Amazon and DRM changes

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by Ma'am-I-Am

Epubs can be sent thru Send-to-Kindle (which they convert, of course) so I'm thinking they're playing with the idea of offering epub versions as a choice when purchasing.

Supporting EPUB in send-to-kindle shows that they want to make it easy to move to Kindle from other platforms. However there is every indication that they want to put in as many barriers as possible to prevent customers from going in the other direction. Allowing Kindle books to be downloaded in a format that can be easily read on non-Kindle apps or devices is the last thing I would expect Amazon to do.

We see the Kindle as a device for reading books while Amazon sees it as a device for selling them. I have been tracking updates to kindle reading software for a while, looking to see what new features are being introduced. From that I see that they put far more effort into the user interface that leads to sales such as the end-of-book popup dialog and the home screen than they do into the actual reading experience.

Amazon wants to sell you a new book once you reach the end of your current book. To do that they need you to read your Kindle book on a Kindle.

[slm]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Microsoft's .lit, Sony's BBeB(.lrf), Peanut Press's eReader (.pdb)... and the list goes on. I know it's fun to paint Amazon as the only wrench in the path to a one-open-ebook-format-to-rule-them-all nirvana, but It's not entirely accurate. Everybody was in the proprietary format development game in the beginning. At the time epub became the defacto standard of all non-Amazon ebook stores, it would have made no sense for Amazon to retool in order to adopt a format/DRM scheme it clearly didn't need.

Oddly enough--though no one notices it today--mobi is really an early version of epub--the original Mobi converter produced "OpenEBook" projects (with some additional features). Eventually, OEB evolved into epub2 so OEB is, essentially, epub1. And I guess Mobi would be epub1.x.

[DiapDealer]

It's possible that MobiCreator once allowed content to be saved in a format that was compatible with Open Ebook Project, but I'm unaware of any period of time when a mobi/prc file wasn't a binary database. That mobi could be seen as epub v1.x seems a rather thin stretch of the facts to me.

[slm]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

It's possible that MobiCreator once allowed content to be saved in a format that was compatible with Open Ebook Project, but I'm unaware of any period of time when a mobi/prc file wasn't a binary database. That mobi could be seen as epub v1.x seems a rather thin stretch of the facts to me.

The .prc version of mobi is an artifact of the way the Palm Pilot stored data--palm resources had to be coded for use on the device. (The "text" programs for Palm also produced 'prc' files.

[DiapDealer]

Yes. But inside the Palm resource container, the mobi ebook was still always a binary format. And that binary format was very much non-oeb-like.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

It's possible that MobiCreator once allowed content to be saved in a format that was compatible with Open Ebook Project, but I'm unaware of any period of time when a mobi/prc file wasn't a binary database. That mobi could be seen as epub v1.x seems a rather thin stretch of the facts to me.

I can't envisage any version of mobipocket ebooks being "epub v 1.x" either. I still have a Palm OS PDA with two ereader programs using incompatible .pdb files and one is Mobipocket.

The .pdb stuff was very primitive (=PalmOS Data Base) and the mobi/prc was at best a sort of HTML 3 with a few extra mobi tags which don't exist in epub or azw3.

Oddly enough--though no one notices it today--mobi is really an early version of epub--the original Mobi converter produced "OpenEBook" projects

I suspect you are thinking of some other format. Not anything to do with Mobipocket or Mobicreator.

A quick search suggests that Softbook Press, not Mobipocket, is the ancestor /creator of original Open Book spec which led to epub 2.0

EDIT
It's possible that the MobiPocket Reader app on some platforms could read Open Book spec ebooks from Softbook (who had a real ereader in 1998). Amazon bought Mobipocket in 2005. Apple iPhone and Kindle 1 came out in 2007. Android in 2008. So neither iOS nor Android ever got the Mobipocket Reader App. Amazon released the Kindle Apps for iOS and Android instead, but I don't know when.

EDIT 2.
Calibre was produced initially for the Sony ereader (which was LRF originally and epub2 later). It can produce epub 2.0, epub 3.0, azw3, old mobi, a dual mobi (basically old mobi and azw3 in one file), LRF, two kinds of pdb but not the format for a Softbook, which is essentially epub 1.0, though never called that.

MobiCreator on XP

I have the last ever public MobiCreator and it only does mobi/prc for actual ebooks. It lives on on a VM clone of my 2002 XP laptop.

It can manage Palm databases and do various odd stuff, but not make a SoftBook compatible Open Book.

[Proximanova]

Continuing a discussion from March: I seem to have discovered another book by Penguin Random House India which is exclusively on Amazon, in KFX only, and is not only published in 2023 but also has the unbreakeable DRM which was used by several Kindle books from Penguin India.

It sure looks like unbreakable Kindle-only books could be on the way to becoming the new norm at Penguin India. Thought this was noteworthy to bring up, after the discovery that Sach Kahun Toh is similarly locked to Kindle.

https://penguin.co.in/book/i-hear-you/

[ownedbycats]

As far as I'm aware, pretty much all, or at least a majority, of books in certain Indian languages are KFX-only. I'm not sure if KFX has better support for the languages (though your book seems to be English) or if there's some weird rights stuff going on there.

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

As far as I'm aware, pretty much all, or at least a majority, of books in certain Indian languages are KFX-only. I'm not sure if KFX has better support for the languages (though your book seems to be English) or if there's some weird rights stuff going on there.

It is a bit of both. Indian language books are only available in KFX as only that format supports features needed for those such as specific fonts.

In addition some publishers of English language books published in India have a deal with Amazon that their books are only made available in KFX format with strong DRM. It has been that way for awhile. I don’t know if that is a trial planned for expansion worldwide or if the Indian market is felt to be especially subject to piracy.

[Unseen Entities]

Question about using Bluestacks to export books. Is the resulting ebook the same file size as from Download & Transfer or is it smaller? (i.e. does it serve lower quality images to old kindle android app)

...Its very lame Download & Transfer doesnt offer a max Quality option, especially after blocking K4PC.

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by Unseen Entities

Question about using Bluestacks to export books. Is the resulting ebook the same file size as from Download & Transfer or is it smaller? (i.e. does it serve lower quality images to old kindle android app)

...Its very lame Download & Transfer doesnt offer a max Quality option, especially after blocking K4PC.

Same and bigger. The 4.16 version gives identical size books than Download and Transfer with low res low quality images. When using 8.51 in Bluestacks, you get the bigger high res version.

[Ma'am-I-Am]

Is 8.51 the highest version we can use and still de-DRM it in Calibre?

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by Ma'am-I-Am

Is 8.51 the highest version we can use and still de-DRM it in Calibre?

Yes and no. On everything other than Bluestacks it downloads unbreakable KFX. Bluestacks will download the KF8 version that can have the DRM removed.

[Unseen Entities]

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

When using 8.51 in Bluestacks, you get the bigger high res version.

Lol, good theres a way to get higher quality versions but oof I was hoping to not have to use Bluestacks.

[Ma'am-I-Am]

You could always try another Android emulator and school us.