New version of DRM removal tools ("DeDRM")

[ratinox]

Originally Posted by shalym

Are you sure? Amazon is doing exactly that with the encryption attached to the KFX format. Every time it is cracked, the encryption changes, usually within 24 hours.

Shari

Yes. Amazon can arbitrarily change everything because they have full control over their ecosystem, and they can say "you have to upgrade to this minimum firmware or program version" and make it stick. EDRLab are constrained by vendor neutrality and device interoperability. They can't make arbitrary changes without breaking their customers' customers' devices. But like I wrote before: undertstanding why is a dive into encryption and PKI, and this is not the place for that.

[darryl]

I would add to ratinox's comments by pointing out that this is where Adobe also came unstuck. They succeeded once in forcing an upgrade on all customers but had to back down when they tried to do the same again. As a result their new "hardened" drm is now not so new but has still not achieved widespread adoption. Of course Adobe seemed to quickly realise that those wishing to remove drm are really very much a niche market and do not seem to have suffered materailly from the use of the tools. Even Amazon seems to be quite happy to allow DRM removal in most cases. My understanding is that whilst it upgrades K4PC aggressively it has made no attempt to stop downloads of azw3 and even mobi formats nor to enforce minimum versions of software/firmware outside of highly priced rental textbooks. Amazon largely seems to derive a little benefit by selling its books to those who want to read other than on an Amazon device.

[vega1970]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But Readium DRM would mean we are screwed. There is no eInk Reader that supports LCP.

You are wrong. In Europe, all the latest eInk readers made by Bookeen (the new Notea and both the Diva and Diva HD) support both Adobe and LCP DRMs.

In english speaking countries, LCP protected Epubs are hard to find. But in french speaking countries, it isn't so uncommon. A few online stores are selling them: EPagine.fr, bookeenstore.com, librel.be, e-readers.ch, gallimardnumerique.com, ...

[Ocipus]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Given Readium's hostile take down, I can easily see them changing the DRM just enough for the existing code to fail.

Originally Posted by shalym

Are you sure? Amazon is doing exactly that with the encryption attached to the KFX format. Every time it is cracked, the encryption changes, usually within 24 hours.

Shari

I think every thing that is made for publishing can not be safe DRMed.
Some examples of the History:
Music in WMA or iTunes M4A format.
Movies DVD, Blu-Ray, streams,
Music CDs, Music streams, Spotify and Deezer are also Modded APKs outside.
Games.

Also all the eBook formats before:
LRF, PDB, MOBI (Mobipocket), Amazon, Adobe PDF and Adept, Kobo KePub, Apples iBooks, ...

Originally Posted by PeterT

But remember, their real focus is on Kobo supplied ebooks, and library materials fulfilled via the Kobo store. I doubt we'd see any support from them without an update to the RMSDK version that they use, and I sense that update is in itself problematic.

I agree with you. Kobo use its own KePub.
RMSDK is a part of Adobe software and Adobe have no benefits of patching LCP inside. They want to spread its own DRM.

[Ocipus]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But Readium DRM would mean we are screwed. There is no eInk Reader that supports LCP.

Originally Posted by vega1970

You are wrong. In Europe, all the latest eInk readers made by Bookeen (the new Notea and both the Diva and Diva HD) support both Adobe and LCP DRMs.

Likewise, PocketBook add support for LCP DRM to new readers like Touch HD 3 and Tolino "support" LCP DRM.

But! To use Tolino with LCP is a pain in the A**.
There is a Bug and an update bring a bug, ...
A german site describe it
https://papierlos-lesen.de/tolino-up...onleihe-66523/

So we have 2 and a half readers.

(second) But!
eReaders are not Smartphones. The use lifetime is much longer.
My 3 readers are 3, 9 and 10 years old.
So there are many old readers in use which do not support LCP.

Originally Posted by vega1970

In english speaking countries, LCP protected Epubs are hard to find. But in french speaking countries, it isn't so uncommon. A few online stores are selling them: EPagine.fr, bookeenstore.com, librel.be, e-readers.ch, gallimardnumerique.com, ...

I think LCP is cheaper on long time use. You need money to implement it. Adobe cost money for every sell or lend in librarys.

If more Readers support it, so more stores will use it.
Also outside Europe.

[rantanplan]

Originally Posted by Ocipus

But! To use Tolino with LCP is a pain in the A**.
There is a Bug and an update bring a bug, ...
A german site describe it
https://papierlos-lesen.de/tolino-up...onleihe-66523/

Yes, and they have acknowledged that and are rebooting the reader from scratch with an improved one. Frank Bauer (technical leader for Tolino Inc.) details this during a Tolino Storydays talk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8hyEyRM3MM
Also, Tolino has enabled LCP for almost all of their devices, starting with the original Tolino Vision, the Shine 2HD and the original Tolino Page - essentially all devices starting 2014 - so almost everyone can make use of it.

Also PocketBook updated their current lineup.

And the reason is pretty simple. They know that one of the main reasons for their users to buy these devices is using it with their library. If LCP becomes relevant in the US, the vendors will implement it. If Overdrive adopts LCP, Kindle, Kobo and B&N will implement it.

[Ocipus]

I can't imagine that Kindle ever adopt LCP.
Kindle and OverDrive work together, but Kindle never adopt Adobe DRM.

Kobo? Yes maybe.
B&N? I don't know.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Ocipus

I can't imagine that Kindle ever adopt LCP.
Kindle and OverDrive work together, but Kindle never adopt Adobe DRM.

Kobo? Yes maybe.
B&N? I don't know.

Kobo has no need to implement LCP as you get most library eBooks from Kobo in KePub.

[darryl]

An EDRLabs rep seems to have joined Mobileread. Congratualatons to them for engaging. In addition to the joining message there was another thread on Thorium Reader which seems to have vanished.

They will find many critics here but I hope that we will nevertheless make them welcome.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/member.php?u=325585

[Moonbase59]

Originally Posted by darryl

An EDRLabs rep seems to have joined Mobileread. Congratualatons to them for engaging. In addition to the joining message there was another thread on Thorium Reader which seems to have vanished.

Yeah, I wonder what happened. They were announcing Thorium Reader 1.8.0 (a Readium-based Electron app), and I actually gave the AppImage a quick spin. Too bad all my feedback is gone now, too.

TL;DR: I quite liked it – clean user interface, available for Mac, Linux, Windows. One of the most compatible readers (EPUB3, PDF, DAISY, others). Many features like OPDS, TTS (not so good on Linux), working LCP, fast. It’s not meant for library management, most features missing there. This—and maybe Foliate—could well be the desktop readers of choice for those who don’t wish for a fully-fledged solution like Calibre.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by Ocipus

I can't imagine that Kindle ever adopt LCP.
Kindle and OverDrive work together, but Kindle never adopt Adobe DRM.

Kobo? Yes maybe.
B&N? I don't know.

Also Amazon doesn't co-operate with libraries. So no LCP on Kindle.

[cfrizz]

The problem that I'm running into with library books is that libraries here in the states are switching over to Hoopla, which I have no interest in since I read the majority of my books on my pc, which isn't an option in Hoopla!

So my library usage has dropped radically, which means most of the big publishers are going unread by me and I have switched over to self published, and there is plenty to read there!

If I find a sale on one of their books, I'll buy it. Screw them, you take away my choices and options, I'll just dump your a$$!

[John F]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

The problem that I'm running into with library books is that libraries here in the states are switching over to Hoopla, which I have no interest in since I read the majority of my books on my pc, which isn't an option in Hoopla!

So my library usage has dropped radically, which means most of the big publishers are going unread by me and I have switched over to self published, and there is plenty to read there!

If I find a sale on one of their books, I'll buy it. Screw them, you take away my choices and options, I'll just dump your a$$!

I just tried, and I can read books on a PC using Hoopla. This is on Windows 10, and they call it "streaming"; I assume you need an internet connection while reading. I would tend to think you could also use Linux or a Mac since it appears to use a browser.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by darryl

An EDRLabs rep seems to have joined Mobileread. Congratualatons to them for engaging. In addition to the joining message there was another thread on Thorium Reader which seems to have vanished.

Moved, not vanished.
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=344415

Originally Posted by Moonbase59

Yeah, I wonder what happened. They were announcing Thorium Reader 1.8.0 (a Readium-based Electron app), and I actually gave the AppImage a quick spin. Too bad all my feedback is gone now, too.

No, the entire thread wa smoved.

[darryl]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Moved, not vanished.
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=344415



No, the entire thread wa smoved.

Thanks for that. I looked and searched for Thorium reader and did not find it. Also searched for posts by Teamedrlabs. It had vanished for me. Thanks for finding it.