Amazon 'Destroyed the Retail Industry Across the US'

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Did they have addictive drugs in Greece in those days?
Or was it all wine and lotus?

As my mother used to put it: "Grandchildren: A grandparent's revenge."

[crich70]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Big box stores like B&N ran mom & pop bookstores out of business. Now they're on the side of the angels? Go figure.

Yep, I think it's just a natural progression. The mom and pop stores went belly up due to the big grocery/dept. stores moving in and now just as the mom & pop's before them things are changing again to a more online model. One of my local grocery stores (Pick & Save) now allows you to go shopping online and you can either pick up at the door or they can deliver. Who'd have guessed that would happen some 20 yrs ago? People want to have convenience without having to navigate crowded aisles. Amazon is just riding the wave of innovation I think.

[binaryhermit]

As a grocery store wage slave, I wish more grocery stores had "save" in their name...

"Thank you for shopping at Pick and Slave". Or something

[fjtorres]

Well, that sure sums it up right there.
Amazon is the patron god of robots.

[Anabana]

So, going back a bit (I didn't read every post and hope I'm not repeating), that damned Henry Ford put the horse and carriages out of business! Did he retrain any of them to be auto mechanics? I hardly think so...
And what about the businesses that made those giant (ugly) tv antennas that were on every roof? What happened to them? And who cares...?

[darryl]

Even the title of this thread is misleading. A thriving retail industry still exists. The industry itself is not at all under threat. What has happened is that progress has changed the industry. In particular the Internet has allowed a significant part of the industry to offer their goods online, with Amazon in particular leading this development. The industry has not been destroyed. It has been changed. And, as usual, those badly affected by the change are screaming long and loud. Those who cannot compete on the basis of price and convenience scream long and loud and often ask for government intervention to save their outdated and unwanted businesses. In doing so they often exaggerate and place significant value on aspects of their business which the new market shows many just don't care about. Take for instance the personal experience of dealing with a real knowledgeable human being in a book shop. Firstly, many neither want or value this. When I used to visit and purchase from book shops, I simply wanted to be left alone to browse in peace. When discount department stores started stocking books I would rush to buy from them, often at prices $4 or $5 cheaper than the book store directly opposite. And let's face it, even if you did value the knowledgeable human element, it would more often than not come in the form of a pimply faced kid on minimum wage with little idea of anything beyond a few favourites and the latest best sellers, or sometimes obnoxious literary pretentiousness unbecoming of their years and experience. People now have a wider choice and are voting with their feet. Give me Amazon online any day.

The situation is very simple. If enough people value and patronise independent book stores and other brick and mortar retail stores some will survive.

[binaryhermit]

I was gonna say, if retail is dead, why did I go to work today, and what were all those customers doing there?

(DISCLAIMER: I wage slave at a grocery store)

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Anabana

So, going back a bit (I didn't read every post and hope I'm not repeating), that damned Henry Ford put the horse and carriages out of business! Did he retrain any of them to be auto mechanics? I hardly think so...

Actually, he did.
The Henry Ford Trade School ran from 1916-1952.
It taught all sorts of manufacturing and repair skills, along with more conventional schoolwork. There's a few books on it.

https://www.detroitnews.com/picture-...boys/96841824/

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fZoTS_Xetxk

Ford ran a very patternalistic organization that strived to take good care of its people, paying higher than normal wages and implementing very liberal policies for the times.

But as the saying goes, you either die young or live long enough to become the villain and Ford lived long; long enough to see his paternalism fall out of fashion and he ended up a foe of labor unions.

Here's a quickie bio, both good and bad.

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Anabana

And what about the businesses that made those giant (ugly) tv antennas that were on every roof? What happened to them? And who cares...?

They still make antennas. Cheapskates and folk that don't want pay for the fare from 'Basic Cable'. Put one up OUTSIDE. 140 (Logical) channels can be had in the South SF Bay area: FREE OTOH rural or Terrain severely limits reception. (where I now live= 4)

The size (width) was because of VHF (2-13) frequencies.
2-7 frequencies are gone (the numbers you see are Logical, not frequencies. You need a chart to see those)
UHF (the old 14-83) is where most US HDTV channels are. UHF antennas are narrow.
The number of front to back elements (VHF or UHF) is about FOCUS. more tightens the beam, avoiding ghost reflections.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by theducks

They still make antennas. Cheapskates and folk that don't want pay for the fare from 'Basic Cable'.

Yup. Antennas areback, big time.

And not just for cheapskates.
Cord cutters are the biggest antenna buyers these days, often alongside DVR boxes like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Fire-TV-Recas.../dp/B01J6A6H74

Yes, of course Amazon is going to be in the middle of another revolution.

Cable companies are losing subscribers by the million.
Check this place for a blow by blow account of the ongoing revolution:

https://www.cordcuttersnews.com

It's not just publishers being disentermediated, now, it's cablecos and satcos.

Not only are producers taking their shows directly to Netflix, Prime, Hulu, Youtube Premium, etc. but the cable Networks themselves are streaming their own content directly to consumers like HBO, FOXNEWS, SHOWTIME, MLB, DC UNIVERSE, etc. In fact, look up Philo--it's owned and operated by a combo of the "smaller" cable networks--it directly streams 58 popular cable channels for $20 a month.

https://help.philo.com/hc/en-us/arti...Channel-Lineup

More are coming, with WB, Disney, and NBC UNIVERSAL launching their services over the next months.

The key things about all the services is they are on-demand, contract free, and ad-free. And you can activate for a month, deactivate, and activate something else. Rinse and repeat or mix-n-match.

Even more, there is a new trend for "free" ad-supported streaming services and those too are growing: CW, CWSEED, PLUTO, TUBI, IMDB TV, ROKU TV, ABC, NBC, FOX, etc. No fly by night startups there, either. It's the big boys covering all their bets because nobody knows how it'll shake down. It's exactly like ebook world, circa 2009.

No cable or satellite box needed, just internet.

Antennas are a complement for all this, for local channels.
Quite cheap ($10 and up).

But real "cheapskates" build their own, for $4 and up.

As you pointed out, HD TV runs mostly on UHF (soon *only* on UHF) so any little chunk of wire can do if you're close enough. Youtube is littered with videos for PVC PIPE HD ANTENNAs. Some skip the PVC in favor of soda cans or just coax wire. (The plastic pipe is to protect the wire.)

Think of them as "indie" antennas.

This particular revolution started five years ago but the real explosion is next year. Everybody wants your eyeballs.

Bottom line is *everything* in content is changing; books, newspapers, magazines, audio, video.

And yes, retail.
But changing isn't dying.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by darryl

Even the title of this thread is misleading. A thriving retail industry still exists. The industry itself is not at all under threat. What has happened is that progress has changed the industry. In particular the Internet has allowed a significant part of the industry to offer their goods online, with Amazon in particular leading this development. The industry has not been destroyed. It has been changed. And, as usual, those badly affected by the change are screaming long and loud. Those who cannot compete on the basis of price and convenience scream long and loud and often ask for government intervention to save their outdated and unwanted businesses. In doing so they often exaggerate and place significant value on aspects of their business which the new market shows many just don't care about. Take for instance the personal experience of dealing with a real knowledgeable human being in a book shop. Firstly, many neither want or value this. When I used to visit and purchase from book shops, I simply wanted to be left alone to browse in peace. When discount department stores started stocking books I would rush to buy from them, often at prices $4 or $5 cheaper than the book store directly opposite. And let's face it, even if you did value the knowledgeable human element, it would more often than not come in the form of a pimply faced kid on minimum wage with little idea of anything beyond a few favourites and the latest best sellers, or sometimes obnoxious literary pretentiousness unbecoming of their years and experience. People now have a wider choice and are voting with their feet. Give me Amazon online any day.

The situation is very simple. If enough people value and patronise independent book stores and other brick and mortar retail stores some will survive.

Oh, as a whole, retail stores are doing fine. Certain stores have been damaged by internet sales, but other stores are still going like gang busters. Some things people like to buy online, other things they don't. A lot of retail stores have web sites that allow you to buy online and get significant business that way, so it's not like Amazon has run them out of business. I buy local honey, coffee and flavored olive oils from local shops via the web.

I would say that stores that focus on good customer service and the more social aspects do better than generic stores. The local Apple store is always busy.

I still maintain that if B&N can focus on the social aspects of books like they did when during the 90's and 2000's, they can do quite well. A lot of people like the social aspects of book clubs and simply getting out of the house, browsing and maybe having a cup of coffee. However, it would require a lot more focus on providing friendly, knowledgable staff.

[shalym]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Actually, he did.
The Henry Ford Trade School ran from 1916-1952.
It taught all sorts of manufacturing and repair skills, along with more conventional schoolwork. There's a few books on it.

https://www.detroitnews.com/picture-...boys/96841824/

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fZoTS_Xetxk

So...kind of like how Amazon offers to pay for their employees to go to college?
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/19/amaz...-4-fields.html

Shari

[Deskisamess]

Retailers fuss about losing walk-in customers, but it's been my experience that those same retailers lack the range of inventory it takes to keep them competitive. Last year I was looking to replace my stainless cook-wear. Not one retailer within 30 miles had any of the brand/style I was interested in, in the store, where I could see and handle it.

The same thing happened when I needed a larger knife block. Sure, Bed Bath & Beyond has a great return policy, but when they don't have in hand what I'm looking for, they don't offer anything different from Amazon. Not to mention the inconvenient location they are in, distance, parking, etc. that comes into play when I need to return something there.

With Amazon, returns can be easily handed to a UPS driver, or dropped at the UPS store that is beside the local grocery. Or sent with hubby, since UPS is where he works every day.

I get the desire to support local retailers. But they need to offer incentives for shoppers to do so.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by shalym

So...kind of like how Amazon offers to pay for their employees to go to college?
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/19/amaz...-4-fields.html

Shari

And dozens if not hundreds of stores who provide their new employees with free tuition for advanced degrees (often mandatory) or simple remedial education.
The best companies don't rely solely on public education to produce the staff they need. Especially these days. In times of transition they just grow their own.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Deskisamess

Retailers fuss about losing walk-in customers, but it's been my experience that those same retailers lack the range of inventory it takes to keep them competitive. Last year I was looking to replace my stainless cook-wear. Not one retailer within 30 miles had any of the brand/style I was interested in, in the store, where I could see and handle it.

The same thing happened when I needed a larger knife block. Sure, Bed Bath & Beyond has a great return policy, but when they don't have in hand what I'm looking for, they don't offer anything different from Amazon. Not to mention the inconvenient location they are in, distance, parking, etc. that comes into play when I need to return something there.

With Amazon, returns can be easily handed to a UPS driver, or dropped at the UPS store that is beside the local grocery. Or sent with hubby, since UPS is where he works every day.

I get the desire to support local retailers. But they need to offer incentives for shoppers to do so.

Sure. Some people like going in and browsing while others prefer the range you can find on line. I've found that kitchen ware tends to be one of those things that I prefer to buy online, simply because I normally know exactly what I want and there aren't really many kitchen ware stores near me.

Of course, I prefer to buy most of my clothes online, while I suspect that most people prefer to shop for clothes in the store so they can feel the fabric and try it on.