Do you need to "connect" to a story and/or characters?

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by DNSB

A quote from Sam Clemens (aka Mark Twain) that pretty much says what I feel:

The test of any good fiction is that you should care something for the characters; the good to succeed, the bad to fail. The trouble with most fiction is that you want them all to land in hell, together, as quickly as possible.

Agreed.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Actually, I'd love to see more books where the bad win and the good fail.

Just watch about any modern horror movie and you'll get your wish. I guess originally it was supposed to be shocking. But when that's all they ever do, it gets pretty monotonous.

[Apache]

Originally Posted by rcentros

Just watch about any modern horror movie and you'll get your wish. I guess originally it was supposed to be shocking. But when that's all they ever do, it gets pretty monotonous.

They don't scare me, nor do I get a thrill out of being scared. Also, the people in horror movies are just plain stupid or clueless.
For example, the original Texas Chain Saw Massacre had a girl run screaming into a barn to hide from a man chasing her with a chain saw. When he enters, she hits him over the head with a two by four. She then throws the two by four down and runs out of the barn still screaming. The man shakes his head picks up the chain saw and continues the chase. Either continue to beat him with to two by four until he is dead or pick up the chain saw and cut his legs off. Even if he survives, he will not be able to chase her down. End of movie.
Apache

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Apache

They don't scare me, nor do I get a thrill out of being scared. Also, the people in horror movies are just plain stupid or clueless.
For example, the original Texas Chain Saw Massacre had a girl run screaming into a barn to hide from a man chasing her with a chain saw. When he enters, she hits him over the head with a two by four. She then throws the two by four down and runs out of the barn still screaming. The man shakes his head picks up the chain saw and continues the chase. Either continue to beat him with to two by four until he is dead or pick up the chain saw and cut his legs off. Even if he survives, he will not be able to chase her down. End of movie.
Apache

Who wants to watch a 6 minute long movie?

[Apache]

I used to read a lot of westerns as a kid. I hated the ones where the good guy bungled and flailed his way through the book. Then at the end miraculously figured everything out and put the bad guys away. Give me smart protagonists every time. Stupid would get you killed in real life. Most bad guys aren't imbeciles either.
Apache

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by Apache

They don't scare me, nor do I get a thrill out of being scared. Also, the people in horror movies are just plain stupid or clueless.
For example, the original Texas Chain Saw Massacre had a girl run screaming into a barn to hide from a man chasing her with a chain saw. When he enters, she hits him over the head with a two by four. She then throws the two by four down and runs out of the barn still screaming. The man shakes his head picks up the chain saw and continues the chase. Either continue to beat him with to two by four until he is dead or pick up the chain saw and cut his legs off. Even if he survives, he will not be able to chase her down. End of movie.
Apache

Thank you! This is a PERFECT example of too stupid to live!!!!

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by Apache

They don't scare me, nor do I get a thrill out of being scared. Also, the people in horror movies are just plain stupid or clueless.
For example, the original Texas Chain Saw Massacre had a girl run screaming into a barn to hide from a man chasing her with a chain saw. When he enters, she hits him over the head with a two by four. She then throws the two by four down and runs out of the barn still screaming. The man shakes his head picks up the chain saw and continues the chase. Either continue to beat him with to two by four until he is dead or pick up the chain saw and cut his legs off. Even if he survives, he will not be able to chase her down. End of movie.

Absolutely agree. I don't watch horror movies, unless I somehow get roped into it. Like you, they don't scare me. The old horror movies depended more on suspense and less on gore. But it seems like those who do get scared watching horror movies get drawn to them.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Who wants to watch a 6 minute long movie?

If it's a modern horror movie, six minutes would be too long.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by Apache

I used to read a lot of westerns as a kid. I hated the ones where the good guy bungled and flailed his way through the book. Then at the end miraculously figured everything out and put the bad guys away. Give me smart protagonists every time. Stupid would get you killed in real life. Most bad guys aren't imbeciles either.

I read quite a few Louis L'amour books until I finally figured out that they were the same story over and over again. I've never been that quick in the uptake.

[Uncle Robin]

Originally Posted by Apache

I used to read a lot of westerns as a kid. I hated the ones where the good guy bungled and flailed his way through the book. Then at the end miraculously figured everything out and put the bad guys away. Give me smart protagonists every time. Stupid would get you killed in real life. Most bad guys aren't imbeciles either.
Apache

This reminded of a truly excellent K-Drama, Forest of Secrets ("Stranger" on Netflix) - the two goodies were very smart, focused and fallible, and so was the the lead baddie. The result was compelling. Sadly, in both literature and movies/tv, the exception rather than the norm

[Apache]

Originally Posted by Uncle Robin

This reminded of a truly excellent K-Drama, Forest of Secrets ("Stranger" on Netflix) - the two goodies were very smart, focused and fallible, and so was the the lead baddie. The result was compelling. Sadly, in both literature and movies/tv, the exception rather than the norm

True, but when you find one it is usually a gem.
Apache

[Apache]

Originally Posted by rcentros

Absolutely agree. I don't watch horror movies, unless I somehow get roped into it. Like you, they don't scare me. The old horror movies depended more on suspense and less on gore. But it seems like those who do get scared watching horror movies get drawn to them.

My first wife liked horror movies, so I ended up taking her. At least I was only married to her for 3 years. At least I was lucky the second time around and still am. I remember taking the first wife to see Carrie. When the hand came out of the ground at the end, a woman sitting in front of us jumped out of her seat screaming at the top of her lungs. That scared everyone more than the hand. She turned to run and the man with her grabbed her and pulled her back into her seat. He had to grab the other seat arm to keep her in the seat. She was throwing herself against his arm trying to run and was screaming the entire time. I have never seen anything like it since.
Apache

[John F]

Originally Posted by Apache

They don't scare me, nor do I get a thrill out of being scared. Also, the people in horror movies are just plain stupid or clueless.
For example, the original Texas Chain Saw Massacre had a girl run screaming into a barn to hide from a man chasing her with a chain saw. When he enters, she hits him over the head with a two by four. She then throws the two by four down and runs out of the barn still screaming. The man shakes his head picks up the chain saw and continues the chase. Either continue to beat him with to two by four until he is dead or pick up the chain saw and cut his legs off. Even if he survives, he will not be able to chase her down. End of movie.
Apache

In case you missed it:

[DuskyRose]

Yes, I have to 'connect' with the characters in some way, which, to me, just means I have some interest in them. I don't have to like them, but I have to have some smidgen of interest in them to continue on.

I read the 'Foreigner' series during the summer, and while it got a bit repetative, and the MC a bit too introspective for me, I liked them all enough to root for them and get through all 21 books and look forward to more.

And now I'm working my way through the latter part of the 'Federation' series. I liked the robot books, and the Hari Seldon books, but the latter books which jump 100's of years after his death and introduce new characters after each jump... Not so much.

I care about certain characters, but not the universe as a whole. (Other than, I'll finish it just to finish it. I don't really care if they reach their Second Empire or not.)

I guess I'm the same way about Star Wars. Certain characters interested me, but the universe as a whole did not. So, if I can't get interested in the characters, no point to going on with a story.

[DiapDealer]

I'm fascinated by how so many talk about liking, caring about, or being interested in characters as if they are actual people, rather than successful or unsuccessful constructs of the author; used to propel the plot. I'll go as far as to notice whether the characters are "believable" in their plot arcs (and I may even "like" or "dislike" some of them), but I never see them as fully autonomous entities. I'm almost always generally apathetic to their fictional plights in the long run. But that's probably because I don't strive to hop into their heads (or their worlds) when I'm reading about them. For me, escapism includes the freedom to not have to be truly invested in these fictional contructs' drama/joy (like I need to be in real life). They're disposable: and the author either did them well or they didn't. *shrug*