The Vent and Rant Thread

[John F]

Originally Posted by Hitch

...

Hell, of course they keep records. I'm talking about this specific piece of vernacular. The last thing I read about that specific language was this: https://www.kuzneski.com/blog/employ...%20information. (In which they state that there's no such thing as a "permanent record.")

...

WTF, HLS mentioned it, so I gave my opinion given the context.

Originally Posted by HLS

I don't know what it was that I said. The company would not tell me and I had no memory of it. I find it shitty that some total stranger would try to get another person fired over a conversation. What is sad is they completely bypassed my management. It was straight from cooperate. So cooperate went over my supervisor and my manager and totally excluded them in the discussion. I guess that's a good thing. I would have been mortified if my supervisor knew. There is nothing on my permanent record( So I assume it was a warning discussion) so I am pretending it never happened and I changed how my name is viewed on facebook so strangers can't google me and find my linkedin page and thus my employer info.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by John F

WTF, HLS mentioned it, so I gave my opinion given the context.

???

Okay. I just think that somebody, somewhere, is jerking him/her around. It sounds...so phony. I guess it could be real--and obviously is--but...I just can't wrap my head around the entire scenario.

I mean, seriously, what company on earth, that has two brain cells to rub together, "disciplines" or writes up an employee, and refuses to tell her (or him, dammit) what they said, what they did, etc.? Does this sound right or normal to anyone else here? If nothing else, I'd suspect it would open the company up foir...hell, selective enforcement or all sorts of labor infractions. (I mean, think about it--"we're threatening to disclipline you, but the WHY is a secret?" Are you kidding?) If HLS were to be subsequently terminated, and that write-up used as part of that, it could EASILY be wrongful termination.

Unless I'm cracked, employers must--must--have "just cause" for writeups, permanent or otherwise. What's the just cause here? The Double-Secret Probation behavior? Pah.

I get it, nothing overt happened to HLS, so s/he is inclined to write it off, change the social media and continue on. but...the whole thing stinks to me. Yes, the jerk that "reported" HLS is a jerk but the company is an even larger jackass.

Hitch

[John F]

Originally Posted by Hitch

???

Okay. I just think that somebody, somewhere, is jerking him/her around. It sounds...so phony. I guess it could be real--and obviously is--but...I just can't wrap my head around the entire scenario.

I mean, seriously, what company on earth, that has two brain cells to rub together, "disciplines" or writes up an employee, and refuses to tell her (or him, dammit) what they said, what they did, etc.? Does this sound right or normal to anyone else here? If nothing else, I'd suspect it would open the company up foir...hell, selective enforcement or all sorts of labor infractions. (I mean, think about it--"we're threatening to disclipline you, but the WHY is a secret?" Are you kidding?) If HLS were to be subsequently terminated, and that write-up used as part of that, it could EASILY be wrongful termination.

Unless I'm cracked, employers must--must--have "just cause" for writeups, permanent or otherwise. What's the just cause here? The Double-Secret Probation behavior? Pah.

I get it, nothing overt happened to HLS, so s/he is inclined to write it off, change the social media and continue on. but...the whole thing stinks to me. Yes, the jerk that "reported" HLS is a jerk but the company is an even larger jackass.

Hitch

Irregardless, I wasn't commenting on what happened to HLS, I was commenting on the term "permanent record".

[HLS]

Originally Posted by Hitch

I admit it--I find this all pretty boggling, like the "permanent record" stuff, too. (I don't even know what that means; in 50+ years of working, I don't think I've ever heard someone say that, outside of movies, before now.)

I am boggled that corporate would even indulge someone like this; that they expect you to roll over and take a verbal lashing, when they won't tell you what was said, or what you "did wrong" and...this is frankly nuts. I would never tell someone to quit their job, but maybe, in a day and age when every company out there is looking for good people, you should be looking, for your own sake.

It's like..."you did wrong because we SAY you did; we won't show you what it was, or who sent it, or what conversation it was, now stick your tail between your legs and behave yourself." Yeah, no. Personally, I'd have to move on but I think you've been very poorly treated. What's next, accusing you of stealing money, without telling you from where, how much or with any proof?

Hitch

Legally they need an audit trial to fire you probably. you get a verbal discussion then a written warning then a final warning usually before a company can fire you

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by John F

Irregardless, I wasn't commenting on what happened to HLS, I was commenting on the term "permanent record".

Yes, I do understand that. I'm just seriously irritated on his/her account, as I'm sure is bl**dy obvious.

Originally Posted by HLS

Legally they need an audit trial to fire you probably. you get a verbal discussion then a written warning then a final warning usually before a company can fire you

Yes, which is why this is...vexatious. BUT...I'll shut up now.

Hitch

[Hemmi]

I wouldn't accept a written warning that did not clearly spell out what the infraction was. If HR is calling me in for a meeting over something I supposedly said online, they'd better have copies of what was posted and when and where if they want to put something in my HR file about it.

[BetterRed]

Originally Posted by Hitch

. . .

I mean, seriously, what company on earth, that has two brain cells to rub together, "disciplines" or writes up an employee, and refuses to tell her (or him, dammit) what they said, what they did, etc.?

Coutts or Monzo (UK banks) or the BBC, might do such a thing

[DNSB]

I've been on the other side of this discussion (tasked with collecting evidence) and I would have to say that the procedure followed was a bit strange by my standards. If a person from inside our corporate network was accessing or creating inappropriate content, we had to have beyond any reasonable doubt proof that they were responsible. The ability to demonstrate that the content was accessed/posted from this device with this user logged in at the time of the incident. This generally involved extracting the relevant bits from log files (grep is your best friend) and an ability to follow the traces. I thankfully had to do few of those in my years in IT and of those few, only two turned out to be serious violations which led to a suspension in one case and an immediate termination of employment in the other.

OTOH, we do have two types of personnel records. A temporary one where, for example, a minor infraction would be placed for a certain length of time before being expunged. A permanent record which keeps track of all the interactions between HR and the person which is kept until 7 years after the person had left their employment. Say you committed a 2nd minor infraction while the 1st one was still in the temporary record, both of them would now be moved to your permanent record. An example might be an IT staff member who was found napping in a server room and then was caught installing a corporate SSD drive in their personal device a few weeks later.

[Rumpelteazer]

Over the past two weeks I've looked at countless of for sale homes on the internet. I've seen pictures and floor plans. But what I realized after visiting our first house last week is how deceptive those pictures are.

I knew that they use wide angle lenses to make everything look bigger. It's even worse when the house house little to no furniture in it. With furniture you can estimate how big a room is, especially in bedroom.

Sure they also always provide floor plans. And I know how big my bed, dressers and desk are going to be. But it still makes it difficult to get a proper idea how big the room is and how things will fit.

On a more positive note: my sister had the first real estate agent in to look at her apartment and in six years time it's worth twice as much as what she'd paid for it. Today the second agent is coming by.

On Tuesday we're going to our second house. This one needs a lot of work (but because of the price we could afford that). It does have two equally sized bedroom and what looks to be a nice hobby room in the attic. But I'm not in love with this house, but we'll see.

On Thursday my sister booked a visit to the third house. My sister loves the walk in closet in the attic bedroom. We would need to change to flooring on the ground floor (red!) and the black kitchen. But again, we'll have the funds for that.

[Hitch]

Well, Rumple sorry but that Real Estate site would not allow me to do more than glance at that house. It looks like it desperately needs some TLC and fixing-up, but I'm sure you ladies can manage that.

Does anybody know what that flooring material is? The reddish stuff?

Hitch

[JSWolf]

The third house would be a no-go from the start because of the spiral staircase. I cannot stand them.

[Martinoptic]

Spiral staircases are hard to negotiate when your not so spry on your feet.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Martinoptic

Spiral staircases are hard to negotiate when your not so spry on your feet.

And they are hard to navigate when you are carrying large things.

[Rumpelteazer]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Well, Rumple sorry but that Real Estate site would not allow me to do more than glance at that house. It looks like it desperately needs some TLC and fixing-up, but I'm sure you ladies can manage that.

Does anybody know what that flooring material is? The reddish stuff?

Hitch

It looks like the flooring my sister has, which is pebble/gravel epoxy. But she's got it in grey, not in red. It's very durable and easy to clean, but since it isn't smooth it wears down your sock and soft soled slippers very quickly. I think painting won't be an option, it'll make it uglier than it already is. I also think the kitchen looks cheap, though that might be the lighting.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The third house would be a no-go from the start because of the spiral staircase. I cannot stand them.

Originally Posted by Martinoptic

Spiral staircases are hard to negotiate when your not so spry on your feet.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

And they are hard to navigate when you are carrying large things.

Yeah, the spiral staircase is the biggest negative. An aunt and uncle had one and it was not a comfortable stair to use. And you can't easily replace it. Mind you the house we went to last week also had stairs that were too steep with too tight bends, and I'm used to horrible stairs. But I often find that Dutch staircases are narrow, so when it's got a bend in it it's often too tight to walk comfortably.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Rumpelteazer

It looks like the flooring my sister has, which is pebble/gravel epoxy. But she's got it in grey, not in red. It's very durable and easy to clean, but since it isn't smooth it wears down your sock and soft soled slippers very quickly. I think painting won't be an option, it'll make it uglier than it already is. I also think the kitchen looks cheap, though that might be the lighting.

Oh, yes, once you have one of those epoxy floors, without extensive replacement, you're doomed. You're stuck with it and you really can't paint over it. I admit it, I couldn't live with that color. BUT, everybody has their own priorities and likes/dislikes.

Yeah, the spiral staircase is the biggest negative. An aunt and uncle had one and it was not a comfortable stair to use. And you can't easily replace it. Mind you the house we went to last week also had stairs that were too steep with too tight bends, and I'm used to horrible stairs. But I often find that Dutch staircases are narrow, so when it's got a bend in it it's often too tight to walk comfortably.

Spirals are used when space is too tight for an alternative, not as an aesthetic choice, unless someone is a nut, seriously. They take up almost no space, compared to traditional stairs. At my age, NOPE, no more spirals for me. My knees would kvetch loudly. And yes, packages? Fuggedaboudit.

If you were going to rent, that would be one thing, but as you're talking about BUYING, carefully consider those two points, especially. Make sure that you're not going to be screaming about the staircase or that epoxy floor in the other house inside of two years. I made a mistake and caved to my husband, abut our current house, which has a kitchen that I HATE and it infuriates me daily.

Hitch