Looking for Volunteers for New Chapters for Sigil User's Guide - Page 13

KevinH · 03-01-2021, 06:30 PM

As for inconsistencies, which or these is most preferred:

BookBrowser vs Book Browser
CodeView vs Code-View vs Codeview vs ...
SpellCheck vs Spell Check vs Spellcheck vs ...
e-reader vs ereader
e-reading device vs ereading device
file name vs filename
epub vs EPUB vs ePub vs EPub vs ...
dialog vs dialogue
toolbar vs tool bar vs ToolBar vs ...
e-book vs ebook vs eBook vs ...

I do not mind a little inconsistency but ...

odamizu · 03-01-2021, 08:13 PM

I think it should be consistent with Sigil's User Interface.

For example:

The Book Browser window is literally titled: Book Browser
The main menu is literally: View > Toolbars
The main menu is literally: Tools > Spellcheck
The UI is inconsistent on epub/EPUB/ePub/Epub
Etc.

If we follow the UI for Book Browser, then I think Code View is appropriate.

For the rest, I suggest picking a dictionary as arbiter (keeping in mind that different dictionaries may disagree — which is why it's best to pick one dictionary as the final word).

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinH

As for inconsistencies, which or these is most preferred:

BookBrowser vs Book Browser
CodeView vs Code-View vs Codeview vs ...
SpellCheck vs Spell Check vs Spellcheck vs ...
e-reader vs ereader
e-reading device vs ereading device
file name vs filename
epub vs EPUB vs ePub vs EPub vs ...
dialog vs dialogue
toolbar vs tool bar vs ToolBar vs ...
e-book vs ebook vs eBook vs ...

I do not mind a little inconsistency but ...

DNSB · 03-01-2021, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinH

As for inconsistencies, which or these is most preferred:

BookBrowser vs Book Browser
CodeView vs Code-View vs Codeview vs ...
SpellCheck vs Spell Check vs Spellcheck vs ...
e-reader vs ereader
e-reading device vs ereading device
file name vs filename
epub vs EPUB vs ePub vs EPub vs ...
dialog vs dialogue
toolbar vs tool bar vs ToolBar vs ...
e-book vs ebook vs eBook vs ...

I do not mind a little inconsistency but ...

A few of them:

BookBrowser I'll leave up to you and diapdealer. Just be consistent.

e-reader

EPUB since that's what the registered trademark is

dialogue but then I'm Canadian.

toolbar Just don't start calling it a ribbon.

ebook but as with e-reader, no real consensus

filename vs file name? A bit of an oddity. Generally when referring to computer storage, I use filename while talking to a person, file name would be used.

Pretty much as long as the terms are used consistently, most users won't care.

Ashjuk · 03-02-2021, 04:20 AM

I have checked tutorial_stylesheets.

1. Some minor changes to the text.

2. I have changed the following image tutorial-syles-example.png as the original image was showing a different style that that mentioned in the text.

3. Added the image stylesheet-check.png, and added associated text to indicate the stylesheet reference in the <head> section.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/at...1&d=1614676714

Ashjuk · 03-02-2021, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinH

As for inconsistencies, which or these is most preferred:

BookBrowser vs Book Browser
CodeView vs Code-View vs Codeview vs ...
SpellCheck vs Spell Check vs Spellcheck vs ...
e-reader vs ereader
e-reading device vs ereading device
file name vs filename
epub vs EPUB vs ePub vs EPub vs ...
dialog vs dialogue
toolbar vs tool bar vs ToolBar vs ...
e-book vs ebook vs eBook vs ...

I do not mind a little inconsistency but ...

For what it's worth these are my preferences:

BookBrowser
CodeView
Spellcheck
eReader
ereading
filename
ePub
dialogue (but then you would have to use colour, favourite, labour etc etc.

)
toolbar
ebook

I don't think it makes a huge difference whatever format is used as long as it's clear what it means. There are always going to be differences when you involve people on opposite sides of the 'pond'.

KevinH · 03-02-2021, 09:43 AM

Thank you! I will integrate this into the next version hopefully out today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashjuk

I have checked tutorial_stylesheets.

1. Some minor changes to the text.

2. I have changed the following image tutorial-syles-example.png as the original image was showing a different style that that mentioned in the text.

3. Added the image stylesheet-check.png, and added associated text to indicate the stylesheet reference in the <head> section.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/at...1&d=1614676714

KevinH · 03-02-2021, 11:03 AM

I checked a couple of online dictionaries and "dialogue" means a conversation whereas "dialog" is a a window in a computer program, so we will be using "dialog".

A few other choices made:

e-reader (as eReader was a trade marked name of an early reader that has gone out of business)

ebook (we currently do not use e-book anyplace so why change it)

Code View (to go along with Book View)

Spellcheck (to match the menus and dialog name)

spell checking (the act of using Spellcehck)

Book Browser (to match the dialog name)

toolbars

But we have a royal mess when it comes to "epub" variants:

Here are the current variants and counts:

EPUB 303
epub 62
ePub 11
EPub 0
EPub 34

But some of those variants are used in dialogs and menus inside of Sigil which would mean all new translations for every one I changed. Make work for translators in Sigil is not what I want. Only about 5 to 10 languages try to actually keep up with what we have and many are lagging far far behind.

So I think we will just leave the mishmash of epub variants as they are mainly in the Menu's and code and only change the ones directly in the user-guide (not in a menuitem's) to use EPUB since it is the most prevalent case.

I will post the latest version of the updated user guide later this afternoon.

We still need someone to claim and update the tutorial_convert_to_html.html who has played around with the various odf and docx plugins.

If you can help please do!

Thanks,

KevinH

KevinH · 03-02-2021, 08:00 PM

The first post in this thread has been updated to include all of the above edited chapters so far.

It is named:

src_updated_20210302_01.epub

odamizu · 03-02-2021, 11:49 PM

I am working on the Book Browser chapter (also the Manage Plugins chapter sort of simultaneously when I need a break from one or the other).

I've figured out how to move a file to a different internal folder, but I would like to also include how to create a new internal folder, change an internal folder name, and change an internal folder path.

Ashjuk · 03-03-2021, 04:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by odamizu

I've figured out how to move a file to a different internal folder, but I would like to also include how to create a new internal folder, change an internal folder name, and change an internal folder path.

I am probably wrong about this but I'm not sure you can alter the folder structure of an epub - is it not part of the standard?

I have just been trying things in Sigil and I can't see any way of adding or renaming a folder.

I have even tried to add a folder by unzipping an epub. Doing that you don't even see the full folder structure as shown in Sigil (the Fonts, Styles, Audio, Video and Misc folders are not shown).

I added a new folder under OEPBS and zipped it back up. When I opened that in Sigil all I got was an error message about files not being in the manifest. If I close that the new folder is not there.

Edit:
I have just done some more testing and it seems the folders don't appear in an unzipped file unless they actually have some content.

The_book · 03-03-2021, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashjuk

I am probably wrong about this but I'm not sure you can alter the folder structure of an epub - is it not part of the standard?

I have just been trying things in Sigil and I can't see any way of adding or renaming a folder.

I have even tried to add a folder by unzipping an epub. Doing that you don't even see the full folder structure as shown in Sigil (the Fonts, Styles, Audio, Video and Misc folders are not shown).

I added a new folder under OEPBS and zipped it back up. When I opened that in Sigil all I got was an error message about files not being in the manifest. If I close that the new folder is not there.

I'm not sure, but I think it is the move... function you can see when you right click on the files in the Book Browser.

you can select existing folders or create new floders by this function.

And it seems if you move all the fils in one folder to another one, this folder will be remove automatically.

Ashjuk · 03-03-2021, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinH

We still need someone to claim and update the tutorial_convert_to_html.html who has played around with the various odf and docx plugins.

If you can help please do!

Thanks,

KevinH

I have taken a look at this chapter.

It is something I have not done before using Sigil but it all seemed fairly obvious to me. I have added some links to websites that are tutorials on converting Word documents to html, and also a link to a MS app that does the conversion.

I also installed the DOCXImport plugin and successfully imported a docx file into a new EPUB, so I have written a brief explanation - along with some new images - of its operation.

Hopefully it will be OK for you.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/at...1&d=1614773661

Ashjuk · 03-03-2021, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_book

I'm not sure, but I think it is the move... function you can see when you right click on the files in the Book Browser.

you can select existing folders or create new floders by this function.

And it seems if you move all the fils in one folder to another one, this folder will be remove automatically.

I have tried moving a file to an existing folder, and also to a new folder, but nothing happens when I do that.

If I click on the down arrow in the Select Destination Folder the only option I see is the existing folder. If I type a new folder name in the box it is not created.

From what I can see you can only have text files in Text, images in Images etc.

KevinH · 03-03-2021, 07:57 AM

Hi Ashjuk and odamizu,
The Book Browser shows folders which represent the group or type of file not its path. It is in essence a virtual folder so that you can multi select files of the same type even if they are actually in different locations.

To see a file's actual path inside the epub, you have two options. The first is to mouse over the file and its actual path will be displayed in a tooltip, along with other information like semantic type or manifest properties.

The second is to use Sigil's Preference settings to tell it to show the full paths in Book Browser all the time.

So as others answered, you can use Move in Book Browser to specify a new folder via the pulldown menu or enter a completely new path by typing.

Any empty folders are stripped away since folders without resources are meaningless. So to rename a folder, just create a new folder and then move all of the files from the old to the new. When saving, empty folders are just not created.

Depending on your Pref settings you will either see the names paths change or hover over to see the new path info.

The actual file types and their groupings stay the same.

KevinH · 03-03-2021, 08:11 AM

The rules on epub structure or layout have never really been fixed under epub2 and have gotten more fluid under epub3. All versions of Sigil before 1.0 (even way back to 0.6 and 0.7.2) forced every epub into Sigil's own hard coded structure. We changed that.

For epub2, the spec used to recommend but not require a folder like OEBPS to hold the resource files but does not specify a name. It also does not require separate sub-folders by type (like Styles or styles or ...). It does not specify a name for the opf, so content.opf or package.opf or ... are allowed. Same for the ncx.

So all of that structure, Sigil forced on every epub it edited immediately when opened. This act of forcing a structure resulted in almost every file in the epub to be edited to update links, urls, and references. Neither of these are something professional book editors typically like.

For epub3, the spec is even looser so even things like the OEBPS are not required or even recommended.

So Sigil post 1.0 finally follows the spec (which is why it was named version 1.0!) so you can create any layout you want. It also provides a simple tool to convert everything back to the old "standard" locations that used to be hard-coded by Sigil since it is favoured by many and is a simple logical structure.

Hope this helps. Just understand that Book Browser is NOT a File Explorer NOR a File Browser, it uses file type groupings as logical folders to organize files by type, making it easy to find files and to multi-select files of the same type for all of Book Browser's other tools (renaming, moving, deleting, etc). You determine the actual structure you want.

03-03-2021, 07:57 AM	#194
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,859 Karma: 6120478 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	Hi Ashjuk and odamizu, The Book Browser shows folders which represent the group or type of file not its path. It is in essence a virtual folder so that you can multi select files of the same type even if they are actually in different locations. To see a file's actual path inside the epub, you have two options. The first is to mouse over the file and its actual path will be displayed in a tooltip, along with other information like semantic type or manifest properties. The second is to use Sigil's Preference settings to tell it to show the full paths in Book Browser all the time. So as others answered, you can use Move in Book Browser to specify a new folder via the pulldown menu or enter a completely new path by typing. Any empty folders are stripped away since folders without resources are meaningless. So to rename a folder, just create a new folder and then move all of the files from the old to the new. When saving, empty folders are just not created. Depending on your Pref settings you will either see the names paths change or hover over to see the new path info. The actual file types and their groupings stay the same. Last edited by KevinH; 03-03-2021 at 08:18 AM.

03-03-2021, 08:11 AM	#195
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,859 Karma: 6120478 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	The rules on epub structure or layout have never really been fixed under epub2 and have gotten more fluid under epub3. All versions of Sigil before 1.0 (even way back to 0.6 and 0.7.2) forced every epub into Sigil's own hard coded structure. We changed that. For epub2, the spec used to recommend but not require a folder like OEBPS to hold the resource files but does not specify a name. It also does not require separate sub-folders by type (like Styles or styles or ...). It does not specify a name for the opf, so content.opf or package.opf or ... are allowed. Same for the ncx. So all of that structure, Sigil forced on every epub it edited immediately when opened. This act of forcing a structure resulted in almost every file in the epub to be edited to update links, urls, and references. Neither of these are something professional book editors typically like. For epub3, the spec is even looser so even things like the OEBPS are not required or even recommended. So Sigil post 1.0 finally follows the spec (which is why it was named version 1.0!) so you can create any layout you want. It also provides a simple tool to convert everything back to the old "standard" locations that used to be hard-coded by Sigil since it is favoured by many and is a simple logical structure. Hope this helps. Just understand that Book Browser is NOT a File Explorer NOR a File Browser, it uses file type groupings as logical folders to organize files by type, making it easy to find files and to multi-select files of the same type for all of Book Browser's other tools (renaming, moving, deleting, etc). You determine the actual structure you want. Last edited by KevinH; 03-03-2021 at 08:27 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Wanted: Volunteers to Update the Sigil User's Guide	KevinH	Sigil	55	05-18-2018 02:52 AM
Sigil Improvement Projects for Developers/Volunteers	KevinH	Sigil	19	06-27-2016 06:19 PM
Sigil and chapters.	p3aul	Sigil	5	11-29-2012 09:23 PM
Sigil + Adobe Digital Editions + chapters	wkuiper	Sigil	6	11-23-2012 10:58 AM
Sigil and epub (can I delete empty chapters?)	desaderal	Sigil	3	03-24-2011 07:57 AM

03-01-2021, 06:30 PM	#181
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,859 Karma: 6120478 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	As for inconsistencies, which or these is most preferred: BookBrowser vs Book Browser CodeView vs Code-View vs Codeview vs ... SpellCheck vs Spell Check vs Spellcheck vs ... e-reader vs ereader e-reading device vs ereading device file name vs filename epub vs EPUB vs ePub vs EPub vs ... dialog vs dialogue toolbar vs tool bar vs ToolBar vs ... e-book vs ebook vs eBook vs ... I do not mind a little inconsistency but ...

03-02-2021, 11:03 AM	#187
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,859 Karma: 6120478 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	I checked a couple of online dictionaries and "dialogue" means a conversation whereas "dialog" is a a window in a computer program, so we will be using "dialog". A few other choices made: e-reader (as eReader was a trade marked name of an early reader that has gone out of business) ebook (we currently do not use e-book anyplace so why change it) Code View (to go along with Book View) Spellcheck (to match the menus and dialog name) spell checking (the act of using Spellcehck) Book Browser (to match the dialog name) toolbars But we have a royal mess when it comes to "epub" variants: Here are the current variants and counts: EPUB 303 epub 62 ePub 11 EPub 0 EPub 34 But some of those variants are used in dialogs and menus inside of Sigil which would mean all new translations for every one I changed. Make work for translators in Sigil is not what I want. Only about 5 to 10 languages try to actually keep up with what we have and many are lagging far far behind. So I think we will just leave the mishmash of epub variants as they are mainly in the Menu's and code and only change the ones directly in the user-guide (not in a menuitem's) to use EPUB since it is the most prevalent case. I will post the latest version of the updated user guide later this afternoon. We still need someone to claim and update the tutorial_convert_to_html.html who has played around with the various odf and docx plugins. If you can help please do! Thanks, KevinH

03-02-2021, 08:00 PM	#188
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,859 Karma: 6120478 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	The first post in this thread has been updated to include all of the above edited chapters so far. It is named: src_updated_20210302_01.epub

03-02-2021, 11:49 PM	#189
odamizu just an egg Posts: 1,834 Karma: 8006102 Join Date: Mar 2015 Device: Kindle, iOS	I am working on the Book Browser chapter (also the Manage Plugins chapter sort of simultaneously when I need a break from one or the other). I've figured out how to move a file to a different internal folder, but I would like to also include how to create a new internal folder, change an internal folder name, and change an internal folder path.