Firmware 4.31.19086

[compurandom]

I had an interesting glitch today. My kobo stopped letting me delete items either from the home screen or the device, and was not saving reading position.

So I plugged the USB in and verified the database was OK, and actually dumped and restored it, and then rebooted the device. It still was broken after eject, but after reboot, it was OK, and then it imported a bunch of stuff from my previous side load that was missing.

As far as I can tell, there is no damage. I almost wonder if the GUI lost connection to the database and couldn't update it anymore.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by compurandom

I had an interesting glitch today. My kobo stopped letting me delete items either from the home screen or the device, and was not saving reading position.

So I plugged the USB in and verified the database was OK, and actually dumped and restored it, and then rebooted the device. It still was broken after eject, but after reboot, it was OK, and then it imported a bunch of stuff from my previous side load that was missing.

As far as I can tell, there is no damage. I almost wonder if the GUI lost connection to the database and couldn't update it anymore.

Did that happen after connecting to the PC? And do you remember if there was a prompt for scanning the disk?

I have seen something similar and when investigating found that the books partition had been mounted read-only. The mount command used after ejecting the device includes an option to mount read-only if there are problems with the filesystem. I think this happened after getting the prompt but not doing a check. But, I'm not sure because I didn't always do anything as soon as I ejected.

Your description of the problem fits with the partition being mounted read-only. Things happened, but, were not stored for later. During the reboot the filesystem was checked and mounted correctly. After that, it all worked. Unfortunately, I don't know what the real trigger for this is, so I can't reproduce it.

[Skydog]

Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer

It's easy for people to suggest rolling back and not turning Wi-Fi on to sync, but half my Kobo usage is reading Pocket articles, and without synching, those don't get downloaded to the device.

You can rollback to a previous version and still sync your Pocket articles sans upgrade by applying the simple patch. None of my Kobos have 4.31 installed and I sync my Pocket articles frequently with the patch applied. Depending on connection duration you may see a pop-up notification of new firmware with the option to tap on "skip" (or "download") and it disappears. Easy.

[compurandom]

Originally Posted by davidfor

Did that happen after connecting to the PC?

Well, that's almost a silly question. With few exceptions, either the kobo is connected to the pc, or it is after being connected to the pc. :-P

I typically side load news articles once a day for offline reading at lunch.

And I specifically remember ejecting and then waiting for the home screen to pop up before unplugging. Too bad I wasn't paying attention enough to see that it didn't do the import right then.

And do you remember if there was a prompt for scanning the disk?

I don't see that in linux unless I actively look for it.

Your diagnosis of the kobo mounting it read only after eject from the pc sounds about right. I'm just super glad I didn't have a corrupt database to deal with. Maybe I need to go back to rebooting after I eject.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by compurandom

Well, that's almost a silly question. With few exceptions, either the kobo is connected to the pc, or it is after being connected to the pc. :-P

You're right. I should have said "immediately after". If there had been a sleep or a reboot in between, it would have been something different.

I typically side load news articles once a day for offline reading at lunch.

And I specifically remember ejecting and then waiting for the home screen to pop up before unplugging. Too bad I wasn't paying attention enough to see that it didn't do the import right then.

For me, I the import has happened each time. The interesting thing is that a couple of times, it has reimported a lot more books. I haven't been able to work out why it chose the books it did. It did show the books, but, wouldn't do much else. But, rebooting and it was all OK.

I don't see that in linux unless I actively look for it.

Your diagnosis of the kobo mounting it read only after eject from the pc sounds about right. I'm just super glad I didn't have a corrupt database to deal with. Maybe I need to go back to rebooting after I eject.

I have been checking by telnet-ing in and doing a test. But, that's while I'm trying to reproduce it. I haven't had the "luck" to catch it when I have been completely sure of what had been done in the lead up to it.

[compurandom]

Originally Posted by davidfor

You're right. I should have said "immediately after". If there had been a sleep or a reboot in between, it would have been something different.

Like I said, I ejected and waited for home screen. Then I unplugged and closed the cover. It probably slept until lunch, at which point I noticed that my new side loaded articles were missing (not yet imported) and it wasn't saving anything.

... trying to reproduce it. I haven't had the "luck" to catch it when I have been completely sure of what had been done in the lead up to it.

I've probably seen this before, but not recognized it beyond knowing that something had gone wrong. I'm sure it's another symptom of the filesystem corruption, which is easy to trigger. Just run enough side load / eject / import cycles in a row back to back without rebooting or waiting long enough between cycles.

I'm convinced that this has been a problem for a long time, but it was harder to trigger, and in '31, it triggers about 1 time in 3 instead of 1 time in 10 or 20.

If you want, I can play with it and try to trigger it on purpose instead of trying to avoid it, but not sure what use that would be unless there's some kind of diags you'd want me to do in between.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer

It's easy for people to suggest rolling back and not turning Wi-Fi on to sync, but half my Kobo usage is reading Pocket articles, and without synching, those don't get downloaded to the device.

Would it work if you blocked the Kobo firmware update server in your router? if it does, you could then roll back to 4.30 and still use Pocket.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

I believe that's what davidfor said in another thread, yes.

Even if you can perfectly reproduce the conditions (specific hardware of the computer the device is being ejected from, the exact books on the device, the exact books being imported to the device, the current phase of the moon, etc etc), if that only triggers the problem 50% of the time, it's very hard to test for.

But given that there are problems, I am surprised that 4.31 has not been pulled.

[Calenorn]

Originally Posted by compurandom

Just run enough side load / eject / import cycles in a row back to back without rebooting or waiting long enough between cycles.

Which begs the question, how long? Are there steps a user can take to minimize the risk?

Originally Posted by compurandom

I'm convinced that this has been a problem for a long time, but it was harder to trigger, and in '31, it triggers about 1 time in 3 instead of 1 time in 10 or 20.

Now multiply that by the number of customers who could run into this error, but don't read or comment on this board. IMHO Kobo should be concerned.

So, please forgive an unsophisticated question. Is this problem related to the note-taking functions of the Elipsa and Sage? If so, why doesn't Kobo have different firmware packages for their other devices?

[ownedbycats]

Originally Posted by Calenorn

Which begs the question, how long? Are there steps a user can take to minimize the risk?

Before JSWolf comes in with the "just downgrade to 4.30," here's the ones I've found:

a) Reboot the device after the import process runs. Alternately, wait a few minutes before re-connecting to give import time to finish its thing; I've taken to reading one chapter of a book as that seems long enough.

b) Keep an epub (not kepub) on the device. Open it immediately prior to connecting. When an epub is open the filesystem can unmount itself far more neatly.

your mileage may vary, but I've been doing both of these these and haven't encountered any issues.

and of course, set up Kobo Utilities to backup your db on connection. That's your best insurance.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

Before JSWolf comes in with the "just downgrade to 4.30," here's the ones I've found:

Hey, a broken clock is right twice a day.

Just downgrade to 4.30.

What are the advantages of staying on 4.31? Especially when it requires "keep your toes pointed to the north, not the northeast," "when ejecting, don't think of a polar bear" and soforth. Any advise given is only guesswork right now.

The defenses given here:

"Kobo is obviously not seeing problems from most users"
Fine. But this thread is rife with people experiencing issues, plus comments in other threads where the user didn't post here.

Threads on previous firmware versions had nowhere near the volume of issues reported as what has been seen of 4.31.

"It only impacts people who sideload, not the vast majority of users"
Which is why I am making that suggestion here.

That also ignores Robert's comments that he uses the Kobo as intended and still has issues.

It would be different if 4.31 added major new features or somehow vastly changed/improved user experience. But right now, 4.31 is an incremental upgrade that carries a real risk with it and isn't worth the update, at least for folks here that do use their Kobos differently.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

Before JSWolf comes in with the "just downgrade to 4.30," here's the ones I've found:

a) Reboot the device after the import process runs. Alternately, wait a few minutes before re-connecting to give import time to finish its thing; I've taken to reading one chapter of a book as that seems long enough.

And I will say: that didn't work for me.

I ejected, waited for the import, rebooted, reconnected, ejected, waited for the import, rebooted - Kobo was hosed.

[Calenorn]

Don't overlook compurandom's opinion that the problem occurred in previous firmwares, just less frequently. So the question is valid, even when using 4.30: What user actions minimize the risk of a corrupt database.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Calenorn

Don't overlook compurandom's opinion that the problem occurred in previous firmwares, just less frequently. So the question is valid, even when using 4.30...

Let's assume that is true.

If you had to play Russian roulette, would you rather use the gun with five bullets or the gun with one?

[Calenorn]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Let's assume that is true.

If you had to play Russian roulette, would you rather use the gun with five bullets or the gun with one?

I'm not arguing the point. I just want to better understand what's happening.