Could this be the future of Amazon ebooks? - Page 3

BooksForABuck · 02-10-2009, 11:13 AM

I suspect Amazon doesn't really have a strategy on DRM. Many publishers supply Kindle books through their relationship with Amazon's Mobipocket subsidiary. Yet Mobipocket has never asked me if I'd allow DRM-free books for Kindle. Just asking would be easy--and cost-free. Right now, Amazon is basking in the success of their Kindle--and more power to them. Consider how many companies have flopped with eReaders and you have to respect Amazon for doing a lot of things right--including being very open to small publishers. But they don't seem to have DRM-free on their Kindle radar--at least not yet.

Rob Preece
Publisher, www.BooksForABuck.com

lilac_jive · 02-10-2009, 11:16 AM

I think it is important to keep in mind it took years for Apple to get to nonDRM. I don't know if they were working on it the whole time, but now they have such a market share in digital music they are able to do this. I don't know if Amazon has that power yet.

daffy4u · 02-10-2009, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lilac_jive

I think it is important to keep in mind it took years for Apple to get to nonDRM. I don't know if they were working on it the whole time, but now they have such a market share in digital music they are able to do this. I don't know if Amazon has that power yet.

Ditto. I don't think Amazon has reached it's "tipping point" yet (which is why the word "future" is in the thread title). Amazon is, however, a lot closer to the goal than anyone.

lilac_jive · 02-10-2009, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daffy4u

Ditto. I don't think Amazon has reached it's "tipping point" yet (which is why the word "future" is in the thread title). Amazon is, however, a lot closer to the goal than anyone.

I'll agree with that.

daffy4u · 02-10-2009, 11:28 AM

Remember when iTunes was first introduced, it was a Mac only application. It wasn't until Apple opened up to Windows machines that they blew up. Once they got so many people locked into their software and hardware (iPods), they were able to use that power to go DRM-free, which opens the door for other media players.

The same could happen with Amazon.

Daithi · 02-10-2009, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotbob

That's kind of contradictory isn't it? You bought a device from the company that you feel isn't focused on devices and used that as your justification?

Oh well, to each his own.

BOb

No, I bought a device from the manufacture that specializes in providing the content. Sony and Amazon both offer a combination of 'Readers and Content' which must be purchased as a package. The Sony device doesn't work with Amazon's content and visa-versa. I was simply pointing out that it was content (i.e. books) that was the main factor in my decision. Sorry if that wasn't clear in my prior post.

Alisa · 02-10-2009, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotbob

You do realize that Sony ticks all those boxes too. They just dropped the ball.

BOb

I think Sony may have been able to claim that some years ago but they've dropped the ball or been actively abusive of their customers too many times in the last few years and that's why they're in trouble now. Most folks I know don't trust them any more whether it was from having issues with their computer support, camera support, the rootkit fiasco or playing in one of their games. I know very few people who would buy a Sony product now and they are especially distrusted when it comes to content. Their name used to be synonymous with quality but not any more.

Alisa · 02-10-2009, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Just go to best buy and listen to people looking at the Sony's. Most people want them... but not all get them because they are a bit pricer comparatively in some lines.

A bit OT but did you know those high-priced Sony TVs are made by Samsung. Sony just rebrands them and jacks the price.

JSWolf · 02-10-2009, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gideon

No... Sony isn't a trusted company. Sony isn't one of those companies you hear people say "Oh, I just love Sony..." I've a LOT of Sony products, and in general like them, but don't trust them at all.
Sony is also a big company... but it doesn't have any particular clout with publishers. A look at their meager offerings and prices makes that pretty clear. Which leads directly into point three - their selection blows. It would seem you a need a critical mass of content to be available to make an eBook viable. Sony never managed.

I'm not saying Amazon is better... just that they had what it takes to do it. Also important - piles of cash lying around.

Personally, whoever gives me the books I want at a decent rate will be whom I go to. I have no brand loyalty at all.

Amazon is one of those companies where we get to say eBooks? Yeah, I remember when Amazon screwed over LOTS of people with eBooks. And now you want us to trust Amazon again?

Amazon is only doing what's good for Amazon. They are not doing what's best for eBooks overall. If it's good for Amazon they'll do it even if it's bad for eBooks. Amazon won't sell to anyone who does not fork over almost $400. Amazon makes exclusive deals that are bad for the rest of the eBook industry. Amazon does not care about the rest of the world outside of the USA. What good is Amazon really doing for others? Nothing. What Amazon is doing Amazon is doing for the good of Amazon. If you don't have a Kindle, then Amazon doesn't want to know you.

pilotbob · 02-10-2009, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alisa

A bit OT but did you know those high-priced Sony TVs are made by Samsung. Sony just rebrands them and jacks the price.

Many brands do this.

BUt, you people are taking "trust" of a company way to far. I am not saying "trust" like I will leave my new born in their care. I am saying "trust" in that Sony is a large will know multi-national company. Compared to the unknown iRex or Bookeen... Average man on the street will "Trust" the Sony brand over small unknowns.

BOb

bwaldron · 02-10-2009, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotbob

BUt, you people are taking "trust" of a company way to far.

I don't take it any farther than how it impacts my own purchase decisions. Sony -- for me -- is a company I will avoid if I have other reasonable options.

Quote:

Compared to the unknown iRex or Bookeen... Average man on the street will "Trust" the Sony brand over small unknowns.

Oh, undoubtedly they have great name recognition, and that will equal trust for many people. But not for everyone.

Microsoft is large and well known, but that doesn't seem to equate to "trust" for many people (validly or not); quite the opposite.

But we've probably beaten this topic close to death.

Alisa · 02-10-2009, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Many brands do this.

BUt, you people are taking "trust" of a company way to far. I am not saying "trust" like I will leave my new born in their care. I am saying "trust" in that Sony is a large will know multi-national company. Compared to the unknown iRex or Bookeen... Average man on the street will "Trust" the Sony brand over small unknowns.

BOb

That I will agree with. Most people will not buy Bookeen, iRex, HanLin, etc. However I think the average US consumer trusts Amazon over Sony and the content combined with the ease of use increases the preference. They're the two main players here. They both have name recognition over the little guys so that's a wash.

Still I've never heard an of my friends be so pissed with Amazon that they've vowed never to shop there again and I probably know at least a dozen people who have vowed that about Sony just from customer service fiascos and crippled or buggy products, not counting the rootkit thing. They're not looking to hire them as babysitters. They just want the products to work and to be able to get a reasonable amount of help when they don't.

I know people got burned on the previous Amazon ebook venture. As I recall, didn't they contact customers and give them a year to back up their content? Not ideal but hardly the same as burying in microscopic print that you can't load the OS you want on your computer or that they're going to install malware if you play a CD.

Alisa · 02-10-2009, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Amazon does not care about the rest of the world outside of the USA. What good is Amazon really doing for others?

How long did it take for Sony to officially release their reader overseas?

rhadin · 02-10-2009, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daffy4u

Do you have a copy of the contract you can post?

Yes, I have a copy of the contract; no, I cannot post it or discuss it in detail.

However, take a look at a Teleread summary of Cory Doctorow's remarks at today's O'Reilly Conference.

Amazon is not the knight in shining armor Bezos tries to portray it as.

JSWolf · 02-10-2009, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhadin

Yes, I have a copy of the contract; no, I cannot post it or discuss it in detail.

However, take a look at a Teleread summary of Cory Doctorow's remarks at today's O'Reilly Conference.

Amazon is not the knight in shining armor Bezos tries to portray it as.

Given what I just read at Teleread, Amazon is looking more and more like the Soup Nazi (from Seinfeld).

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02-10-2009, 11:13 AM	#31
BooksForABuck Zealot Posts: 123 Karma: 150001 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Long Beach, CA Device: Color Nook, Kindle 2, Palm III, eBookWise, HP Jornada	I suspect Amazon doesn't really have a strategy on DRM. Many publishers supply Kindle books through their relationship with Amazon's Mobipocket subsidiary. Yet Mobipocket has never asked me if I'd allow DRM-free books for Kindle. Just asking would be easy--and cost-free. Right now, Amazon is basking in the success of their Kindle--and more power to them. Consider how many companies have flopped with eReaders and you have to respect Amazon for doing a lot of things right--including being very open to small publishers. But they don't seem to have DRM-free on their Kindle radar--at least not yet. Rob Preece Publisher, www.BooksForABuck.com

02-10-2009, 11:16 AM	#32
lilac_jive Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,870 Karma: 27376 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Device: PRS-505	I think it is important to keep in mind it took years for Apple to get to nonDRM. I don't know if they were working on it the whole time, but now they have such a market share in digital music they are able to do this. I don't know if Amazon has that power yet.

02-10-2009, 11:28 AM	#35
daffy4u I'm Super Kindle-icious Posts: 6,734 Karma: 2434103 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Long Drive, Calinadia Candafornia Device: KDXG, KT, Oasis	Remember when iTunes was first introduced, it was a Mac only application. It wasn't until Apple opened up to Windows machines that they blew up. Once they got so many people locked into their software and hardware (iPods), they were able to use that power to go DRM-free, which opens the door for other media players. The same could happen with Amazon.