How to read long, nonfiction books?

[Deskisamess]

This is harder to do on an e-reader admittedly, since at least for me, that lack of progress can be daunting.

Why is this more difficult on an e-reader?

[rkomar]

When I traveled more often, I would take my more daunting non-fiction books with me on the airplanes. Whenever my interest started to flag when reading on the plane, I would put the book down, but within a few minutes I would be so bored that I would pick it back up again. I made much better progress when trapped with nothing better to do. I guess the point is that my reading stamina isn't really the problem when I pull out of a session, it's got more to do with resolve.

[Bembo]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

Why is this more difficult on an e-reader?

I feel that the progress bars you get on an e-reader are incentivized to keep you reading, so it is more of a rush to completion to get that coveted 100%. On the other hand, with physical books, you have a better sense of what you've already read (clearer sense of progress/remainder, perhaps) and often times there's less error with things like footnotes/endnotes (one of my books had over 800+ pages, which was odd since it should've been about 250-300; turns out each footnote somehow got its own page). In that case being stuck at 33-35% forever was a little demoralizing.

[Deskisamess]

Originally Posted by Bembo

I feel that the progress bars you get on an e-reader are incentivized to keep you reading, so it is more of a rush to completion to get that coveted 100%. On the other hand, with physical books, you have a better sense of what you've already read (clearer sense of progress/remainder, perhaps) and often times there's less error with things like footnotes/endnotes (one of my books had over 800+ pages, which was odd since it should've been about 250-300; turns out each footnote somehow got its own page). In that case being stuck at 33-35% forever was a little demoralizing.

I see no difference between seeing the percentage read or seeing the book mark sticking out of the top of the book and visualizing that I'm about 30% or 70% through the book.

I don't "covet" gaining that 100% read, whether it's a digital book or a print book. I read mostly for pleasure, when I want, and I stop when I want. I may check how many pages are left, or how much reading time is left, if it's getting late and I'm tired.

I think you are over-thinking this.

[DNSB]

Hmmm... a potential new Olympic sport. Competitive reading!

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Hmmm... a potential new Olympic sport. Competitive reading!

Wait, you mean that this isn't an Olympic event? What the holy hell have I been training for, all these years??????

Hitch

[4691mls]

These days my life is stressful enough that I just want to read fiction. I've got to admire any adult with a busy life who still makes an effort at learning.

When I was in school and had to read a textbook or other not-terribly-interesting material for a class, i would take notes and/or highlight or underline important parts - you know, the parts you might expect to appear on a test. That helped me focus.

But if the books you're trying to read really aren't capturing your attention, maybe you should try a different subject, or a different author for the same subject. Or a less difficult book on the same topic.

[Bembo]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

I see no difference between seeing the percentage read or seeing the book mark sticking out of the top of the book and visualizing that I'm about 30% or 70% through the book.

I don't "covet" gaining that 100% read, whether it's a digital book or a print book. I read mostly for pleasure, when I want, and I stop when I want. I may check how many pages are left, or how much reading time is left, if it's getting late and I'm tired.

I think you are over-thinking this.

I don't read for completion, but having an e-reader has made me increasingly aware of those 'stats' for better or worse. It also may be a double edged sword that it tells me how many hours I have left in a book or in a chapter. This is useful of course, but also can become a crutch. My Kobo also tells me that I've "only" finished 4% of my current library, and spent about 154 or so hours reading on the device. These are all aimed at maintaining maximum engagement with the device in a gamified way. (I haven't read Hooked by Nir Eyal, but I suspect this is the exactly the strategy discussed in that book.) In today's attention-starved world, my brain can't help but latch onto those sorts of metrics, which are mercifully lacking in print books.

[tomsem]

Originally Posted by Bembo

I don't read for completion, but having an e-reader has made me increasingly aware of those 'stats' for better or worse. It also may be a double edged sword that it tells me how many hours I have left in a book or in a chapter. This is useful of course, but also can become a crutch. My Kobo also tells me that I've "only" finished 4% of my current library, and spent about 154 or so hours reading on the device. These are all aimed at maintaining maximum engagement with the device in a gamified way. (I haven't read Hooked by Nir Eyal, but I suspect this is the exactly the strategy discussed in that book.) In today's attention-starved world, my brain can't help but latch onto those sorts of metrics, which are mercifully lacking in print books.

Reading is a life and death struggle! It’s no game!

Glad Amazon hasn’t gone too far in this direction. They do track days of reading but that’s it.

[Deskisamess]

Originally Posted by Bembo

I don't read for completion, but having an e-reader has made me increasingly aware of those 'stats' for better or worse. It also may be a double edged sword that it tells me how many hours I have left in a book or in a chapter. This is useful of course, but also can become a crutch. My Kobo also tells me that I've "only" finished 4% of my current library, and spent about 154 or so hours reading on the device. These are all aimed at maintaining maximum engagement with the device in a gamified way. (I haven't read Hooked by Nir Eyal, but I suspect this is the exactly the strategy discussed in that book.) In today's attention-starved world, my brain can't help but latch onto those sorts of metrics, which are mercifully lacking in print books.

Other than looking to see how much is left in a book, I don't care about "metrics." I have thousands of books, but don't care what my percentage read is. I don't give it that much thought. I read at least an hour per day, usually more. When I'm working around the house, or sewing, I use voice over to listen to lite fiction. I can easily go through a whole book or more in a day.

When I had a Kobo, I paid no attention to the stats. I'm not a number cruncher, but can see why some people are.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

I see no difference between seeing the percentage read or seeing the book mark sticking out of the top of the book and visualizing that I'm about 30% or 70% through the book.

You may not see it, maybe because of the particular books you read, or maybe you don't notice. But for some ebooks the difference can be significant for at least two reasons on kindles.

I don't know what's up on the book where every footnote is on it's own page. My sympathies to Bembo.

My experience is with amazon books whose page numbers match a paper book edition. amazon's % finished is calculated based on the non-image bytes form the beginning, including all HTML formatting. Some books have extensive notes, a bibliography, and even an extensive index at the end. These are all heavily formatted and usually in a smaller font. This has a double whammy efect of putting more content bytes and much more formatting bytes per "page" at the end of the book. So those sections at the end are virtually thicker and represent a hefty "%" of the book as calculated by amazon.

[theducks]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Hmmm... a potential new Olympic sport. Competitive reading!

How is it scored?
Points for alternate hand, page turns.
Mirror reading?
Note, Cats are not allowed to 'help'

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by theducks

Note, Cats are not allowed to 'help'

Oh, well, then, I'm out.

Hitch

[Bembo]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

When I had a Kobo, I paid no attention to the stats. I'm not a number cruncher, but can see why some people are.

I'm relatively new to the Kobo world (and I've only been using an e-reader since early 2020, but more extensively in the past few months). It may just be that I need time to get used to it. I moved a far distance and couldn't take any books with me, so most of my recent reads have been on the Kobo -- maybe that is why it's become so easy to get obsessed with the numbers.

Originally Posted by j.p.s

I don't know what's up on the book where every footnote is on it's own page. My sympathies to Bembo.

My experience is with amazon books whose page numbers match a paper book edition. amazon's % finished is calculated based on the non-image bytes form the beginning, including all HTML formatting. Some books have extensive notes, a bibliography, and even an extensive index at the end. These are all heavily formatted and usually in a smaller font. This has a double whammy efect of putting more content bytes and much more formatting bytes per "page" at the end of the book. So those sections at the end are virtually thicker and represent a hefty "%" of the book as calculated by amazon.

Well I finally finished that text, so it's all good! I do loathe when authors get too handy with footnotes, though. I mean, I love a good footnote, but you really don't need to explain every single reference like I'm coming out of Plato's cave...

Ah, that explains a lot. I've noticed at least on my Kobo (can't remember if my Kindle PW3 was the same) that the % it marks me at is not always the % I'm at, if I take the "x of y" page numbers. Often times it would say I'm at 50% but by the page numbers it would really be like 55%. I didn't realize it weighed formatted sections differently.

[SlowerThanSlow]

In reading non-fiction, I have very different goals than when reading fiction.

Fiction is strictly for entertainment and for the suspension of reality.

Nonfiction has other purposes, including promoting self-development, gathering of general knowledge, satisfying my curiosity, and getting how-to instruction. I read until I find these kinds of purposes are fulfilled and then I usually stop reading. Here are four current examples:

I am reading an Alexander Hamilton biography. I am stalled about half way through, but feel I have a good understanding of his life and personality now, something I didn't have before. Will I resume reading? Probably, soon, because I am getting curious about it again.

I am reading a tome by Hans Kung, a Catholic theologian that I have carted around the world with me for almost four decades, always intending to read it someday. Each sitting I read about three pages, and that gives me a bunch of things to muse on, so I put it down for a few days, only to take it up again.

I am reading a math book that consists of brief descriptions of various rather fun math problems. I read about one problem a week, and work on the problem in my head as I have time and interest. Then I read another one.

I am reading a how-to book on instrument making. I read the section over and over that corresponds to my actual instrument making efforts in my shop.

Ah yes, for the record, 3 of 4 are electronic, and I read them on my phone or tablet.