Two new Netronix Devices

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by John F

Since it is called "Table of Contents", and the Cover is listed under Table of Contents, ...

What is your definition of contents of an ebook?

In common usage, the book cover is "opposed" to the contents of the book. "Never judge a book by its cover."

But call the cover part of the content of the book if you want. It still doesn't change the fact that I'm (personally) interested in the book's contents (the stuff between the covers) so I don't care if the book cover is in color or not. I just want the clearest screen available when reading what's inside (the content of the book) — that's not what you get with the current generation of color eBook readers. Which is why it's disappointing to me (and others) that Kobo dropped the Libra 2, which many say one of the best (maybe the best) e-Ink screen available (at least for those who prefer clarity over color).

This is the pertinent point, not the side issue argument about the book's cover vs its content.

[cellaris]

I think the screens on the Clara BW, Sage and even the Elipsa 2e (to name just the monochrome e-readers from Kobo) are very sharp. What they don't have is 7". I don't think it's a bad thing that we're giving a lot of thought to the lack of a 7" monochrome Kobo e-reader. I understand the helplessness and disappointment felt by users who are specifically looking for that type of e-reader, but I don't agree at all that Kobo users are left without options. Kobo e-readers are still selling normally, and honestly, I don't think users who have decided to buy any of the current models are particularly unhappy. The different Kobo e-readers (not just the Libra 2) continue to be highly rated by their users.

(I also believe that the issue of book covers is a minor one, although it has sparked considerable controversy in several Kindle threads. Aesthetic issues should never be underestimated, and this also applies to colour e-readers).

[JSWolf]

The contents of an eBooks are what's in the eBook's container that can be shown on screen.

Buying a color Kobo for showing the covers in color is (IMHO) a really bad idea as that will look OK but reading the BLACK text will not be so good as the contrast is reduced and the text may not be as sharp.

[John F]

Originally Posted by rcentros

In common usage, the book cover is "opposed" to the contents of the book. "Never judge a book by its cover."

...

Thank you for your definition of content. An interesting definition.

[Quoth]

Though an ebook has the cover in the file and might have it in the ToC, a cover has never been part of a book's contents, unless it's repeated as an illustration in the body of the text.

[John F]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Though an ebook has the cover in the file and might have it in the ToC, a cover has never been part of a book's contents, unless it's repeated as an illustration in the body of the text.

Thank you for the history lesson. I am talking about the present.

Things change over time ...

At one time "books" were never on "paper"?
At one time "books" were never produced mechanically.
At one time, "books" were never in digital form.
At one time "books" never had audio.
...

[cellaris]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Buying a color Kobo for showing the covers in color is (IMHO) a really bad idea

I know a few people who think the opposite: they bought it precisely for that reason. Is it a bad idea? It may be for you or me, but what matters is what they think. And for them, it was a good idea.

I don't have a Kobo colour e-reader and I don't know what other features colour has. I imagine that underlining and annotations can be done in colour and possibly everything related to the web (Google or Wikipedia searches) is also in colour, in addition to the images themselves. There are books that also incorporate colour in the text (mainly in the chapter titles). Kobo users will be able to expand on what else they can do with colour on a Kobo e-reader.

In my particular case, as I have said on other occasions, colour is very present in the novels I read and personally I find its use worthwhile. But that is something that each person must judge for themselves. Those who do not want or do not find colour worthwhile can continue as before.

[JSWolf]

Buying a color Reader is a bad idea. If they tanked, maybe Kobo would have released a Libra BW by now.

[cellaris]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Buying a color Reader is a bad idea. If they tanked, maybe Kobo would have released a Libra BW by now.

Then you have nothing to worry about. Colour e-readers are a passing fad; they won't sell well, and the few that do sell will be returned due to their poor quality. They are also more expensive. So soon you will have a 7" monochrome Kobo e-reader 😉

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by John F

Thank you for the history lesson. I am talking about the present.
At one time "books" never had audio.
...

So am I, and real novels never have audio. TTS is a different thing.

A cover, even on ebooks isn't part of the content. It's a "cover image" and the ebook works perfectly without it.

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by Quoth

So am I, and real novels never have audio. TTS is a different thing.

A cover, even on ebooks isn't part of the content. It's a "cover image" and the ebook works perfectly without it.

Plenty of real novels have audio. Novel is a description of length and content, not format.

[DNSB]

Other than audiobooks, can you point to plenty of examples of novels that have embedded audio? Perhaps you can also explain how to embed a cover as part of the audio content?

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Other than audiobooks, can you point to plenty of examples of novels that have embedded audio? Perhaps you can also explain how to embed a cover as part of the audio content?

There's no reason to do that? Audio books are that. They don't stop being novels as audiobooks and there's no reason you couldn't release an original novel as an audiobook first. A novel is just long form fictional narrative prose.

The cover doesn't have to be embedded as audio just as the cover doesn't have to be embedded as text in a paper book or eBook. It can be an image on a cassette box or a JPEG in an MP3 album.

The cover is part of the package, some people do enjoy looking at them. Others might not care. Kobo has catered to people who like seeing the cover from the beginning. Color adds another dimension.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by salamanderjuice

There's no reason to do that? Audio books are that. They don't stop being novels as audiobooks and there's no reason you couldn't release an original novel as an audiobook first. A novel is just long form fictional narrative prose.

One problem with your statement, is that a book in the sense we are using it, by definition, is a written or printed work bound on one edge. And yes, that excludes ebooks.

As for releasing an audiobook first? Sorry but most authors/publishers are iffy about simultaneous releases much less releasing the audiobook prior to the pbook or ebook editions. The cost and time involved in creating the audiobook while leaving the pbook and ebook editions hanging in limbo when they could be out generating sales and hype is unlikely to fly.

Originally Posted by salamanderjuice

The cover doesn't have to be embedded as audio just as the cover doesn't have to be embedded as text in a paper book or eBook. It can be an image on a cassette box or a JPEG in an MP3 album.

ebooks and pbooks natively support images so embedding would not be necessary though I have seen several ebooks that use long descriptions of images for use by TTS systems.

Originally Posted by salamanderjuice

The cover is part of the package, some people do enjoy looking at them. Others might not care. Kobo has catered to people who like seeing the cover from the beginning. Color adds another dimension.

Whereas I seldom look at book covers (I seem to remember having this discussion several times in the past where my statement that I am seldom influenced in a book purchase by the cover was not greeted well). One friend recently purchased a pbook with a dust jacket, an image on the boards and edge printed images. Oddly, they have never opened the book since they prefer the ebook edition but it does look pretty on their bookshelf. Tsundoku lives.

My Kobo sleep/power off screens have been images rather than the default book cover ever since Kobo introduced that capability.

On somewhat of a tangent, for me, the content of a book starts with the epigraph/prologue/whatever which starts the story and ends with the last chapter/epilogue/whatever that ends the story. I do not consider the blurbs for other books, author biographies, copyright notices, etc. as being content.

As for colour? Very few of my books have images or effects that would benefit from colour. OTOH, I know quite a few people for whom colour makes the ebook experience enjoyable. Much of their reading consists of comics, kids books and other publications which make heavy use of colour images.

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by DNSB

One problem with your statement, is that a book in the sense we are using it, by definition, is a written or printed work bound on one edge. And yes, that excludes ebooks.

As for releasing an audiobook first? Sorry but most authors/publishers are iffy about simultaneous releases much less releasing the audiobook prior to the pbook or ebook editions. The cost and time involved in creating the audiobook while leaving the pbook and ebook editions hanging in limbo when they could be out generating sales and hype is unlikely to fly.

Okay. I said nothing about BOOKs but NOVELs. Novels are often paper books, but they don't have to be.

And yeah, it's not traditionally done but here's a novel that doesn't seem to have a paper or eBook equivalent:

https://www.amazon.com/Audible-Smash-Hit/dp/B0FCG8F4VY

Seems like Audible has a bunch of those in their "Originals" line.