Samhain Publishing is winding down and will close

[Katsunami]

I wonder... Josieb1 just bought 11 books to complete, and quickly get an interesting series. If many people did this, could the cash injection be big enough to actually give the publisher another chance?

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

I wonder... Josieb1 just bought 11 books to complete, and quickly get an interesting series. If many people did this, could the cash injection be big enough to actually give the publisher another chance?

Stranger things have happened.
However there are two problems they would face:

1- in started their graceful wind-down they are closing their doors to new manuscripts and reverting rights as their contracts end. By the time they recover, the pipeline for new content will be empty.

2- if they miraculously get better quick their credibility will be at risk. Some will wonder if it was a ploy to get readers to move future purchases forward or just plain bad management. Either way it would reflect poorly on them. As a rule, companies don't come back from these announcements.

At this point the only way to "save" the business is to sell the contracts and in the wake of the Nightshade mess and what happened to their authors it is to Samhain's credit that they'd rather wind-down than risk their authors getting clobbered.

Miracles happen but you can't count on them.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Miracles happen but you can't count on them.

Well... sometimes, miracles can turn out badly as well. After something vanishes, it could be better that it stayed that way.

Spoiler:

Do you remember Interplay? Interplay and its development studio's created a few computer games that went down into computer history as classics... some of which are still played today.

- Star Trek: 25th Anniversary (1992, CDROM 1994)
- Star Trek: Judgement Rites (1993, CDROM 1994)
- (They lost the bid to make Star Trek: A final Unity, which went to Microprose and their studio Spectrum Holobyte. It was released in 1995, and it was an awesome game.)
- Fallout 1 and 2 (1997, 1998)
- All Infinity Engine Games (Baldur's Gate I and II, Icewind Dale I and II, Expansions, Planescape Torment, 1998-2002)

PS: I own all of that stuff. Some of it twice.

Even those couldn't save them. By 1998, even while selling those blockbusters, they were struggling. By 2002 they were basically bankrupt. Somewhere in 2004 or so, their website went down, but the company wasn't dead yet. Years later, the website came back up, and they now offer this:

Some 'current' Interplay games...

Uhm. Right. They're awesome... if you're like 35-40 now. Those are 320x240 pixels games man. Nobody is going to play these, except when having an epic bout of nostalgia. Baldur's Gate and its remakes... that's different. For those, high-res mods do exist.

edit: Let's take a look at a screenshot of one of those games. I was actually wrong: the resolution is 320x200, not 320x240. See:



No, I didn't resize that screenshot to a tiny size. This is a 1 on 1 screenshot. There aren't any more pixels than that in the original. In 1992, a game such as this would be displayed on a 12 to 15 inch CRT monitor. Sometimes, the past should just stay in the past, though I'm happy I've been able to experience those games when they were current.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

Well... sometimes, miracles can turn out badly as well. After something vanishes, it could be better that it stayed that way.

Yup.
Great developers (for the time) but not so great at business or contracts.
I still don't know if they knew what they were doing when they gave Fallout to Bethesda.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks

That's odd. I have gotten review copies from Gemma Holiday and there were no terms at all. The one book was a DNF for me and I know I thought about requesting two others but never got around to it. When I requested the first, since I have a blog, I was offered other books for other people who do guest reviews (if they wanted to--there was no obligation, just an offer to look through the catalog.)

I'm talking about those who are on her ACR team not just anyone. I joined read one book by the author she was publishing and could not give it five stars. Five stars for me is rare. It has to have all the right elements. I love her type of books being a cozy fan but I just didn't feel right giving a five star review for a free book.

[BearMountainBooks]

Originally Posted by Blossom

I'm talking about those who are on her ACR team not just anyone. I joined read one book by the author she was publishing and could not give it five stars. Five stars for me is rare. It has to have all the right elements. I love her type of books being a cozy fan but I just didn't feel right giving a five star review for a free book.

Oh those! That's more like a beta type read than a typical reviewer ARC--I think in that case the publisher/editor/author is actually looking for feedback. But I have never done those so I could be wrong. One of the gals who reviews for my blog is on a team like that for an author (although I don't think the author requires five star reviews--she merely asks if there are elements that would keep the reader from giving it 5 stars and wants to know what those things are--and it's also part of a forum discussion where it generates discussion about the book).

There's all kinds of things out there these days--street teams, blog hops and the usual ARCs for review, beta reader opportunities and so on. Most of them last for a little while and then people move on. They can be too much work in a hurry. And while a reader might have time to do one, the next book they might be busy. I recall the reviewer said that those who don't participate will be dropped from the next "call" email/list.

I've never tried anything like that. I do use beta readers, but I can't really handle input from more than two or three people. I did eight once and that nearly did me in. Everyone has an opinion and after about 3 people, those opinions start to disagree with each other and you just end up with a total mess.

There's nothing greater than finding a good beta reader or good editor--one who has the skill to pinpoint plot holes, problem areas, pacing issues and so on. But that beta level is generally before the things above (although they are still called beta reads in some cases--or sometimes review of an ARC...)

Thanks for the clarification.

[Rbneader]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

I wonder... Josieb1 just bought 11 books to complete, and quickly get an interesting series. If many people did this, could the cash injection be big enough to actually give the publisher another chance?

Don't think so. Here's why:

I've never heard of Frank Tuttle and the Markat series sounds interesting, so I tried to check it out on their site.

There's no mention of what forms of payment Samhain takes.

There's no indication of the series order on the book pages.

There's no reviews or links to reviews on the book pages.

There's no clear indication when a book has been added to a cart. I did it twice before noticing the small, temporary color block.

I have to make and activate an account with my email before they'll let me make an account to buy a book.

Samhain Publishing is making it stupidly hard to buy a book from them. You can say that these are all small things, but they've put enough friction between me and making a purchase that I've basically lost interest. It doesn't take a lot to do that given my TBR pile and easier storefronts (I wound up buying a book I've had my eye on at Baen). At some point they made decisions that added up to relying on Amazon for sales, and since Amazon's changes post-KU small publishers can't rely on Amazon to manage the sales end anymore.

Between that and other complaints about their marketing, it's clear that Samhain is not 100% on the ball. Sad, but in the current market being even slightly off form is enough to take a publisher down.

[BearMountainBooks]

Originally Posted by Rbneader

Don't think so. Here's why:

I've never heard of Frank Tuttle and the Markat series sounds interesting, so I tried to check it out on their site.

There's no mention of what forms of payment Samhain takes.

There's no indication of the series order on the book pages.

There's no reviews or links to reviews on the book pages.

There's no clear indication when a book has been added to a cart. I did it twice before noticing the small, temporary color block.

I have to make and activate an account with my email before they'll let me make an account to buy a book.

Samhain Publishing is making it stupidly hard to buy a book from them. You can say that these are all small things, but they've put enough friction between me and making a purchase that I've basically lost interest. It doesn't take a lot to do that given my TBR pile and easier storefronts (I wound up buying a book I've had my eye on at Baen). At some point they made decisions that added up to relying on Amazon for sales, and since Amazon's changes post-KU small publishers can't rely on Amazon to manage the sales end anymore.

Between that and other complaints about their marketing, it's clear that Samhain is not 100% on the ball. Sad, but in the current market being even slightly off form is enough to take a publisher down.

Tuttle is worth buying. I have bought once or twice through Samhain, and like a lot of other publishers, setting up their own cart business seemed like kind of an afterthought. I get an email every week from Simon and S. and they are now trying to drive traffic to their own site (but also include buy links for all the other major retailers). Where were they 5 years ago? 10?

For Samhain I know they take paypal because that's what I used. Don't know the other forms, but I totally understand what you are saying. I wouldn't have bothered had it not been an author I already read.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by Rbneader

Samhain Publishing is making it stupidly hard to buy a book from them.

Never had a problem buying a book from them or found it at all hard, but I will say their old website had a better UI (although dated) IMO. Maybe I've just gotten used to it though. It would be nice if the payment options were listed in the FAQ with everything else.

Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks

I get an email every week from Simon and S. and they are now trying to drive traffic to their own site (but also include buy links for all the other major retailers). Where were they 5 years ago? 10?

Years ago the S&S webstore was one of the best places to buy their books. They were generally cheaper than anyplace else. Later things changed, around the time of Agency. Another good thing they did that other big pubs didn't was when the big switch to ePub took place (after Lit, Mobi, etc. died) they converted folks older format books over to ePub instead of just killing their store and folks losing access to everything (like HarperCollins & Penguin did). I still have access to my purchases from 2009. For the big pubs direct sales have always been an afterthought though. In the past they haven't generally seen individual consumers as their customers (that's what booksellers are for ).

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by AnemicOak

In the past they haven't generally seen individual consumers as their customers (that's what booksellers are for ).

Depends on how far back you go.

Before the multinationals took over most of what were then the "big boys" did lots of direct business. Doubleday not only had bookstores but also a half dozen mail order book club operations, all sold off when Bertelsmann bought them up.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Depends on how far back you go.

Before the multinationals took over most of what were then the "big boys" did lots of direct business. Doubleday not only had bookstores but also a half dozen mail order book club operations, all sold off when Bertelsmann bought them up.

Yes. A long time ago (wasn't it sometime in the 80's?) in a galaxy far, far away.

[BearMountainBooks]

Here's another article from Kobo on what gets read/finished (I still haven't found the one on percent of books read that are free downloads. I know it's out there, but since I blog mainly to readers rather than writers, I didn't blog that one.)

http://www.theguardian.com/books/201...sh-donna-tartt

[BearMountainBooks]

I still haven't found the study, but I did find a reference to the study--only this just mentions the number of books that are bought and actually opened (hint: 60 percent):

http://goodereader.com/blog/e-book-n...ey-buy-anymore

I'm pretty sure that's part of the same Kobo study that looked at how many free books were ever opened--I just can't find the full study, just bits about it. I may stumble across it eventually, but for free books it was much much lower.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks

I still haven't found the study, but I did find a reference to the study--only this just mentions the number of books that are bought and actually opened (hint: 60 percent):

I wonder though. Wouldn't that 60% only apply to the kePub version of the book? I don't know about others, but even though I own a Kobo and have over 1,000 books in my Kobo library I never download the kePub version (other than when they force auto download some titles on a sync, which I immediately delete) let alone open it. I download the ePub and I'm guessing Kobo has no way of really tracking anything about those (other than sales and downloads).

[Mort1997]

Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks

Tuttle is worth buying. I have bought once or twice through Samhain, and like a lot of other publishers, setting up their own cart business seemed like kind of an afterthought. I get an email every week from Simon and S. and they are now trying to drive traffic to their own site (but also include buy links for all the other major retailers). Where were they 5 years ago? 10?

For Samhain I know they take paypal because that's what I used. Don't know the other forms, but I totally understand what you are saying. I wouldn't have bothered had it not been an author I already read.

I'd second the recommendation for Frank Tuttle. I bought my copies from the now defunct Books on Board and Amazon