Font embedding, swash alternatives---no codepoints!

[Hitch]

Hey, guys:

I thought the Workshop was feeling bereft and lonely, having not had a new post since before HRH Elizabeth passed, so...what the heck.

I ran into a somewhat interesting issue, the last few days and I hope you're not reading this, thinking that I have some magic wand solution, because I don't. Given what (I think) it would cost to fix this, the client passed on fixing it and went with the standard glyphs, but:

A client sent us an INDD package file, which used the Adobe-available CANTO font. This is a hugely experienced customer--if I say we've done nearly 500-750 eBooks for them, I'm likely not exaggerating. The file used 5 faces--Bold, Light, Roman, SemiBold, Semiboldital (Semi-bold Italic). Right?

But, lo, the book designer used swash alternatives. We use these all the time, sans issue, but this time, what to my wondering eyes should appear when we endeavored to export the HTML/ePUB/anything? (See attached.)

Ixnay on the Ode-points-cay. No codepoints. No Hex (the glyph #454? Nope, not Hex.)

So, instead of the fancy T (and myriad other letters), we ended up with the base font. I told the customer what I thought it would cost, for me to use "my font guy" and create codepoints for +/- 52-ish characters, in all 5 faces, and they decided that they could go Swashless. There were over 100 chapters in the book and 5-6 Parts sections, all of which used the contextual swashes, so making them as images wasn't a) affordable for the customer or b) a quick-n-easy solution for us, either.

But I was wondering if anybody here had a fast-n-easy(ier) way to do this? I mean, to assign codepoints and then deploy them?

I figured if ANYBODY knew, it would be one of you geniuses....???

Hitch

[hobnail]

Originally Posted by Hitch

This is a hugely experienced customer--if I say we've done nearly 500-750 eBooks for them, I'm likely not exaggerating.

Hitch

Just being nosey; was that an author or something else?

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by hobnail

Just being nosey; was that an author or something else?

Hob, mon sweetie:

500-750 books for ONE author? Sheesh, you must know some proflific dudes and dudettes!

(ᵒ̤̑ ₀̑ ᵒ̤̑)wow!*✰

it's a print design house, much like my own, that would rather not mess with eBooks, so we white-label their stuff and have for...gosh, IDK, 10 years now, give or take. :-)

Hitch

[JSWolf]

The simplest solution I can think of is to use a similar but different font that's not broken.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The simplest solution I can think of is to use a similar but different font that's not broken.

My thought too. Some fonts are inherently swashed Italic. I think common on menus and wedding invitations. Originally maybe posters for opera or classical music concerts?
Mixing with a similar enough un-swashed serif font and matching size & weight may be "fun".

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Quoth

My thought too. Some fonts are inherently swashed Italic. I think common on menus and wedding invitations. Originally maybe posters for opera or classical music concerts?
Mixing with a similar enough un-swashed serif font and matching size & weight may be "fun".

Yes, boys, but most--until now, all, that I've seen--have codepoints/hex. THIS one does not. A bloody Adobe font!

Hitch

[Turtle91]

I'm going to pretend to display font ignorance here...for the betterment of everyone else who is wondering and not wanting to display their own level of understanding (of course)

What are codepoints and why are they important??

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by Turtle91

I'm going to pretend to display font ignorance here...for the betterment of everyone else who is wondering and not wanting to display their own level of understanding (of course)

What are codepoints and why are they important??

Aparently, it is a way to represent 1,114,112 characters, err graphenes, with 16 bits.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_point

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Aparently, it is a way to represent 1,114,112 characters, err graphenes, with 16 bits.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_point

Yes, okay--then everybody forget I said codepoints. Pretend I said character codes. Either way, the long/short of it is that there is no there there. Can't make a character appear w/o codes.

(I mean, without making it an image, which obviously, <> ideal.)

Hitch

[hobnail]

... ...

[hobnail]

How are code points used in html, with the numeric html entity?

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Yes, boys, but most--until now, all, that I've seen--have codepoints/hex. THIS one does not. A bloody Adobe font!

Hitch

Heck, Rakuten Serif (just the regular) is screwed up. It's created by Dalton Maag.

This is one of the new fonts in the latest Kobo firmware.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by hobnail

How are code points used in html, with the numeric html entity?

As far as I know--and I don't lay claim to being some world-class font expert, by any means--you simply use the same information that you do for any other character, that isn't a typical glyph (a, b, c...) in an HTML environment. Some are used sort of cross-fonts, like using the HTML entities for ellipses, let's say. ike a required space, ellipses, etc, but some--let's say the Abramo Serif Double-Dagger--you'd embed that using the Hex 0x2021 (which is the "codepoint" for that character in that font).

‡

(The font itself doesn't work here, but that's what the character would look like in whatever font this is, here in MR.) Or the "per mille" sign:

‰

But, alas, alack, if a font does not have that--no Hex, no nuthin', there can't be a way to use it, outside of the fairly narrow universe of Adobe and other PRINT layout programs--right? FYI, the "codepoints" for both of those, above, the double dagger and the per-mille, are the same across most fonts.

Aren't we talking the "private use" codepoints in Unicode, or am I starting to lose my marbles here?

H

[Jellby]

I presume the swash alternatives are specified in an OpenType feature. Can't you just enable the feature in CSS and have them displayed as intended (as long as the renderer supports OpenType features)? It may be possible to programmatically replace all the conventional letters with their swash alteratives, if that's what you want...

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Jellby

I presume the swash alternatives are specified in an OpenType feature. Can't you just enable the feature in CSS and have them displayed as intended (as long as the renderer supports OpenType features)? It may be possible to programmatically replace all the conventional letters with their swash alteratives, if that's what you want...

So, if I understand you, I'd have to do something like this:

font-variant-alternates: styleset(alt-a);

For each and every alternate letter, is that right?

And the fallback would simply be the non-alternative? Is that right?

I know this seems like I'm overthinking it, but I'm reasonably sure that I've never had to deal with swashes, etc. in the PUA that have no coding at all. Nuthin', nada--hell the OT stuff doesn't even show up in my font manager, which is not some el-cheapo freebie, either. In fact, to see these suckers, (outside of, say, INDD), I have to open them in a font editing/modification/creation program.

Okay, more digging on my part. There's gotta be a more-obvious answer that I'm simply overlooking.

Hitch