How much is Amazon missing by not having a waterproof Kindle? - Page 6

DiapDealer · 11-30-2016, 12:11 PM

Keep in mind that the original question was, "How much is Amazon missing by not having a waterproof Kindle?" and not, "How many consumers are missing Amazon not having a waterproof Kindle?"

I still believe the answer to the former is "almost nothing." And that's probably the answer precisely because there's not enough of the latter to sway them.

issybird · 11-30-2016, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

The Nook Glowlight sold for $120, the Glowlight Plus started at $130, only $10 more than the Paperwhite. And I'd bet B&N don't have the economy of scale that Amazon has.

And if you don't want ads, the Paperwhite costs $10 more than the ad-free, waterproof Glowlight Plus.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barty

I think the number of people who truly want a waterproof kindle -- as opposed to the people who think sure, why not, or the people who want any excuse to upgrade (you know who you are

-- is very small. Even smaller than the number of people who want bigger than 6" screen.

It seems that those who want waterproofing really want it, so they've probably gone with another option now already - and generally speaking, people here are not averse to a wardrobe of readers, so to speak, so it could well be in addition to their Kindle(s).

I've got a waterproof device, but that's worth nothing to me. On the other hand, bigger than 6" is one of my top two criteria.

Sweetpea · 12-02-2016, 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barty

I think the number of people who truly want a waterproof kindle -- as opposed to the people who think sure, why not, or the people who want any excuse to upgrade (you know who you are

-- is very small. Even smaller than the number of people who want bigger than 6" screen.

I agree that the number of people who truly want a waterproof kindle is small. Waterproofing will be the cherry on the cake for most people, but it could be a tipping point.

The number of people that want a larger than 6" screen is propbably larger than you think..

Cinisajoy · 12-02-2016, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

I agree that the number of people who truly want a waterproof kindle is small. Waterproofing will be the cherry on the cake for most people, but it could be a tipping point.

The number of people that want a larger than 6" screen is propbably larger than you think..

Proof of that one is the new bigger Kobo sold out in hours.

JSWolf · 12-02-2016, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

I agree that the number of people who truly want a waterproof kindle is small. Waterproofing will be the cherry on the cake for most people, but it could be a tipping point.

The number of people that want a larger than 6" screen is propbably larger than you think..

I think Amazon is losing out. Waterproof is a feature not everyone would use, but they'd like to have it as a just in case.

barryem · 12-02-2016, 07:41 PM

There's one clue about waterproof Kindles. Amazon sells the Waterfi waterproof Paperwhite for about $80 more than the non-waterproof version. I don't know a lot about them but they get good reviews and there's no need to plug the ports or anything. They've been selling these since the early days of the original Paperwhite and they have more than 10,000 verified purchase reviews.

That's compared with the current Paperwhite with over 26,000 verified purchase reviews reviews.

I'm not sure just how much all this means but that means the plain vanilla model has been reviewed 2.5 times as many times by real purchasers. I think it's reasonable to assume that people who buy a more expensive and somewhat special model are going to be a bit more eager to post reviews. But still, that's a lot of purchases.

I went looking at these numbers expecting to find a few hundred reviews on the Waterfi.

On the other hand, the Paperwhite reviews are only for the Paperwhite 3 and I'm not sure that's true of the Waterfi reviews. They've updated the version they sell but did the count start over on their reviews? I don't know.

Even so, that's a lot of sales of waterproof Kindles. It makes me wonder if Amazon's reason for not selling them isn't about potential sales.

Barry

Phogg · 12-02-2016, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Pretty safe bet. There'd already BE a waterproof Kindle if they thought there was more in the former group.

Do not attempt to force rationality upon corporate decision making.

Apple refused to make smartphones with decent sized screens for years...because Steve Jobs proclaimed there was no market for such devices.

Sometimes the reason is somebody's ego plus nothing else whatsoever.

DiapDealer · 12-02-2016, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phogg

Do not attempt to force rationality upon corporate decision making.

I'm not. I'm merely going with the safe assumption that a handful of people at Mobileread do not, in fact, have as good a handle on what Amazon might be "missing out on" as Amazon's own market research teams do.

kacir · 12-03-2016, 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I'm not. I'm merely going with the safe assumption that a handful of people at Mobileread do not, in fact, have as good a handle on what Amazon might be "missing out on" as Amazon's own market research teams do.

The very same "market research teams" that told Amazon management that users do not want to be able to configure and tweak the text rendering the way Kobos allow?
On the first Keyboard Kindles users could configure margins, justification, sideload fonts. No rooting required, just set up a parameter in a text config file.

Really smart guys in the "market research teams", I tell ya ... ;-)

DiapDealer · 12-03-2016, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kacir

The very same "market research teams" that told Amazon management that users do not want to be able to configure and tweak the text rendering the way Kobos allow?
On the first Keyboard Kindles users could configure margins, justification, sideload fonts. No rooting required, just set up a parameter in a text config file.

Really smart guys in the "market research teams", I tell ya ... ;-)

You're confusing giving consumers everything they want, with giving consumers enough to keep them from switching to company B.

And yeah, if their track record is anything to go by: really, "really smart guys in the 'market research teams.'"

ZodWallop · 12-04-2016, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I'm merely going with the safe assumption that a handful of people at Mobileread do not, in fact, have as good a handle on what Amazon might be "missing out on" as Amazon's own market research teams do.

I'm not making that assumption either. What prompted me to start this thread were the reviews of the Oasis. Here are snippets of the top reviews of the Oasis (based on my search results in Bing):

c|net: The Bad/ It's pricey, isn't any zippier than the Voyage or Paperwhite, and isn't waterproof.

PCMag: Cons: Expensive. Not waterproof.

The Guardian: Cons: expensive, front cover doesn’t protect back, not waterproof

Wired: Tired: It's expensive, and there are cheaper versions that do all the same things. Dear Amazon, MAKE THE KINDLE WATERPROOF. Love, everyone.

The Verge: Another ding: the Oasis isn’t waterproof, a feature that beach bums and bathtub lovers have been asking for — especially if they drop $300 on this thing.

DiapDealer · 12-04-2016, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I'm not making that assumption either. What prompted me to start this thread were the reviews of the Oasis. Here are snippets of the top reviews of the Oasis (based on my search results in Bing..

The first three Oasis reviews that Google returns when I search for "kindle oasis review" (ignoring the Amazon link in the top ad slot) don't mention waterproofing at all. Two mainly positive reviews and one fairly negative, for the record.

Kindle Oasis review: Amazon's newest e-reader is nearly perfect | Macworld

Kindle Oasis review: The perfect e-reader for the 1 percent - Engadget

Amazon's $290 e-reader misfire: A hands-on review of the new Kindle Oasis - LA Times - Los Angeles Times

So it's clearly not a pervasive sentiment, right?

EDIT: I actually made it all the way to the fifth returned review before I saw the words "isn’t waterproof."

issybird · 12-04-2016, 09:46 AM

Our histories influence our search results, so I infer that waterproofing is more important to Zod than Diap.

DiapDealer · 12-04-2016, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by issybird

Our histories influence our search results, so I infer that waterproofing is more important to Zod than Diap.

You don't say?

We'll need someone to search from a public internet kiosk, then. Who's up for a roadtrip?

barryem · 12-04-2016, 11:42 AM

I don't think surveying reviews is going to tell you much. Tech reviewers on the web tend to be very faddish and judge things more based on fashion than utility. It's more about how cool the device is than how well it works.

The better reviewers also include a lot of information about usage but even the best of them talk as much about style as substance.

Barry

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11-30-2016, 12:11 PM	#76
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,891 Karma: 207182180 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	Keep in mind that the original question was, "How much is Amazon missing by not having a waterproof Kindle?" and not, "How many consumers are missing Amazon not having a waterproof Kindle?" I still believe the answer to the former is "almost nothing." And that's probably the answer precisely because there's not enough of the latter to sway them.

12-02-2016, 07:41 PM	#81
barryem Wizard Posts: 2,459 Karma: 68781975 Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Arkansas Device: Paperwhite 4	There's one clue about waterproof Kindles. Amazon sells the Waterfi waterproof Paperwhite for about $80 more than the non-waterproof version. I don't know a lot about them but they get good reviews and there's no need to plug the ports or anything. They've been selling these since the early days of the original Paperwhite and they have more than 10,000 verified purchase reviews. That's compared with the current Paperwhite with over 26,000 verified purchase reviews reviews. I'm not sure just how much all this means but that means the plain vanilla model has been reviewed 2.5 times as many times by real purchasers. I think it's reasonable to assume that people who buy a more expensive and somewhat special model are going to be a bit more eager to post reviews. But still, that's a lot of purchases. I went looking at these numbers expecting to find a few hundred reviews on the Waterfi. On the other hand, the Paperwhite reviews are only for the Paperwhite 3 and I'm not sure that's true of the Waterfi reviews. They've updated the version they sell but did the count start over on their reviews? I don't know. Even so, that's a lot of sales of waterproof Kindles. It makes me wonder if Amazon's reason for not selling them isn't about potential sales. Barry

12-04-2016, 09:46 AM	#88
issybird o saeclum infacetum Posts: 21,517 Karma: 236076651 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: New England Device: Mini, H2O, Glo HD, Aura One, PW4, PW5	Our histories influence our search results, so I infer that waterproofing is more important to Zod than Diap.

12-04-2016, 11:42 AM	#90
barryem Wizard Posts: 2,459 Karma: 68781975 Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Arkansas Device: Paperwhite 4	I don't think surveying reviews is going to tell you much. Tech reviewers on the web tend to be very faddish and judge things more based on fashion than utility. It's more about how cool the device is than how well it works. The better reviewers also include a lot of information about usage but even the best of them talk as much about style as substance. Barry