Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book Formats > Kindle Formats

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-16-2021, 10:01 AM   #1
Big Howard
Junior Member
Big Howard began at the beginning.
 
Posts: 2
Karma: 10
Join Date: Mar 2021
Device: none
MOBI support for reflowable files ending on June 28, 2021

Hey all.

I posted this on the Kindle developers forum, but perhaps it would be of more interest here. Mods, please feel free to remove as you see fit.

I received this notification from KDP Customer Support today:

Quote:
We listened to your feedback and are making it simpler to publish eBooks on Kindle. Starting June 28, 2021, we will no longer support files in MOBI, PRC or AZK formats when publishing new reflowable eBooks or updating the content for previously published eBooks. Instead, we ask publishers to use EPUB, KPF (Kindle Create files), or DOC/DOCX (Microsoft Word files) files for reflowable eBooks. Please note MOBI files are still accepted for fixed-layout eBooks.
Have I misunderstood, or does this put an end to the "dual mobi" approach described in this thread?
Big Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2021, 11:07 AM   #2
JSWolf
Resident Curmudgeon
JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.JSWolf ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
JSWolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 62,420
Karma: 102150076
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts
Device: Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, iPad 4, iPhone SE 2020, PW3
I'm hoping this means that no more Mobi. Mobi should have gone away a long time ago.
JSWolf is offline   Reply With Quote
Advert
Old 03-16-2021, 11:21 AM   #3
jhowell
Wizard
jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
jhowell's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,348
Karma: 44001001
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Device: Oasis 2, Fire, iPad Air 2, Nexus 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Howard View Post
Starting June 28, 2021, we will no longer support files in MOBI, PRC or AZK formats when publishing new reflowable eBooks or updating the content for previously published eBooks.
Big news.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Howard View Post
Have I misunderstood, or does this put an end to the "dual mobi" approach described in this thread?
When you publish a reflowable book on Amazon using a MOBI or DOCX file Amazon converts it to all of the formats supported by old and new Kindle devices/apps. There is no need to publish using a "dual MOBI" (aka Master MOBI) to achieve that effect.
jhowell is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2021, 12:38 PM   #4
Big Howard
Junior Member
Big Howard began at the beginning.
 
Posts: 2
Karma: 10
Join Date: Mar 2021
Device: none
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhowell View Post
When you publish a reflowable book on Amazon using a MOBI or DOCX file Amazon converts it to all of the formats supported by old and new Kindle devices/apps. There is no need to publish using a "dual MOBI" (aka Master MOBI) to achieve that effect.
If Amazon will no longer allow me to upload the MOBI file that is created by KindleGen/Kindle Previewer, then how do I get the backwards compatibility to KF7 described by Tex2002ans here?

My concern is that, as Hitch says here, there are millions of older devices still out there, and they cannot read KF8.
Big Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2021, 12:52 PM   #5
Doitsu
Grand Sorcerer
Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Doitsu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Doitsu's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,176
Karma: 18533687
Join Date: Dec 2010
Device: Kindle PW2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Howard View Post
If Amazon will no longer allow me to upload the MOBI file that is created by KindleGen/Kindle Previewer, then how do I get the backwards compatibility to KF7 described by Tex2002ans here?
Simply upload valid epubs. Amazon will automatically generate books suitable for older devices.
Doitsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Advert
Old 03-16-2021, 02:01 PM   #6
Quoth
the rook, bossing Never.
Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Quoth's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,083
Karma: 23261818
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ireland
Device: Both Kinds: epub based makes and Kindle
Dual mobi is only for Smashwords or your own use.

The mobi format has been depreciated for UPLOADS years ago. The epub2 is recommended.

This has only ONE effect on Amazon customers. Newer Kindles may get more advanced formatting than possible from mobi uploads to KDP. Older Kindles will still get mobi/KF7 downloads.

AFAIK Amazon doesn't deliver dual mobi to customers.

What Doitsu says.

So this is hardly news. Amazon no longer accepts an upload format that no-one should be using and they recommended alternatives years ago.

Oodles of free and paid tools convert wordprocessor content to epub2.
Quoth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2021, 02:24 PM   #7
jhowell
Wizard
jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
jhowell's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,348
Karma: 44001001
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Device: Oasis 2, Fire, iPad Air 2, Nexus 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
I'm hoping this means that no more Mobi. Mobi should have gone away a long time ago.
There is no sign that the elimination of the book delivery formats needed to support older Kindle devices is driving this change or is even a goal of Amazon.

I believe that this change is a step toward making all reflowable books published in the future available in the newer KFX format.
jhowell is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2021, 03:14 PM   #8
Tex2002ans
Wizard
Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,753
Karma: 7811809
Join Date: Jul 2012
Device: Kobo Forma, Nook
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhowell View Post
I believe that this change is a step toward making all reflowable books published in the future available in the newer KFX format.
This is what I'm thinking too.

Probably wanted to slowly phase out the "Dual MOBI"/ancient formats + push their new KFX format.

Also making sure people who are updating older ebooks are now following more modern code/standards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doitsu View Post
Simply upload valid epubs. Amazon will automatically generate books suitable for older devices.
Yep, that's also what I'm thinking.

So you could either:

1 (Best). Upload EPUB.

Amazon will generate all the files (KF7+KF8+KFX) for you.

2. Upload KPF (just like you would the "Dual MOBI").

Amazon will generate (KF7+KFX) for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhowell View Post
There is no sign that the elimination of the book delivery formats needed to support older Kindle devices is driving this change or is even a goal of Amazon.
Exactly. Seems to me it's just simplifying the input.

(Although I wish Amazon were more open... would be interesting to see exactly how much garbage they get. What % of ebooks coming in are still PRC/AZK/Calibre-converted-MOBI, etc.)

I'm betting they've been spending a ton on customer support dealing with the confusion around "Dual MOBI" as well.

And as was discussed last year in those linked threads... there's a whole bunch of nonsense about MOBI floating around online too. This KPF push probably lets them get rid of a decade+ of baggage.

Last edited by Tex2002ans; 03-18-2021 at 03:29 PM.
Tex2002ans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2021, 04:25 PM   #9
odamizu
just an egg
odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
odamizu's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,312
Karma: 2170814
Join Date: Mar 2015
Device: Kindle Oasis1 & Voyage, iOS
So if author/publisher uploads KPF, there will be no KF8 available to readers? If readers go to Amazon website and "download for transfer via USB" they will get KF7?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex2002ans View Post
... So you could either:

1 (Best). Upload EPUB.

Amazon will generate all the files (KF7+KF8+KFX) for you.

2. Upload KPF (just like you would the "Dual MOBI").

Amazon will generate (KF7+KFX) for you.
odamizu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2021, 05:11 PM   #10
Tex2002ans
Wizard
Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,753
Karma: 7811809
Join Date: Jul 2012
Device: Kobo Forma, Nook
Quote:
Originally Posted by odamizu View Post
So if author/publisher uploads KPF, there will be no KF8 available to readers?
Yes, I believe that's correct.

I think I recall jhowell explaining it in detail in one of those threads a few months ago. See his Post #3 in "ebook in KFX and old-mobi - no KF8".

(Although that was a KPF out of Kindle Create. Unsure if that still holds for a KPF out of the new Kindle Previewer.)

Last edited by Tex2002ans; 03-18-2021 at 05:13 PM.
Tex2002ans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2021, 09:15 PM   #11
jhowell
Wizard
jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
jhowell's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,348
Karma: 44001001
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Device: Oasis 2, Fire, iPad Air 2, Nexus 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex2002ans View Post
(Although that was a KPF out of Kindle Create. Unsure if that still holds for a KPF out of the new Kindle Previewer.)
That is still an open question. The KPF produced using the Kindle Previewer includes the source file so it would be possible for Amazon to run that through kindlegen and produce KF8. But it is also possible that they might be using the same workflow as they do for KPF files from Kindle Create that result only in MOBI7 as a fallback.

I am hoping that someone will publish a book using a Previewer KPF and let us know the ASIN so that this can be determined one way or the other.
jhowell is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2021, 12:04 AM   #12
odamizu
just an egg
odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.odamizu ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
odamizu's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,312
Karma: 2170814
Join Date: Mar 2015
Device: Kindle Oasis1 & Voyage, iOS
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhowell View Post
... I am hoping that someone will publish a book using a Previewer KPF and let us know the ASIN so that this can be determined one way or the other.
Any guesses or speculation on how many publishers upload epub vs Previewer KPF?

(I'd like to think most publishers upload epub. Wouldn't that make sense if they are also distributing to other vendors, like Kobo, GooglePlay, and Overdrive? Or am I exercising wishful thinking?)
odamizu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2021, 12:36 AM   #13
Tex2002ans
Wizard
Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Tex2002ans ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,753
Karma: 7811809
Join Date: Jul 2012
Device: Kobo Forma, Nook
Quote:
Originally Posted by odamizu View Post
Any guesses or speculation on how many publishers upload epub vs Previewer KPF?
I'm going to guess they're completely dwarfed by the sheer amount of self-published DOCX.

As you could tell from Amazon's KDP help pages...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhowell View Post
I am hoping that someone will publish a book using a Previewer KPF and let us know the ASIN so that this can be determined one way or the other.
I thought we tested that out a few months ago?

If not, the next ebook I complete, I'll ask them to test out KPF input, then send you the ASIN.
Tex2002ans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2021, 09:16 AM   #14
Hitch
Bookmaker & Cat Slave
Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hitch ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Hitch's Avatar
 
Posts: 8,995
Karma: 103555555
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Device: K2, iPad, KFire, PPW, Voyage, NookColor. 2 Droid, Oasis, Boox Note2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quoth View Post
Dual mobi is only for Smashwords or your own use.

The mobi format has been depreciated for UPLOADS years ago. The epub2 is recommended.

This has only ONE effect on Amazon customers. Newer Kindles may get more advanced formatting than possible from mobi uploads to KDP. Older Kindles will still get mobi/KF7 downloads.

AFAIK Amazon doesn't deliver dual mobi to customers.

What Doitsu says.

So this is hardly news. Amazon no longer accepts an upload format that no-one should be using and they recommended alternatives years ago.

Oodles of free and paid tools convert wordprocessor content to epub2.

Mmmmm...I wouldn't say that. We're still giving dual-mobi hand-coded MOBI files to our customers. I don't want "one file to rule them all" for the simple reason that this means no media queries for the (various) Kindle formats--KF7, KF8, etc. And when you're doing more-complex books, with images, text boxes, blabbety-blab, you bloody well need them.

YES, we can do that with an ePUB specifically made for KDP, but then if you're in the biz, where customers routinely upload the wrong files (despite detailed, pictorial, step-by-step, click-by-click Guides and handouts that you send to them!), sending a single client two ePUBs and hoping that they'll upload the right one is nerve-wracking. And if anybody here says, "but, but, HITCH, put "Amazon" or "KDP" in the file name," run for your life.

Yeah, 'cuz that ALWAYS works. (not).

Hitch
Hitch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2021, 10:00 AM   #15
jhowell
Wizard
jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jhowell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
jhowell's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,348
Karma: 44001001
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Device: Oasis 2, Fire, iPad Air 2, Nexus 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by odamizu View Post
Any guesses or speculation on how many publishers upload epub vs Previewer KPF?
I suspect that practically no one publishes using a KPF file produced using the Kindle Previewer. There is no advantage to doing that instead of the EPUB or DOCX source document, except possibly in the case Hitch mentions where she wants to be sure that the file destined for Amazon gets used.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex2002ans View Post
I thought we tested that out a few months ago?

If not, the next ebook I complete, I'll ask them to test out KPF input, then send you the ASIN.
I don't recall having access to a book published using a Previewer KPF. It would be informative if we could be sure that it was actually published that way.
jhowell is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to convert mobi files to magazine/newspaper like mobi files. patoliadixit Conversion 0 07-02-2020 12:00 PM
Intel Ending CPU Socket Support. Apache News 55 12-30-2012 09:33 PM
Harlequin 25% off ebooks coupon for November (Mobi & LIT downloads ending soon) ATDrake Deals and Resources (No Self-Promotion or Affiliate Links) 0 11-05-2011 02:07 AM
How well does the iLiad support HTML and mobi files? + FBReader Ea iRex 15 11-06-2008 03:42 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:11 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.