Things in books that annoy you

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Thasaidon

I do not need to watch more 70s American Movies on TV there is too much US material on UK TV as it is. In my opinion TV should have a mix of programmes from a much wider selection of countries. I think it would make for more interesting viewing.

Since I live in a country where Dr. Who is taking over nerd culture, I can feel a bit of your pain.

But everyone should watch more '70's American movies and TV. That was a hell of a decade for both. We got everything from The Godfather to Super Fly to Dog Day Afternoon.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Discworld books with Golems are...

Feet of Clay
Making Money
Going Postal

I hope I didn't leave any out.

I think those were the three where golems had a major role. Otherwise, I recall:

The Truth -- Ankh-Morpork now has a fire brigade interested in putting fires out.
Interesting Times though that was more Rincewind realizing the Red Army were a golem variant.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by DNSB

I think those were the three where golems had a major role. Otherwise, I recall:

The Truth -- Ankh-Morpork now has a fire brigade interested in putting fires out.
Interesting Times though that was more Rincewind realizing the Red Army were a golem variant.

Thanks. I'll have a look at all five of those and see if there is any Golem speak and replace the graphics with the font.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Thanks. I'll have a look at all five of those and see if there is any Golem speak and replace the graphics with the font.

I don't recall any Golem speak in The Truth or Interesting Times. Just references to golems.

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by Rumpelteazer

Three of my biggest annoyances in book:

First, when the writer feels the need to end (almost) every chapter on a cliffhanger. It usually happens with those adventure action thriller type books.

I used to belong to an author's Yahoo Group and she mentioned once that she'd been taught never to end a chapter on the end of a scene. The idea was that anytime a reader might close your book - and not be at the end - you risk losing them. I find this rather silly. Like I can't close a book at a scene end, just because it's not a chapter end? I'm not that anal retentive.

One of the authors I read must have been trained by the same person (or read their book/blog/whatever). She ends chapters in places it makes no sense. The middle of a conversation, the middle of an action, it doesn't matter.

"So, Joe, guess who's coming to dinner?"

Chapter 15

"Who?"

To me, these are "forced cliffhangers". I imagine they're supposed to create a tension in me that's not able to "close the book" until I turn the page....and then I might get sucked into "one more chapter".

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

To me, these are "forced cliffhangers". I imagine they're supposed to create a tension in me that's not able to "close the book" until I turn the page....and then I might get sucked into "one more chapter".

To me, it's poor writing.

[Bilbo1967]

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

I used to belong to an author's Yahoo Group and she mentioned once that she'd been taught never to end a chapter on the end of a scene. The idea was that anytime a reader might close your book - and not be at the end - you risk losing them. I find this rather silly. Like I can't close a book at a scene end, just because it's not a chapter end? I'm not that anal retentive.

One of the authors I read must have been trained by the same person (or read their book/blog/whatever). She ends chapters in places it makes no sense. The middle of a conversation, the middle of an action, it doesn't matter.



To me, these are "forced cliffhangers". I imagine they're supposed to create a tension in me that's not able to "close the book" until I turn the page....and then I might get sucked into "one more chapter".

I guess that's why I see so many books with a ridiculous number of chapters. Thrillers seem to often be 300 pages long with 100 chapters or more.

Or is that to do with somehow addressing people's short attention span nowadays?

Either way, it always seems weird to me.

[sjfan]

Originally Posted by Bilbo1967

I guess that's why I see so many books with a ridiculous number of chapters. Thrillers seem to often be 300 pages long with 100 chapters or more.

Or is that to do with somehow addressing people's short attention span nowadays?

I think chapter length has always varied widely. Tolkien's Lord of the Rings may average around 30 pages a chapter, but Agatha Christie was usually under 10 and P.G. Wodehouse often under 5.

And there are modern thrillers—see, for instance, Matthew Reilly's Ice Station—that are 500+ pages consisting of 7 chapters plus a prologue/epilogue.

The Hardy Boys did the same stupid “never end without a cliffhanger thing”, which really amounts to “mislabel your chapters to confuse the reader”. As a youth, I quickly learned to ignore their chapter labels and quit reading when the scene ended (invariably mid-chapter).

[issybird]

This discussion of chapters made me think of a chapter issue that annoys me - the antithesis of the cliffhanger. Especially with some Victorian novelists, the chapter heading is frequently long, detailed and essentially gives away everything that's going to happen in the chapter. I've trained my eye not to read it, but if I'm listening to an audiobook it's impossible to avoid being spoiled.

[sjfan]

Originally Posted by issybird

This discussion of chapters made me think of a chapter issue that annoys me - the antithesis of the cliffhanger. Especially with some Victorian novelists, the chapter heading is frequently long, detailed and essentially gives away everything that's going to happen in the chapter. I've trained my eye not to read it, but if I'm listening to an audiobook it's impossible to avoid being spoiled.

Ahh, yes, the old “Chapter 14: Wherein the Villain is vanquished and the Hero woos the Lady” problem.

[JSWolf]

James Patterson has about 5 pages at most per chapter. It's like a new chapter for every section instead of a section break.

[Pablo]

Speaking about cliffhangers at the end of a chapter, I remember a problem I had when formatting Anna Karenina for the MR library: due to some bug somewhere in BookDesigner or my own program to convert from BD format to regular HTML, the last paragraph of each chapter was lost. That introduced an unintended cliffhanger at the end of each chapter. Of course, you never got to read the missing text. The effect was weird, but somehow it didn't prevent me from understanding the plot... I must have read half the book before I was annoyed enough to go to the original file to check and discovered the problem.

[harriska2]

When women are treated as sex objects or aren’t smart enough to help solve a mystery or religiously puritanical writing (40 year old men can have sex, really).

[harriska2]

Originally Posted by Thasaidon

I had forgotten about "Airplane" a film I really like. Thanks for the reminder.

But NO! I do not need to watch more 70s American Movies on TV there is too much US material on UK TV as it is. In my opinion TV should have a mix of programmes from a much wider selection of countries. I think it would make for more interesting viewing.

Which is why Netflix is so awesome. At one point if we started watching something and it wasn’t subtitled I would groan. 3% from Brazil, Hinterland filmed 2x for each language, and tons of BBC. Dang those are good. Just saw Airplane last week on the big screen. Hilarious.

[Thasaidon]

Originally Posted by harriska2

When women are treated as sex objects or aren’t smart enough to help solve a mystery or religiously puritanical writing (40 year old men can have sex, really).

No. Surely not.