Onyx Announces Three New Readers

[fgdas]

Originally Posted by SnowRipple

Based on this video, when I compare it with how Paperlike Pro displays video (or rather fails to do it), MAX 2 seems much more responsive. And it looks to me that MAX2 is not only faster but provides 16 grayscale quality, whereas Dasung A5 provides worser quality.

I can understand people would like to write, to code, to read or work using HDMI connection but I don't get why would anyone watch video on epaper with 16 shades of gray.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by fgdas

I can understand people would like to write, to code, to read or work using HDMI connection but I don't get why would anyone watch video on epaper with 16 shades of gray.

For the main reason on the foundation of EPD: doing that near sunlit areas.
I did it myself: watched university lessons on the Max Carta, in the open air. And I'm telling you, it was good. The alternative, with traditional technology, is doing that in a room.

[Randy11]

Originally Posted by mdp

Yes and no. It's not a matter of ignorance, it's just that matters are not easy.
When we are mentioning "Linux", are we talking
-- or the kernel?
-- of a specialized environment running over Linux?
-- of Android, as a specialized Operating System running on the Linux kernel?
-- of a Linux Desktop distribution?

A specialized environment running over Linux is not a Linux Desktop distribution.

Native software may (not always) run faster than software built on a framework.
A Linux Desktop will give you full flexibility but not an impression of increased speed.
A RK3188 is not an i7 - the former is 10 times slower, the latter drains your battery 10 times as fast.
As I wrote, the new hardware platform will probably be comparable to a Raspberry Pi 3.
You can run Raspbian on it etc., but if you try it, it will probably not be your choice for a production machine - this out of experience.

I am not really acquainted with what Remarkable did, but I understood they optimized native software.

EDIT: I believe the best of both worlds is to use Android in high portability cases - it was born for that -, and a Linux desktop interfaced to the device, but run by something not irritatingly slow, when a full desktop is required. (Then there's RemixOS...)

It is not necessary to have a full desktop environment under Linux, only the necessary tools.
You can keep something very light and powerful with Linux. You haven't an abstraction layer (like Android) that consumes time, CPU and memory.
For example, with the Raspberry Pi, you can transform it in a Personal Video Recorder (PVR) with a USB tuner and (for example) LibreElec (OSMC) based on Debian with only the useful tools, the performance is present.

[SnowRipple]

Originally Posted by fgdas

I can understand people would like to write, to code, to read or work using HDMI connection but I don't get why would anyone watch video on epaper with 16 shades of gray.

I never said that I want to watch videos on e-ink devices. I just think that it is a good benchmark for screen responsiveness.

E-ink wasn't created for watching but for reading.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by Randy11

It is not necessary to have a full desktop environment under Linux, only the necessary tools.
You can keep something very light and powerful with Linux. You haven't an abstraction layer (like Android) that consumes time, CPU and memory.
For example, with the Raspberry Pi, you can transform it in a Personal Video Recorder (PVR) with a USB tuner and (for example) LibreElec (OSMC) based on Debian with only the useful tools, the performance is present.

Ok, but what would you propose for an OBMC2P reflashed with - say - kernel, GNU tools, and...? What would you use it for?
If you meant "fast reader", I don't know, I am already well served with the minimal chipset of the Max Carta... I want more power first of all to have more responsive text editing, then for other applications not necessarily related to reading. And I would benefit from more responsiveness in general. The increase of speed that we are expecting should cover these needs for me. I will "kind of verify it" within the week: another device using rk3188 entered the market a few weeks ago, and I bought it to experience the wind of speed in my hair.

But - for clarity - if you have ideas, I am intrigued!

[viceant]

Too many people say they would see videos on theese devices but, correct me if I'm wrong, I worry eink is based on a macro particles movemet, not in electron-photon movement, and it won't last much using it in that way. I am glad they have achieved that feat, but cause it means I will be able to browse the web pages with a smooth scrolling.

[nicolasmart]

TBH, Amazon's Lab126 doesn't like the aftermarket add-ins from this forum but their Kindle OS is really solid, intuitive and they update older devices with cool new features.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by nicolasmart

TBH, Amazon's Lab126 doesn't like the aftermarket add-ins from this forum but their Kindle OS is really solid, intuitive and they update older devices with cool new features.

Is it also based on spyware with any other name?
More important (and less political): does it work strictly without any Internet?

EDIT: see, already that «Amazon's Lab126 doesn't like the aftermarket add-ins» is a "Ah, mh, can you please remain on the other side of some water bank, thank you" to me.

[lems1995]

Originally Posted by mdp

Yes and no. It's not a matter of ignorance, it's just that matters are not easy.
When we are mentioning "Linux", are we talking
-- or the kernel?
-- of a specialized environment running over Linux?
-- of Android, as a specialized Operating System running on the Linux kernel?
-- of a Linux Desktop distribution?

A specialized environment running over Linux is not a Linux Desktop distribution.

Native software may (not always) run faster than software built on a framework.
A Linux Desktop will give you full flexibility but not an impression of increased speed.
A RK3188 is not an i7 - the former is 10 times slower, the latter drains your battery 10 times as fast.
As I wrote, the new hardware platform will probably be comparable to a Raspberry Pi 3.
You can run Raspbian on it etc., but if you try it, it will probably not be your choice for a production machine - this out of experience.

I am not really acquainted with what Remarkable did, but I understood they optimized native software.

EDIT: I believe the best of both worlds is to use Android in high portability cases - it was born for that -, and a Linux desktop interfaced to the device, but run by something not irritatingly slow, when a full desktop is required. (Then there's RemixOS...)

Many thanks for lessons gratis!,but why i have to buy an ereader device to load others stuff than books?, and make the reading process comfortable?, why to have Play store to load a lot of app whm i don't care? whilethe reader app built-in is buggy?
isn't better to improve the app built-in than to embed Android-xx?

[mdp]

Originally Posted by viceant

Too many people say they would see videos on theese devices but, correct me if I'm wrong, I worry eink is based on a macro particles movemet, not in electron-photon movement, and it won't last much using it in that way. I am glad they have achieved that feat, but cause it means I will be able to browse the web pages with a smooth scrolling.

Allow me to copy and paste two posts of mine:

Originally Posted by mdp

Yes, but that's something like 10 millions per pixel (I hope I remember correctly)... Three hundred thousand times "War and Peace" and still it would have covered a fraction of the screen.
Do not forget that it is the current state of a growing technology.

EDIT: confirmed, the specs sheet for the "E-Ink Carta Imaging Film" states «10 million switches». (It also says "or five years" [...]).

Originally Posted by mdp

The lifespan is equivalent to "if you used it every day in traditional 8hrs working-days for five years, assuming a pixel is switched on average every 5s (which is probably a lot)":

5 x 360 x 8 x 60 x 12 = around 10M

To check how often a pixel is really switched, that sh/could be tested.

And if you used A2 or similar modes instead of "normal" mode, pixels would be switched less often (2 states, maybe 4, instead of 16).

So, I would call it durable

Oh, by the way: I did soon after write a piece of code that would monitor screen changes during office-oriented work, to provide stats. I always forget to get the results though.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by lems1995

Many thanks for lessons gratis!,but why i have to buy an ereader device to load others stuff than books?, and make the reading process comfortable?, why to have Play store to load a lot of app whm i don't care? whilethe reader app built-in is buggy?
isn't better to improve the app built-in than to embed Android-xx?

It was not meant to be a lesson :-| in fact, I was reasoning, and I _wrote and specified_ it.
(EDIT: very incidentally, if I give a lesson I give it structured, not that messy train of thought)

> why i have to buy an ereader device to load others stuff than books
Because 'ereader' is a convention in your mind, not a fact in nature.

> and make the ... process comfortable?,
Because that's implied in a huge sector of life.

> why to have Play store to load a lot of app
Because freedom is a foremost criterion, even scientifically and technologically

> whm i don't care
Because we are not you

> whilethe reader app built-in is buggy
Because they are not exactly a software company

> isn't better to improve the app built-in than to embed Android-xx?
I am actively improving Librera, with a bit of code (and mostly oriented to the benefit of EPD) provided a few hours ago and already implemented into the forthcoming version - the beta already available to the public, I am about to test it. I would help the "mainstream embedded", but honestly, I do not use it, so...

Look, a couple of points:
-- I really need to use my EPD device as an Office Automation text editor: it is reasonable, right?
-- What do you do _in real practice_ when you need a feature that is not there (I already gave you in the past the example of the "two PDF pages on screen")?

[lems1995]

Originally Posted by mdp

It was not meant to be a lesson :-| in fact, I was reasoning, and I _wrote and specified_ it.
(EDIT: very incidentally, if I give a lesson I give it structured, not that messy train of thought)

> why i have to buy an ereader device to load others stuff than books
Because 'ereader' is a convention in your mind, not a fact in nature.

> and make the ... process comfortable?,
Because that's implied in a huge sector of life.

> why to have Play store to load a lot of app
Because freedom is a foremost criterion, even scientifically and technologically

> whm i don't care
Because we are not you

> whilethe reader app built-in is buggy
Because they are not exactly a software company

> isn't better to improve the app built-in than to embed Android-xx?
I am actively improving Librera, with a bit of code (and mostly oriented to the benefit of EPD) provided a few hours ago and implemented into the forthcoming version - the beta already available to the public, I am about to test it - a few hours later. I would help the "mainstream embedded", but honestly, I do not use it, so...

Look, a couple of points:
-- I really need to use my EPD device as an Office Automation text editor: it is reasonable, right?
-- What do you do _in real practice_ when you need a feature that is not there (I already gave you in the past the example of the "two PDF pages on screen")?

Tablet do all that, because Android-XX is suited to low latency display, e-ink display not!

[mdp]

Originally Posted by lems1995

Tablet do all that, because Android-XX is suited to low latency display, e-ink display not!

Yes, some of us want a tablet with EPD, exactly that. We said that.

About Android: our experience in the matter is mostly on very slow devices. I am waiting for the latest Icarus/Boyue this week, it is probably based on the same chipset and more as the OBMC2P. I will report.

[franzli]

Very much looking forward to hearing about your experience with the boyue!

[viceant]

Originally Posted by mdp

Oh, by the way: I did soon after write a piece of code that would monitor screen changes during office-oriented work, to provide stats. I always forget to get the results though.

That would be interesting, I'm expecting that stats.