New Kobo User becomes burned EX-Kobo user aka KOBO is horrible

[tvuongpham]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Is your primary store out of your house?
Wait a minute, you said vendors. That is just slightly different.
That to me sounds like a place called Big Lots. They use vendors and store buy outs.
So you buy from people that buy from the manufacturer.
I think we have just spent half the day using 2 different groups of sellers.
To me, you would not be a reseller because the product is distributed to you and then you sell to the public.

That is funny. Resellers have another name in my world called. VAR
Value Added Reseller.
For example complex computing systems can be sold but not really used effectively until a VAR integrates it into production use.

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Who I was thinking of is the ones that go to the clearance aisle of a retailer then resell as an individual.
I do believe ebay is considered a shop of shops. So a manufacturer cannot guarantee whether the seller is legitimate.

Ebay provides a venue for "resellers to sell" a virtual digital marketplace NOT a brick and mortar spot. For lack of a concrete example think of a open farmers market or craft fair. Sure there will be manufactures/ growers present but also VAR -- resellers

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Sorry you had problems.
Oh my finger finally did stop hurting.

Glad your finger is better. Heat above 105 F is bad for human flesh. The de-naturation process is usually non-reversable. http://www.chemistryexplained.com/Co...aturation.html but I digress.

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

I like my old Kobo for side loading. I am not real fond of their store.

I had the keyboard until it decided it was dirty and took a bath.

lol. Most electronic circuit boards are waterproof. A part of the manufacturing process for circuit boards that have been hand soldered of electronic parts.. is to put it into a machine that is like a big dishwasher. The heat cycle is above 100 but below the thermal point that would weaken the solder joints of the electronic components. The e-ink screen and LCD screens usually don't like water nor high temperature.

EVERY epub, mobi file must have that option.. flexibility of reading material sources. I read many a novel on my now ancient Palm Pilot.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

Clearly a point where we can agree to disagree.
Retailer vs Reseller

I am of the opinion there is little difference with e-commerce.

Comparison between Retailer and Reseller:
http://www.differencebetween.info/di...r-and-reseller

Your link seems to imply there is a difference...

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

That would be your interpretation of consumer law

That would be consumer law, actually.

[jackastor]

tvuongpham its interesting to note you mentioned you purchased the item on ebay as a reconditioned item. I have had some success buying stuff off ebay but at the same time most of the stuff are knock off. While its very unlikely you got a knock off its more likely you did buy a bad unit that was bad to begin with that some retailer exchanged for a customer and then later sold all their junk products (items that can not be returned to the original manufacture) and is sold as reconditioned / refurbished etc. What happens is the original problem that led the item to be returned in the first place is now another persons issue, and you can repeat that over and over for some items in fact. If the item was a defective unit that ended up being resold via a dishonest Ebay seller well the issue is quite simple you report the ebay seller get your money back and lesson learned from buying a reconditioned product. We have all been there no worries..no shame. And you report the Ebay seller and hopefully they wont crop up immediately again under a 3 or 4 different names... which they will most likely do if they are not already there!

That said, the hurdles you may or may not have had when you called kobo for support are another thing in its entirety. The kobo support team are following a script, telephone support for any product is very difficult at best and most people may not be able to follow simple instructions offered over the phone some people cant even follow instructions when in a one on one situation where they are actually helped in person! Yes they may have escalated the issue moved it to the next level. Now if it was truly a reconditioned product that kobo already deemed as a Dead on Arrival unit they would have records of that and would most likely at that point refuse to replace a unit they had already replaced (verified by serial number). You unfortunately would not know this. They would only know what the computer provided them.

And that brings us to where you are today, totally upset over something that could have been avoided had the human inclination to obtain the best deal for the cheapest price had not kicked in! Unfortunately that leaves you frustrated( we have all been there, will most likely be there again). Bottom line had you bought retail instead of from a dishonest ebay seller you would not have started this thread and would probably be a little more happy.

Kindle/Kobo whatever reader you use they all have the same issues at sometime or another. This could have been a kindle that you bought reconditioned just as easily and this thread would be over in the kindle forum not the kobo forum.

regards

Jack

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The overwhelming majority of retailers actually buy from wholesalers, not directly from manufacturers.

I was thinking distributors.
HarryT, I know for a fact here in the US, all the BIG retailers and grocery stores make the deals with the manufacturer or the name on the label.. Now most BIG retailers have distribution centers.

Now on canned vegetables, there are very few growers. They are processed by names. Example Green Giant pays more for the first choice. Then the store brands, then the off brands.
Although I think Walmart gets first choice too because on some things they are better than the name brands.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

That is funny. Resellers have another name in my world called. VAR
Value Added Reseller.
For example complex computing systems can be sold but not really used effectively until a VAR integrates it into production use.



Ebay provides a venue for "resellers to sell" a virtual digital marketplace NOT a brick and mortar spot. For lack of a concrete example think of a open farmers market or craft fair. Sure there will be manufactures/ growers present but also VAR -- resellers



Glad your finger is better. Heat above 105 F is bad for human flesh. The de-naturation process is usually non-reversable. http://www.chemistryexplained.com/Co...aturation.html but I digress.



lol. Most electronic circuit boards are waterproof. A part of the manufacturing process for circuit boards that have been hand soldered of electronic parts.. is to put it into a machine that is like a big dishwasher. The heat cycle is above 100 but below the thermal point that would weaken the solder joints of the electronic components. The e-ink screen and LCD screens usually don't like water nor high temperature.

EVERY epub, mobi file must have that option.. flexibility of reading material sources. I read many a novel on my now ancient Palm Pilot.

105 I thought it was 125.
Though it just now dawned on me why that finger hurt so bad. I had cut it and damaged the nerves and blood vessels when I was 13. It finally got feeling back in the end 30 years later. So those nerves are still extra sensitive 6 years later. It still doesn't bleed.
I promise to be more careful in the future.

Most vendors we see at the flea markets are selling stuff straight out of Mexico.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

I stated. I received this as a GIFT .. as I "gifted" it to myself. I said I can try to get a receipt.

After skimming through your complaints of mistreatment for a couple of days and considering that Kobo is located in Canada for the moment, I asked a couple of questions about what a gift is and could you give yourself a gift. A side benefit of doing some free work for a local legal clinic is that I can ask questions and get somewhat professional answers. Now if I had a translator for legalese to English...

The answers I received were basically no, that the concept of a gift in both civil and common law in Canada involves two separate persons -- the donor and the donee. To quote one item I was pointed at: "No consideration or quid pro quo, even of an indirect nature, may be received by the donor, or it will not be deemed a gift." which pretty much excludes the ability to give yourself a gift in the legal sense.

[tvuongpham]

Originally Posted by jackastor

tvuongpham its interesting to note you mentioned you purchased the item on ebay as a reconditioned item. I have had some success buying stuff off ebay but at the same time most of the stuff are knock off. While its very unlikely you got a knock off its more likely you did buy a bad unit that was bad to begin with that some retailer exchanged for a customer and then later sold all their junk products (items that can not be returned to the original manufacture) and is sold as reconditioned / refurbished etc. What happens is the original problem that led the item to be returned in the first place is now another persons issue, and you can repeat that over and over for some items in fact. If the item was a defective unit that ended up being resold via a dishonest Ebay seller well the issue is quite simple you report the ebay seller get your money back and lesson learned from buying a reconditioned product. We have all been there no worries..no shame. And you report the Ebay seller and hopefully they wont crop up immediately again under a 3 or 4 different names... which they will most likely do if they are not already there!

The item was New Open box.. but
of note said item was received by me unopened factory sealed, externally and internally. They most likely had a mixed lot of items and couldn't say all items are new. The item powered on.. still had battery in the item. I let it charge up some more.. then began the kobo registration process. Login to Kobo with a kobo account etc. d/l firmware upgraded with success .17 i believe.

Side-loaded books used it for epub, pdf, k-epub etc.

Ebay seller to their credit offered a 90 day warranty direct with them. I opted to call Kobo for support to avoid having dead stock for the ebay reseller. I am both a reseller on eBay and buyer on eBay.

Originally Posted by jackastor

That said, the hurdles you may or may not have had when you called kobo for support are another thing in its entirety. The kobo support team are following a script, telephone support for any product is very difficult at best and most people may not be able to follow simple instructions offered over the phone some people cant even follow instructions when in a one on one situation where they are actually helped in person! Yes they may have escalated the issue moved it to the next level. Now if it was truly a reconditioned product that kobo already deemed as a Dead on Arrival unit they would have records of that and would most likely at that point refuse to replace a unit they had already replaced (verified by serial number). You unfortunately would not know this. They would only know what the computer provided them.

s
Kobo never asked for a SN just photos to ensure I didn't have physically damaged device.

Originally Posted by jackastor

And that brings us to where you are today, totally upset over something that could have been avoided had the human inclination to obtain the best deal for the cheapest price had not kicked in! Unfortunately that leaves you frustrated( we have all been there, will most likely be there again). Bottom line had you bought retail instead of from a dishonest ebay seller you would not have started this thread and would probably be a little more happy.

Kindle/Kobo whatever reader you use they all have the same issues at sometime or another. This could have been a kindle that you bought reconditioned just as easily and this thread would be over in the kindle forum not the kobo forum.

regards

Jack

Never really about price. More about time.. but I have lost too much time already.
I can buy the Kobo Aura shipped to my house from Canada from indigo.ca around 70.USD

Much cheaper than the eBay seller.

Kobo sells for 99.00 don't know shipping cost.
NO one locally sells KOBO around soCal. No brick and mortar option.

oh well.
live and learn. Maybe it is kindle after all in the tea leaves.

[tvuongpham]

Originally Posted by DNSB

After skimming through your complaints of mistreatment for a couple of days and considering that Kobo is located in Canada for the moment, I asked a couple of questions about what a gift is and could you give yourself a gift. A side benefit of doing some free work for a local legal clinic is that I can ask questions and get somewhat professional answers. Now if I had a translator for legalese to English...

The answers I received were basically no, that the concept of a gift in both civil and common law in Canada involves two separate persons -- the donor and the donee. To quote one item I was pointed at: "No consideration or quid pro quo, even of an indirect nature, may be received by the donor, or it will not be deemed a gift." which pretty much excludes the ability to give yourself a gift in the legal sense.

Interesting thank you for you input. And translation of Canadian law. :-)

[robko]

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

The item was New Open box.. but
of note said item was received by me unopened factory sealed, externally and internally.

I have no reason to doubt that what you received was factory sealed and brand new. However, that is completely irrelevant to the current situation. You bought the item as OPEN BOX. You got lucky and got a brand new one. When it was sold to you as open box, why do you think Kobo has a responsibility to you? The warranty terms clearly state ORIGINAL OWNER. When it was sold as open box that would imply a previous owner (even if there wasn't). When it was sold to you as open box, IMHO it's up to you to prove to Kobo that it was actually a brand new device you received, not up to them to prove it wasn't. I'd have a lot more sympathy for your position if it wasn't sold with a description of being an open box product.
And going back to your original post, NO you do not have the right to privacy of where you purchased the device if you want to claim warranty on it (which is why you claim you 1st told Kobo it was a gift). That's tantamount to saying you have the right to privacy of when exactly you did buy it -- it's a very reasonable expectation that the company wants to confirm exactly when and where you bought the product if you expect them to replace it. They don't require you to prove where you purchased it to use it, which would be an intrusion. For warranty coverage it's not unreasonable so deal with it.

[robko]

And horror of horror's: apparently Amazon expects you to buy from them or an authorized retailer to get warranty on their new $50 tablet.

"If you purchased your Device from Amazon.com, Amazon.co.jp, or from authorized retailers located in the United States or Japan, your Device is covered by a 90-day limited warranty. If you purchased your Device from any other Amazon website or from authorized retailers located in other countries, your Device is covered by a one-year limited warranty instead of the following warranty."

[Sonist]

Originally Posted by robko

And horror of horror's: apparently Amazon expects you to buy from them or an authorized retailer....

Some people get too hung up on boiler plate language and miss the common sense argument.

If an item is defective, most reputable manufacturers will take care of, without relying on small print to weasel out of it. Both parties need to be reasonable, of course, but if a company wants to stay in business over the long term and is in a competitive market, goodwill is of considerable importance.

In my experience, Amazon generally understands this, while Kobo does not.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Sonist

Some people get too hung up on boiler plate language and miss the common sense argument.

If an item is defective, most reputable manufacturers will take care of, without relying on small print to weasel out of it. Both parties need to be reasonable, of course, but if a company wants to stay in business over the long term and is in a competitive market, goodwill is of considerable importance.

In my experience, Amazon generally understands this, while Kobo does not.

Not necessarily.

Let us say Amazon sold a defective Kindle. The purchaser called Amazon CS, and got a replacement. Amazon said, don't bother shipping us the defective unit.

Purchaser sells defective unit on ebay.
Sap second purchaser buys the defective unit, discovers it is defective, calls Amazon CS to complain.


What should Amazon do?

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Sonist

Some people get too hung up on boiler plate language and miss the common sense argument.

If an item is defective, most reputable manufacturers will take care of, without relying on small print to weasel out of it. Both parties need to be reasonable, of course, but if a company wants to stay in business over the long term and is in a competitive market, goodwill is of considerable importance.

In my experience, Amazon generally understands this, while Kobo does not.

The key word there is "both". As the party of the first part started by lying to Kobo's customer service, I'd say that started the whole discussion off on the wrong foot. Honesty may not always be the best policy but it's a lot less likely to come back and bite you on the ass.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by tvuongpham

LOL

I stated. I received this as a GIFT .. as I "gifted" it to myself. I said I can try to get a receipt. Which I provided the paypal receipt and even the eBay transaction.
All 100% valid.
No forgery.

As for "new" all seals intact. internal and external seals. lcd cover etc.

firmware updates etc.
Kobo "backend" doesn't handle devices like Amazon.. touche.

Have a nice day.

Just because you bought it on eBay, how do you know it was originally purchased with 12 months? How do you know there is any of the original warranty left?

[JSWolf]

You provided proof of purchase from someone on eBay. Can you prove that this person is an authorized reseller and that open box means you get a full manufacturer's warranty?