Windows 10 - free upgrade to those with PC using Windows 7 or 8

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Might I suggest trying a virtual machine or a Windows OS?

I run Windows 10 as a main OS now (hammered shut as much as possible), but I would love to run Linux or FreeBSD. I've always been a great fan of Unix-type OS-es. Ken Thompson, Dennis Ritchie and Brian Kerningham are something like personal hero's to me for creating Unix, C, and (in case of Thompson) doing a lot of work regarding chess engines.

The endless, endless jacking around on the desktop drives me up the wall though. As soon as I need to run a server, I turn to Debian Stable or Testing; if I need something embedded I use Debian or even Arch if it has to be really small (Arch has less dependencies than Debian, even when running Debian with no-installl-recommends).

If I need a desktop, Linux just doesn't work for me, and on a laptop, even more so. There is just too much stuff that costs too much effort to get going and keep going; effort for which I don't have the time to spend ATM.

[kennyc]

.....and my machines decided to update themselves to the "new" release - 1511 (that came out in Nov/Dec why six months later I have no idea) yesterday....took forever to install and my laptop now has a generic "error box" that pops up when it boots up......if I just close it everything seems to work fine, but it's a PITA!
Will chase it later.....grrrr....

Desktop would not display the windows button/tiles info nor the notifications when it finished. Fortunately after a shutdown/reboot it appears to be working properly.

.....to be continued....I guess.... arrrrrggggghhh!

[Freeshadow]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

There is just too much stuff that costs too much effort to get going and keep going

That's why these tuxedocomputers guys kept stick to my memory. Were I in the situation of getting a new laptop I'd have given them a try. I'm also too tired with tinkering to get things work which should do from the beginning on. (like a laptops sensors, special keys, info LEDs etc)

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

That's why these tuxedocomputers guys kept stick to my memory. Were I in the situation of getting a new laptop I'd have given them a try. I'm also too tired with tinkering to get things work which should do from the beginning on. (like a laptops sensors, special keys, info LEDs etc)

This comment is not specifically aimed at you, but please note that with "tinkering", I don't mean "putting settings right"

I don't mind settings. On a new computer, I mostly install the bare minimum, and then install applications and change settings as I go. After some time, the computer gets set up as I want it just through normal usage.

What I do mind is installing the operating system, and then having to read a 12 page how-to to get the laptop's hotkeys working, then another 10 pages on how Bumblebee/Primus should be installed (Bumblebee or Primus? Optirun or Primusrun?) Then, installing CUPS and my three printers (even though they have Linux drivers, it's still a pain in the butt... especially the labelprinter, because it would need Wine to run the dedicated software).

For 15 years (since I've started to use Linux for some things), many things that require only a download and doubleclick in Windows, require pages long howto's in Linux. On the other hand, I wish Windows would have a repository-like system, or at least the option to install and/or remove software all at once. I know about Chocolatey.org, but I mean, built into the OS; and the Windows Store isn't it.

[Freeshadow]

Just that. I think we mean the same. Put work into personal adjustments, we both agree, happens during usage as time goes by. But working ones ass off to get things running which just should. With every machine differently (if possible at all) finally ending up with at least one function which you can't get working (because on your batch there is somewhere ONE different chip not covered by the how-to solution. Been there, done that.
Great for learning. But only so often. I too just want to install and have things which should work working then.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

Just that. I think we mean the same. Put work into personal adjustments, we both agree, happens during usage as time goes by. But working ones ass off to get things running which just should.

You know what the paradox is? I *LIKE* jacking around and tinkering with computers, but I *HATE* actually doing it.

The reason is that I like doing it if I sit down specifically to jack around with stuff; to get something running that wouldn't normally run, to make something that doesn't yet exist, and so on. I dislike it when I sit down to do something else, such as downloading ebooks, or playing a game, for example, and *then* I have to mess around with it before actually starting the thing I wanted to do.

[Glorfindel]

Ditto times 5 lol

[Freeshadow]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

You know what the paradox is? I *LIKE* jacking around and tinkering with computers, but I *HATE* actually doing it.

The reason is that I like doing it if I
1.) sit down specifically to jack around with stuff; to get something running that wouldn't normally run, to make something that doesn't yet exist, and so on.

I dislike it when I sit down to do something else, such as downloading ebooks, or playing a game, for example, and *then* I have to mess around with it 2.) before actually starting the thing I wanted to do.

Not paradox at all: the first is creative process and thus by its nature rewarding in itself; the 2nd is most often NOT (especially with our experience levels {yes I know your is higher than mine} when there is no longer reward by learning from it) It's plainly frustrating "get things work, so I can do my stuff"

[Rbneader]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

You know what the paradox is? I *LIKE* jacking around and tinkering with computers, but I *HATE* actually doing it.

The reason is that I like doing it if I sit down specifically to jack around with stuff; to get something running that wouldn't normally run, to make something that doesn't yet exist, and so on. I dislike it when I sit down to do something else, such as downloading ebooks, or playing a game, for example, and *then* I have to mess around with it before actually starting the thing I wanted to do.

I'm with you.

It can be fun when there's no pressure. But when I just need to check email, pay bills or otherwise get things done it's simply aggravating.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

Not paradox at all: the first is creative process and thus by its nature rewarding in itself; the 2nd is most often NOT (especially with our experience levels {yes I know your is higher than mine} when there is no longer reward by learning from it) It's plainly frustrating "get things work, so I can do my stuff"

It IS a paradox, you just happen to see the solution to the paradox.
Believe me, my wife cannot understand how I can spend an entire Saturday hacking something, but I'll get frustrated when I have to spend 2 hours fighting some bizarre problem just trying to copy a file across my network. She'll say "Aww, come on you love doing this stuff." And then I start screaming and throwing things.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

(especially with our experience levels {yes I know your is higher than mine}

Oh, I don't know about that, as I don't know anything about your experience level

My experience with Linux is mostly centered around Debian (Testing) and Arch, and when using the InitV startup system. If you put me behind a Red Hat box that runs systemd, my reaction will probably be: "So... like... now what?" I haven't used (Debian) Linux since systemd became the default, and only briefly used Red Hat in 2001, so my experience there is essentially zilch.

I can do a lot on computers, in different operating systems and environments, but regarding most tasks, be it OS management, network management, programming, web development or whatever, I can mostly point to someone who is better/more experienced than I am. The other side of that coin is that they are mostly one-trick ponies with one discipline standing out at 9+ out of 10, and I'm a jack-of-all-trades with a lot of disciplines at 7 and the occasional 8.

You can compare it with multiclassing in 2nd edition D&D A multiclass character is more versatile, and usable in more situations, but if you need *THE EPIC SHIT* (casting THAT spell, or picking THAT lock), you better turn to a single class mage or thief.

[kacir]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

You know what the paradox is? I *LIKE* jacking around and tinkering with computers, but I *HATE* actually doing it.

The reason is that I like doing it if I sit down specifically to jack around with stuff; to get something running that wouldn't normally run, to make something that doesn't yet exist, and so on. I dislike it when I sit down to do something else, such as downloading ebooks, or playing a game, for example, and *then* I have to mess around with it before actually starting the thing I wanted to do.

Very nicely said.
This is why I had to leave a fantastic, very elegantly designed operating system - FreeBSD and start using Mint Linux.

When you sat down and properly configured FreeBSD to your liking (somewhere between the legendary 4.8 release and 6.0) it worked like a charm. But newer versions ceased to play nicely with my hardware (and the newer versions of programs I wanted to use) and the only solution was to start using something different. I tested lots of things, looking for something that would work with minimal fuss.
I ended up using Mint Linux - most things are configured to my liking "out of the box".

I am fortunate that the vast majority of things I want to do on my computer can be done on Linux with minimum of tinkering. On the other hand, if you feel like you want to tinker with something, there plenty of things you can play with.
But - operating systems are not a religion. They are tools, so you should use what works best for you.

[jones43]

Originally Posted by Lynx-lynx

As reported on the ABC today: (http://www.abc.net.au/technology/art...22/4166416.htm)

Early this morning, Microsoft unveiled its consumer vision for the upcoming Windows 10 operating system. It's been available in a relatively-open developer form since September last year, but today saw the company unveil a few more tantalising pieces of its next generation operating system vision.
It's been no secret that Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella wants to transform Microsoft as a company from one that largely sells software to one that sells services, and Windows 10 will be an important part of realising that vision.

One of the more-surprising aspects to getting that vision off the ground was the announcement that for the first year, Windows 10 will be a free upgrade to anyone running a PC on Windows 7 or 8.

For Microsoft, whose two key profit planks have long been Windows and Office, that's a very big step, albeit one that's necessary in order to realise the company's vision of having Windows 10 everywhere, from mobiles to tablets to laptops to desktops and even across to the company's gaming console, the Xbox One.

The rest of the article can be found here.

Actually the point is I am using windows 7 on my laptop which i am satisfied, i get free upgrade from Microsoft in SEP 2015 and i did it unfortunalty after a month i go back to windows 7. I feel much comfortable using windows 7. People like me don't want to upgrade if they are satisfied.

[jameswhit]

The problem with Windows 10 i feel is the new Windows Event Viewer. It lacks basic features for Error log Analysis. Windows Xp had the best Event Viewer. After that it has just been cutting on features by MS. As an alternative Event Log Explorer works best but still MS should seriously think about it.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by kacir

I ended up using Mint Linux - most things are configured to my liking "out of the box".

I am fortunate that the vast majority of things I want to do on my computer can be done on Linux with minimum of tinkering. On the other hand, if you feel like you want to tinker with something, there plenty of things you can play with.
But - operating systems are not a religion. They are tools, so you should use what works best for you.

Agreed. Linux Mint is much, much easier to install and maintain than is Windows. I know this for a fact because I recently upgraded seven computers from Windows XP to Windows 7. Each one took hours for all the upgrades and reboots (the initial installation via USB drive wasn't too bad but it was the subsequent updates that took forever). Linux Mint, on the other hand, takes about 20 minutes to install on my 13 year-old Latitude D400, and another 25 to 30 minutes to completely update the software (including applications and OS). When I'm done EVERYTHING for a basic system is installed, flash, java, an office suite, Firefox, Thunderbird, multimedia codecs -- everything. And with my older laptops, all volume buttons, etc., work out of box -- WiFi card works out of the box, the right video driver is loaded. (I understand this is different with cutting edge equipment, which I don't use.) Once I get a Windows system installed, get flash, java, anti-virus, anti-malware, install the Office Suite (if I'm installing one) and reboot about 20 times (altogether) I'm about fed up tinkering with Windows. And then there's the constant anti-virus updates, printer, video and other installs, plus worrying about losing your software registration keys and making sure you've backed up your installation media (usually you don't get CDs/DVDs any more). With Linux you just download the software from the repository and reinstall (without rebooting).

At any rate, for my purposes, Linux is much, much less complicated than Windows. And it doesn't have "sure to fail" (eventually) Registry file.

EDIT: I forgot to mention, another issue with Windows 7 is ensuring it doesn't upgrade to Windows 10 against your will. GWX Panel helps, but I still have to very carefully check the Update Files to see if Microsoft has -- once again -- snuck in a Windows 10 "upgrade."