage. If it is a heat issue, and you are not over clocking, then it could be from a faulty fan or even from a bad component on your MoBo (mother board) that is creating excessive heat. I would also recommend getting some one to look at it with your warranty coverage before you try anything that might void any warranty you have.

In my experience problems like these are not always easy to diagnose, not even in a workshop. If you do take it in for warranty work it is likely they'll just replace parts rather then spend too many man hours trying to fix it.

Hope that helps.

i can't borrow a ups from anyone, if i get one i'll have to buy one myself. what you say about the difficulty of diagnosing is precisely my problem, i can't predict the failures so of course i can't reproduce them. it's just trial and error so far. for all i know it's not the electricity at all, but that seems the most likely to me given other circumstances. i may have to look into warranty coverage but that's going to be a last resort because i don't really have the time / desire to drag my computer all the way across the city to the shop where i bought it, and then (presumably) be without it for possibly several days. i have work to do on it and it's my only one (this is another of those times when i start thinking that maybe i need a portable computer after all, as backup).

i don't think Monster Cable is available here. i have found some others :

MGE PROTECTION STATION 500 FR
or protection station 800

APC BUT it got horrible reviews by users, and i'm not sure whether it's just a bad model, or a few defective units, or a bad manufacturer...

this one intended for home offices (that is my case) but it's the same brand as got very bad reviews on the other model...
APC ONDULEUR BACK-UPS ES 550 VA - 8 CONNECTEURS
or here

and suggestions about particular brands are welcome.

Originally Posted by kazbates

With my secretary's computer, we just plugged it into another outlet. David did say that there are inexpensive voltage detectors that you can purchase at the hardware store. He did think it was a power issue, either with the internal supply, the battery or the outlet. Good luck. Computers can be so incredibly frustrating!!

arg !!! worse than frustrating.

Originally Posted by ShortNCuddlyAm

Do you have another socket (that's completely seperate to the one it's currently in) you can plug it into? It won't make any difference if all the cabling's unreliable, but it might indicate if the problem is just with the wiring to that socket?

not really. none nearby, anyway ; i would have to move the whole outfit into the other room, and i would also have to free the other socket, since this appartement has an infuriating shortage of them and they are all currently occupied.

Originally Posted by LazyScot

To (partially) check out the outlet, do you have any item of electrical equipment that will tell you if it has been switched off. For example, I have a mains alarm clock that when the power fails forgets the time, (and another radio that does the same over programmed stations as its internal battery has failed). Plug them into the same outlet as the computer (via some form of multi-plug adapter), and if it is the power failing then there is a reasonable chance they will fail as well.

carp !! i thought i did, and was going to thank you for that elegant solution (well, i can still thank you) but i've just discovered that my stupid clock-radio which i don't currently use as an alarm clock is unkillable ! i went and wrestled the plug out from behind the furniture in the other room, which took me several seconds at the least, and then came and plugged it in over here, and turned it back on, and it's still showing the correct time !! *smack* and before you ask, yes, i *did* first remove the batteries i had forgotten were in there. so it would be totally undisturbed by the hypothetical voltage flicker that may or may not be affecting my computer. that'll teach me to buy a decent brand clock radio (it's a philips, in case anyone needs a recommendation). i might just go to the hardware store and see whether they have something.

[ahammer]

the temperatures dont seem to be out of line but they are a bit hot for idle temps. 60-70 is where you start getting issues with cpu. do you do anything on your computer that would stress it much ie video editing, game or photo editing. if so I would run some of those programs and see how high it jump.

otherwize I would say it not a temp issue. I was wrong.

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by ahammer

the temperatures dont seem to be out of line but they are a bit hot for idle temps. 60-70 is where you start getting issues with cpu. do you do anything on your computer that would stress it much ie video editing, game or photo editing. if so I would run some of those programs and see how high it jump.

otherwize I would say it not a temp issue. I was wrong.

well, i don't know what is considered "idle" temps, i was using the computer at the time although perhaps not intensively (i can't remember what i was doing precisely). i do a lot of photo editing (graphic design) so i could try to do some and that and see if it has an effect. also, the day it shutdown twice, it was really hot, and it does get hot in here. today of course it's freezing. that could have an effect.

i have found a way (i think) to test the socket : i have plugged in my unkillable clock radio and turned on the radio part. if i unplug the clock, it manages to keep the time, however it turns off the radio. of course, it's quite possible the problem won't manifest at all for the next month.

i will nonetheless run the memtest86 test, and any other specific diagonostic tests recommended (but tell me specifically which ones, i know nothing about this).

i'm seriously considering getting a ups, since i have had troubles with the electrical installation here before anyway and i wouldn't be at all suprised if that were the problem. also i'm trying to figure out if it would be possible to put the whole computer desk in the other room, to use a different socket (it might be pointless, but i'd rather move it in the other room anyway, so it's another reason to think about it).

[GeoffC]

Six months ....... is it not still under warranty ?????

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by GeoffC

Six months ....... is it not still under warranty ?????

yes of course it is, but i'm not convinced it's a problem with the hardware, and i really REALLY don't want to drag the damned thing across the city to the shop possibly for nothing. it's heavy, it's far, i'd have to take the métro (i don't have a car), there are a lot of stairs, i have other things to do with my time. so i'd rather do tests at home first.

[GeoffC]

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

yes of course it is, but i'm not convinced it's a problem with the hardware, and i really REALLY don't want to drag the damned thing across the city to the shop possibly for nothing. it's heavy, it's far, i'd have to take the métro (i don't have a car), there are a lot of stairs, i have other things to do with my time. so i'd rather do tests at home first.

sorry, I didn't mean for you to have to do all that. my only purchases of laptops include a service call by an engineer to my home....just a hope that you may have had something similar...

sorry ....

problem with software , in that case
do you have any option that would allow you to start from scratch ?

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by GeoffC

sorry, I didn't mean for you to have to do all that. my only purchases of laptops include a service call by an engineer to my home....just a hope that you may have had something similar...

sorry ....

problem with software , in that case
do you have any option that would allow you to start from scratch ?

actually, number 1 possibility of my list is the electricity, although i am still testing.

[kazbates]

Zelda, forgive me if this is an annoying suggestion, it is just something I have tried before. Can you temporarily run an extension cord to another socket (outlet for us in the states) that you are fairly certain works properly? Then, I would try to recreate what you were doing when the computer did it's "wonky thing". Hopefully, your memory is much better than mine and you can remember what you did.

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by kazbates

Zelda, forgive me if this is an annoying suggestion, it is just something I have tried before. Can you temporarily run an extension cord to another socket (outlet for us in the states) that you are fairly certain works properly? Then, I would try to recreate what you were doing when the computer did it's "wonky thing". Hopefully, your memory is much better than mine and you can remember what you did.

hm, i will have to see if i can find a cable which will reach... not sure, but i'll give it a try. but i can't reproduce what i was doing ; it can happen at any moment, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with what i'm doing at the time.

[kazbates]

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

hm, i will have to see if i can find a cable which will reach... not sure, but i'll give it a try. but i can't reproduce what i was doing ; it can happen at any moment, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with what i'm doing at the time.

As my kids would say, "Bummer!"

[Over]

What's your modem, zelda?

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Over

What's your modem, zelda?

it's a "freebox" version 4 (adsl modem supplied by my internet provider). i'm really not sure who makes it... it doesn't say any other brand on it. it's connected via ethernet cable.