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Old 02-19-2009, 02:50 AM   #1441
Darqref
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robertb View Post
Dear ALL:

I am still hearing you and yes, the support for thicker devices on MobileRead Forum was very clear on this issue. But, at CES, everybody that came to our booth (thousands) initially responded to how thin and light it is.

I am not arguing and still thinking. Now the Kindle and Sony have gone after the EZ Reader look... thin and light. If I go thick I would get killed.


Robert B
When I think about the ergonomics of my Rocket ebook, I think it breaks down into three parts.

1. The shape and weight of the device, making it comfortable to hold.

2. The shape, positioning, and function of the buttons, such that it's easy to use, easy to reverse or turn sidewise, and not subject to hitting the wrong button.

3. The possibility of having this thicker shape hold a more long-lasting battery.

So, here's a thought. The buttons and functioning need to be built into the basic device, but that could still be done with a thin device. Then, you (or someone) could make an after-market "holder" that would clamp onto the device to form a handle that would feel like a Rocket. It could have a proper grip, be weighted if it seems appropriate, or even have hollow compartments to hold extra SD cards or a USB cable to charge (if the cable were small enough anyway). As much as I'd like to see it, let the battery function go.

So, as long as the original device had a bezel that could accept the after-market grip, with buttons that were appropriate, it would still be "thin" and you wouldn't lose your market to the competition.
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Old 02-19-2009, 05:33 AM   #1442
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Originally Posted by Robertb View Post
I am listening and do remember all the comments... but doesn't this work fairly good for those who like thickness and for those who prize thin too? I do not know, so I am asking. ... but CES showed THIN is what the buying public wants.
The question is very complicated.

People DO want the thinnest possible device. They want to hold it in the shop and say "WOW (**) ... it's so thin, so light"

People, however, also want a reading device they can take everywhere without worrying about how fragile the thing is. I have seen countless articles and discussions ranting about how you can take the book and read it in the bathtub, or on a beach, how you can just toss the book in your backpack. (Seriously. How many hours in your life you spent reading a [dead tree] book in the bathtub or in sauna?)

What you need to quantify is how many people are impulse buyers and fanboys and how many will carefully evaluate the value of your device before buying. What market do you want to cater to?

What would happen when within 3 days after launch there will be 5 reports on popular review sites (like Mobileread.com) saying how the device got broken when the person handling it sneezed, or a cat spepped lightly on the screen?


I personally would prefer an ultra rugged version. No! I do NOT have an ... aehm ... "Crush Resistant Leather Cover" (TM) in mind. I think about something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ktuitTAFdw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNxjQ12kYXA&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CrpUU3cCPE

I know I am minority.
I also know that no affordable e-ink reader will ever be like one of those:
http://ruffpc.com/products.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_4lS7Yu4Xo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaP8p...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkRQvFvw9TQ
but one can dream ...

(**) Now, that I think about it, I am not sure I would like to make a "WOW! ad campain" for *my* product ;-)

Last edited by kacir; 02-19-2009 at 02:17 PM.
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:30 AM   #1443
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My wishlist is simple

Current EZreader with the new firmware and Epson controller on a 16-grayscale screen. USB mass storage is easy to use (no messing around with network settings or browsing from E-ink) and everything but the screen is secondary to reading the book.
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:40 AM   #1444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darqref View Post

So, here's a thought. The buttons and functioning need to be built into the basic device, but that could still be done with a thin device. Then, you (or someone) could make an after-market "holder" that would clamp onto the device to form a handle that would feel like a Rocket. It could have a proper grip, be weighted if it seems appropriate, or even have hollow compartments to hold extra SD cards or a USB cable to charge (if the cable were small enough anyway). As much as I'd like to see it, let the battery function go.

So, as long as the original device had a bezel that could accept the after-market grip, with buttons that were appropriate, it would still be "thin" and you wouldn't lose your market to the competition.
I've been thinking along those lines too. What I've been picturing (although it may be a bit deep) is a "toilet paper tube" stuck to the side of the reader. The reader could fit in a slot in the tube.

This tube could be done as an aftermarket product and even be used with multiple readers - maybe a flange sticking out of the tube and velcro'ed to the reader.

If the reader was made with this in mind, it could have an electrical connection as well. You could add controls and also an extended battery.
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Old 02-19-2009, 11:23 AM   #1445
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Would you know which knowledge has Astak of size and prospect of the Ebook's market. ? I am a great reader....journalist as well and supporter of those devices....
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Old 02-19-2009, 12:38 PM   #1446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darqref View Post
When I think about the ergonomics of my Rocket ebook, I think it breaks down into three parts.

1. The shape and weight of the device, making it comfortable to hold.

2. The shape, positioning, and function of the buttons, such that it's easy to use, easy to reverse or turn sidewise, and not subject to hitting the wrong button.

3. The possibility of having this thicker shape hold a more long-lasting battery.

So, here's a thought. The buttons and functioning need to be built into the basic device, but that could still be done with a thin device. Then, you (or someone) could make an after-market "holder" that would clamp onto the device to form a handle that would feel like a Rocket. It could have a proper grip, be weighted if it seems appropriate, or even have hollow compartments to hold extra SD cards or a USB cable to charge (if the cable were small enough anyway). As much as I'd like to see it, let the battery function go.

So, as long as the original device had a bezel that could accept the after-market grip, with buttons that were appropriate, it would still be "thin" and you wouldn't lose your market to the competition.
Robertb:
Darqref has hit it on the nose. His #2 is the absolutely crucial part! Get that right, and we can find straight-forward solutions to the rest. Get it wrong, and fixing #1 and #3 won't matter (much).

The thicker, more ergonomic holder as an add-on accessory is a pretty good idea. It wouldn't even have to give up the battery support. It might, for example, contain an extra battery and have a wee little cable that snakes out and plugs into the power socket of the base device! As long as the holder also has a power socket (so I can still plug it in if needed) that'd be just fine. And if your base device's battery life is good enough, let the added batter capability go.

Note: replace "power socket" with "USB socket" if USB-only is the way you've gone. The overall point remains the same.

Xenophon
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Old 02-19-2009, 01:45 PM   #1447
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Add-on or Case

Robert, to reiterate some of the earlier comments, and add my own emphasis.

It may be fine to keep the device thin and get the "handle" through the case. However, I do have a couple of design thoughts that I would add.

1) It is not just about thickness. If the frame is only 1/2 inch you have an awfully small area to grasp and keep you fingers off of the screen. A good handle needs to be thick and wide enough to grasp.

2) Make sure its not floppy. Now, I don't plan on conducting an orchestra with my reader [grin]. However, I want to be able to hold it by the 'handle' and know that I have solid control of the device. I like the idea that someone above mentioned about a toilet paper sized tube that slides on the side; however, I worry that it would put too much mechanical stress on a small bevel/frame.

So, here is my latest thought. Make it a light wedge. Use the handles for batteries for the light wedge. This creates a sleeve so that the handle is not just hanging out there. It takes care of the low lighting problem with eink. Furthermore, if the light wedge uses LED lighting, and batteries on both sides for the handles, then it should have pretty long battery life.

In regard to the buttons. Make sure that they are easily accessible after slipping the case on. In one of my eink devices the nice cover it came with made the buttons recessed enough that pushing them became difficult. This leads to an entire new issue with regard to cramping/holding the book.

Michael
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Old 02-19-2009, 01:49 PM   #1448
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As you are planning the future software ...

One feature I really like about using mobipocket on a palm device is the ability to auto scroll through the text. I like to read while I ride the exercise bike. I set my palm to automatically scroll through the text, and my exercise is done in no time at all.

I haven't asked for this ability before because of the refresh problems with e-ink. However, from your description of the epson controller, I wonder if it will be possible with the new faster controller?

The palm actually scrolls with a line at a time disappearing off the top and a new one being added to the bottom of the text. If the new controller still can not handle this, how about a half of a page at a time?

Just a thought for a wish list.

Michael
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Old 02-19-2009, 03:20 PM   #1449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emellaich View Post
As you are planning the future software ...

One feature I really like about using mobipocket on a palm device is the ability to auto scroll through the text. I like to read while I ride the exercise bike. I set my palm to automatically scroll through the text, and my exercise is done in no time at all.

I haven't asked for this ability before because of the refresh problems with e-ink. However, from your description of the epson controller, I wonder if it will be possible with the new faster controller?

The palm actually scrolls with a line at a time disappearing off the top and a new one being added to the bottom of the text. If the new controller still can not handle this, how about a half of a page at a time?

Just a thought for a wish list.

Michael
I believe the Kindle has an auto-turn feature that automatically goes to the next page after a specified interval. Even this implementation would be a great feature for scenarios such as emellaich has described here.
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Old 02-19-2009, 03:36 PM   #1450
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An old cell phone of mine had an extended life battery option, the stock battery could be slid off the back of the unit and the optional battery slid on in it's place. With the extended battery on the weight went up slightly and the thickness increased. Maybe this is the way to make 'everyone' happy on this subject.
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Old 02-19-2009, 08:43 PM   #1451
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Originally Posted by Robertb View Post
...
The problem is that only Phillips makes an 8 inch screen and PVI (the world's largest panel manufacturer) does not.

This means that pricing on an 8 inch panel is higher than it is for the 10 inch. Everything is economy-of-scale....
Both Jinke and Netronix are far along with the 9.7 inch anyway and PVI will be cranking out 9.7 Flexi at the end of March perhaps. So, with the advent of the 9.7 inch screen anyway...there is even less interest in the 8 inch....
Robert B
Thanks, Robert. I figured it was something like his, but now I know and will abandon hope

I just think 8" is a happy medium.

I guess I'll just have to get used to 9.7, if they are thin and light (never too thin, never too rich and never too healthy, as someone wise once said.) I do like a full page.
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:32 PM   #1452
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9.7 inch.

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Originally Posted by EEguy View Post
Robertb,
When and where can I buy the 9.7 inch reader from you? Will it be able to render with with reasonable speed pdf's and djvu's files which consists of scanned book pages? Thanks.
Dear EEguy:

Both the Mentor and the EZ Reader will come out with a 9.7 inch. Jinke, that makes the EZ Reader actually HAD a V9 model that was a glass screen in 9>7 inch. It cracked too often and they stopped making it. Now they wait for the Flexi screen.

PVI will HOPEFULLY start production on the 9.7 inch Flexi screen at the end of March... but could be delayed if any problems with the yield. BOTH the EZ Reader and Mentor lines will use these screens. BUT, even once they can stock the screens... they will do Alpha and Beta tests.

SO, to answer your question, I am advising they will be ready in late August or early September if all goes according to plan. You will be able to buy them from us first. As we get close I will post info on what website is set up to sell them.

They will have the Epson controller. That is as fast as you can get. They will do .pdf very quickly... but I need to check on djvu's.

Robert B
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:35 PM   #1453
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Everyone happy

Quote:
Originally Posted by giddion View Post
An old cell phone of mine had an extended life battery option, the stock battery could be slid off the back of the unit and the optional battery slid on in it's place. With the extended battery on the weight went up slightly and the thickness increased. Maybe this is the way to make 'everyone' happy on this subject.
Dear Giddion:

It is a good suggestion to add thickness with an extended life battery. I will suggest that for both of our lines.

Your thinking is very clear!!

Thank you,

Robert B
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:44 PM   #1454
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Miss-fires

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenophon View Post
Robertb:
Darqref has hit it on the nose. His #2 is the absolutely crucial part! Get that right, and we can find straight-forward solutions to the rest. Get it wrong, and fixing #1 and #3 won't matter (much).

The thicker, more ergonomic holder as an add-on accessory is a pretty good idea. It wouldn't even have to give up the battery support. It might, for example, contain an extra battery and have a wee little cable that snakes out and plugs into the power socket of the base device! As long as the holder also has a power socket (so I can still plug it in if needed) that'd be just fine. And if your base device's battery life is good enough, let the added batter capability go.

Note: replace "power socket" with "USB socket" if USB-only is the way you've gone. The overall point remains the same.

Xenophon
Dear Xenophon:

As mentioned, using the added thickness with an optional spare extended life battery is a really great suggestion and a winner. I am going to try on this!

One thing we are VERY conscious of is what I call "misfires" where just by holding it you can accidently make a page jump. Harper-Collins first showed me this problem on the old Kindle. The EZ Reader does not have this problem and my new EZ Reader PRO also has avoided this problem. I promise we will not make this mistake if I can help it!

Thank you,

Robert B
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Old 02-19-2009, 09:51 PM   #1455
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Prospect of eBooks market

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Originally Posted by arioste View Post
Hello...New here from Paris (Fr)
Would you know which knowledge has Astak of size and prospect of the Ebook's market. ? I am a great reader....journalist as well and supporter of those devices....

Bonjour, mon ami!!

From what I know, most sources seem to feel that by the end of 2009, 2 Million eBook Readers will sell. I agree with that BUT it could be a lot higher IF all of the manufacturers can get behind a real NON-DRM EPUB format. That is the problem that hampers the eBook. People hate the disparity of three main formats and none of them work together.

In my own opinion, the eBook Industry is it's own worse enemy. If the Amazons of the world would only standardize a format... sales would mushroom for everyone.

Robert B
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