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Old 02-09-2017, 04:42 PM   #16
DiapDealer
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One thing's for certain: if you call customer service about an issue with one of these older devices, don't let them talk you into de-registering (or factory resetting) them. Not if it's working for the most part, anyway.
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Old 02-09-2017, 07:02 PM   #17
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So after Customer Service informed me that I should probably consider upgrading my hardware (as if I haven't, multiple times over), I sent the following message of disappointment to the bogus Bezos email address to express my disappointment in how this phase-out (because it's clear to me now that this is exactly what it is) is being handled:

Quote:
Hello,

If you're officially dropping support for being able to register/deregister 1st and 2nd generation Kindle devices over Whispernet, please consider making an official statement that makes that fact abundantly clear.

As it is now, having Amazon customer service representatives hint that my fully updated (including the TLS service cert update) device "may be too old to connect to our network" is quite frustrating. Especially considering that the unregistered device has no difficulty whatsoever with browsing the Amazon store. Having CS reps try to convince me that I _may_ need to upgrade (when they know full well I'll have to) to a newer device is shameful.

In short: please fix the issue that prevents fully updated 1st and 2nd generation Kindles from being able to re-register after a performing a factory reset, or make the announcement that these devices have been officially abandoned.

Thanks,
Doug
To which I just received the following reply:
Quote:
Hello Douglas,

I'm Caesar M. of Amazon's Tech Support Executive Customer Relations. Jeff Bezos received your email and I'm responding on his behalf. I've reviewed your account and understand you're concerned about your device support. While I know you're disappointed with our stance on this matter, I want to assure you the information you received from our customer service is correct.

As mentioned, hardware updates exist for a very genuine reason. When a new device is developed, it goes through rigorous tests and quality checks. The final version of the device is released to public only when the vendor is fully satisfied with the product’s functionality and stability. When the devices are used by customers in a real-time environment, they may come across several areas of improvement and same gets reported back to the developers. Sometimes latest versions of applications will need new processes and tools to work properly, which the developers constantly include with the new software updates. However, in the occasion that the software is not enough , the needs of the apps are going to overdrive the capacity of the product, causing the malfunction of the it. To address those issues, the developers try to support those devices as much as possible until the customer needs are major than the device capabilities, then a new device with better qualities will be lunch so that users can have a convenient and well supported interface with the product.

Douglas, I’m sorry for any disappointment caused and appreciate your understanding. While we won’t be able to comment further on this matter, we’re always happy to help if you have any other questions - you can click a button to contact us by e-mail or phone from any Help page on our website.

Regards,

Caesar M.
Tech Support Executive Customer Relations
Amazon.com
http://www.amazon.com
So there you have it, folks. Who knows which devices are officially on the chopping block, but the fact that there IS a chopping block has been confirmed to my satisfaction.

A rather disappointing way to handle it if you ask me, though.

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Old 02-10-2017, 12:25 AM   #18
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That is very disappointing. I don't see what hardware updates have to do with maintaining ability to register hardware, however old. These are just web services.
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Old 02-10-2017, 02:58 AM   #19
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As many of you know I am a big Amazon fan in most things. But they are certainly far from perfect. What we have in this instance are devices which are still perfectly functional which are being rendered virtually worthless to most people. Yes, they do not even support kf8 let alone kfx. There may well be a good business case for Amazon to end support for these devices. AFter all, there must be some cost involved in delivering the azw (mobi) format, and there are probably relatively few of these devices still being used.

The problem is the outright sneaky way in which this has been done. Common sense alone dictates a public announcement. What of someone who has bought one of these devices, no doubt very cheaply, and now can't register? A situation which could have been avoided with an announcement. What of those wanting to sell these otherwise still perfectly functional devices?

Jeff Bezos. You can and should do better than this.
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Old 02-10-2017, 04:25 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
I have no problem with that personally, but I'm not going to tell people they have to say goodbye their old standbys.

If they do, Amazon needs to be upfront (and loud) about dropping support for these devices.
There's another option Amazon could do instead of just fully dropping all the old devices. All eBooks to be uploaded such that they have an option to have no Mobi version. So you get the message that the eBook is not compatible. I've no problem with that at all. This would be a way to get people to upgrade without having to say, no more. It would be a gradual phasing out.
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Old 02-10-2017, 04:27 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darryl View Post
As many of you know I am a big Amazon fan in most things. But they are certainly far from perfect. What we have in this instance are devices which are still perfectly functional which are being rendered virtually worthless to most people. Yes, they do not even support kf8 let alone kfx. There may well be a good business case for Amazon to end support for these devices. AFter all, there must be some cost involved in delivering the azw (mobi) format, and there are probably relatively few of these devices still being used.

The problem is the outright sneaky way in which this has been done. Common sense alone dictates a public announcement. What of someone who has bought one of these devices, no doubt very cheaply, and now can't register? A situation which could have been avoided with an announcement. What of those wanting to sell these otherwise still perfectly functional devices?

Jeff Bezos. You can and should do better than this.
I've seen things like this done. I've seen perfectly good computer hardware turned into scrap just because the company didn't want to write a new driver for a new version OS where the old driver was not compatible with the new OS.

Last edited by JSWolf; 02-10-2017 at 04:47 AM.
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Old 02-10-2017, 06:31 AM   #22
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I think Amazon should drop support for any device that does not support KF8. That means then you can make eBooks using features of KF8 and not have to ever worry about Mobi again.
Doesn't the K3 support KF8?
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Old 02-10-2017, 06:31 AM   #23
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I think Amazon should drop support for any device that does not support KF8. That means then you can make eBooks using features of KF8 and not have to ever worry about Mobi again.
Unfortunately this does not apply for those of us making periodicals since the periodical reader is *still* mobi-only.
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Old 02-10-2017, 07:40 AM   #24
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Doesn't the K3 support KF8?
Yes. The K3 (or Kindle Keyboard) was updated to support KF8.

I've seen one report of an unregistered K3 that was still able to register through the normal channels. Some anecdotal evidence, at least, that it's not among the devices being abandoned.
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Old 02-10-2017, 07:51 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darryl View Post
The problem is the outright sneaky way in which this has been done. Common sense alone dictates a public announcement. What of someone who has bought one of these devices, no doubt very cheaply, and now can't register? A situation which could have been avoided with an announcement. What of those wanting to sell these otherwise still perfectly functional devices?
I agree. I take no issue with them phasing out older devices. Only with the underhanded way it's being done. They're negating the good will they generated by supporting these older devices for as long as they have in the first place.

Why push out the warning emails and the firmware updates (and CERT update) last March for these devices to remain compatible with their network if there was no plan to continue support for them anyway? Did they even push out a "fix", or did they push out a change that made it easier to disable those devices' ability to re-register? Before calling me paranoid, remember that users were being encouraged to de-register devices they were no longer using in those same emails.

Never mind the fact that the devices themselves seem to work perfectly with Amazon's network if they're already registered (and fully updated). It 's only when these devices need to be re-registered that issues arise.

They certainly don't owe me anything, but they should have handled this better than they have. Way better.

Last edited by DiapDealer; 02-10-2017 at 08:00 AM.
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Old 02-10-2017, 01:19 PM   #26
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That explains why my DXG will no longer connects to sites other than Amazon! Too bad, as I replaced the motherboard to get 3G last year (it was a wifi only model). My Kindle Keyboards still connect (I check my gmail when I'm out of town). Frankly, I don't understand the phase-out. I buy newspapers and books from Amazon on my K3s, so I figure it must be financially worthwhile to keep the 3G active, but I can't imagine that there is much cost in allowing a few side-trips to news sites, etc.
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Old 02-10-2017, 02:14 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
I agree. I take no issue with them phasing out older devices. Only with the underhanded way it's being done. They're negating the good will they generated by supporting these older devices for as long as they have in the first place.

Why push out the warning emails and the firmware updates (and CERT update) last March for these devices to remain compatible with their network if there was no plan to continue support for them anyway? Did they even push out a "fix", or did they push out a change that made it easier to disable those devices' ability to re-register? Before calling me paranoid, remember that users were being encouraged to de-register devices they were no longer using in those same emails.

Never mind the fact that the devices themselves seem to work perfectly with Amazon's network if they're already registered (and fully updated). It 's only when these devices need to be re-registered that issues arise.

They certainly don't owe me anything, but they should have handled this better than they have. Way better.
Both of my older devices would not connect until updated. After updating, they still would not connect. Both times, Amazon told me to reset to factory settings and then re-register. Both times, after that, I could not register. Amazon KNEW that resetting would cause inability to register. That constitutes intentional fraud and intentional failure of their products. How about a class-action lawsuit?--Melanie
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Old 02-10-2017, 03:22 PM   #28
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How about a class-action lawsuit?--Melanie
Nah. That would only help put lawyers' kids through college. If enough affected device owners cry foul using the not-really-jeff-bezos email address, though, we might be able to finagle a bit of store credit out of it. But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that either.

Repeatedly voicing my displeasure to one of Jeff's surrogates is about as much indignation/outrage I can muster over this.
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Old 02-10-2017, 03:52 PM   #29
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Both of my older devices would not connect until updated. After updating, they still would not connect. Both times, Amazon told me to reset to factory settings and then re-register. Both times, after that, I could not register. Amazon KNEW that resetting would cause inability to register. That constitutes intentional fraud and intentional failure of their products. How about a class-action lawsuit?--Melanie
I think there is some merit to that. The original promise was 'free wireless for life of the device' and it seems it is only these older 3G devices, without any wifi support, that are getting cut off. The devices still live, yet can no longer work if you need to factory reset for some reason (e.g. You are giving or selling it to someone else) and have to re-register it.

I think if enough people complain they would reverse this, without even the threat of class-action suit, which probably nobody would find worth putting forward.

Last edited by tomsem; 02-10-2017 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 02-10-2017, 08:57 PM   #30
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I think if enough people complain they would reverse this, without even the threat of class-action suit, which probably nobody would find worth putting forward.
I can imagine 2 possible scenarios

1. Amazon took this step towards non-support quietly, no formal announcement, just so they could see how many would complain and how loudly. Enough complaining and negative publicity and they could just bring the registration servers back on line without ever admitting to this being anything but a temporary glitch. Or if few complain, they carry on with eventually dropping mobi format support.

2. This wasn't actually planned. The registration servers just broke and Amazon decided not to invest any resources in fixing them. Or maybe no one left on staff even knows how to fix it.
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