Unlocking the Gates of Alexandria: DRM, Competition and Access to E-Books

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by ApK

I didn't say no one ever lends an Ereader.

No, you just said that those that do must behave like a fat cat in a depression-era melodrama and refuse to drive late model cars

Originally Posted by ApK

I said that behavior is not an example of the kind of casual sharing that should be held up as a counter argument for the usefulness of DRM.

Libraries and used bookstores out to be the counter argument for DRM. Both have been around for as long as the big publishers. Yet new books continue to sell.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

No, you just said that those that do must behave like a fat cat in a depression-era melodrama and refuse to drive late model cars

For anyone else that missed it, I was responding to this comment:

Originally Posted by disconnected

I'm not convinced that even preventing "casual sharing" results in a net gain for authors/publishers.

If a group of friends all read a lot then they can get their ebooks from Amazon and swap Kindles around

I think for that to be a key factor, if true lending like that even was a factor at all, yes, most folks would have be able to consider their readers as disposable as paperbacks, or dead president stogie lighters.

Libraries and used bookstores out to be the counter argument for DRM. Both have been around for as long as the big publishers. Yet new books continue to sell.

I still say that DRM is more about unauthorized copying than true lending.

But I do see libraries and used book stores as arguments for why resale and transfer of ebook licenses (i.e., "used ebooks") could be allowed with destroying or even disrupting the industry.


ApK

[HarryT]

Used book stores and libraries really aren't a terribly relevant analogy, in that the fundamental difference with an ebook is the fact you're generating additional copies of the book. If you buy a paperback, donate it to a library, and it finally ends up in a used bookstore, there's still only ever been one copy of the book in circulation. With an ebook, you can give a copy of it to a dozen of your friends and you all have an identical copy of it simultaneously.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by ApK

But I do see libraries and used book stores as arguments for why resale and transfer of ebook licenses (i.e., "used ebooks") could be allowed with destroying or even disrupting the industry.

I don't mean to say that e-book owners should be allowed to resale their books.

I was just pointing out that in the world of books, avenues that offer the same content at reduced prices or even free have existed for as long as there have been books. Yet new books continue to sell.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I don't mean to say that e-book owners should be allowed to resale their books.

I was just pointing out that in the world of books, avenues that offer the same content at reduced prices or even free have existed for as long as there have been books. Yet new books continue to sell.

But a tattered paperback from a secondhand bookstore is, in many people's eyes, a less desirable object than a pristine new paperback, hence many people prefer to buy new, even when the cheaper old book is available. That distinction doesn't exist for ebooks; they don't degrade with use. There would be no reason whatsoever to buy a "new" ebook if a cheaper "secondhand" one was available.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Used book stores and libraries really aren't a terribly relevant analogy, in that the fundamental difference with an ebook is the fact you're generating additional copies of the book. If you buy a paperback, donate it to a library, and it finally ends up in a used bookstore, there's still only ever been one copy of the book in circulation. With an ebook, you can give a copy of it to a dozen of your friends and you all have an identical copy of it simultaneously.

I don't think the major problem with piracy is people handing out a copy of the book to a few of their friends. It's shady sites and torrents where hundreds could download a free book. I'm pretty sure that's what the companies pushing for DRM are thinking of.

But I think that those companies are focusing too much attention on something that isn't that big a problem. Much like voter fraud, it's an argument that looks good on paper, but in fact isn't the end of the world it was predicted to be.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by HarryT

There would be no reason whatsoever to buy a "new" ebook if a cheaper "secondhand" one was available.

Yet many people buy books that they could easily download for free.

Also, if DRM were eliminated and all e-books were sold as a universal format, I'd still wager that for the most part, Kindle owners would buy from the built-in Amazon store and Kobo owners would buy from the built-in Kobo store.

[conan50]

Originally Posted by HarryT

But a tattered paperback from a secondhand bookstore is, in many people's eyes, a less desirable object than a pristine new paperback, hence many people prefer to buy new, even when the cheaper old book is available. That distinction doesn't exist for ebooks; they don't degrade with use. There would be no reason whatsoever to buy a "new" ebook if a cheaper "secondhand" one was available.

Here is the case for buying a new ebook verses pirated version:

New from publisher - you have the exact text, proper formatting, any illustrations, proper editing, and you are supporting favorite authors and encouraging their work.

Pirated - You have no idea if the text is the actual text in the book. If it is an OCR'd copy, just look at some Google Books OCR editions to see how 'great' that turned out, you have no idea if the editing is correct, in other words no guarantee of a pristine book. Add to that you must visit shady websites, subject yourself to viruses and malware.

9 out of 10 times book lovers are going to want pristine digital copies. And to support favorite authors, and to not visit shady web sites.

Having books without DRM rewards those who purchase ebooks by allowing them to read everywhere and actually own their ebooks. Most of those people are not going to visit shady sites to upload those ebooks. I highly doubt Tor or Baen are hurting by removing DRM from their ebooks.

[conan50]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Yet many people buy books that they could easily download for free.

Also, if DRM were eliminated and all e-books were sold as a universal format, I'd still wager that for the most part, Kindle owners would buy from the built-in Amazon store and Kobo owners would buy from the built-in Kobo store.

Good point. I've spent plenty of money on public domain ebooks at Amazon because: better formatted, and ability to easily find and sync across Kindle devices and apps. Some of those guys formatting public domain ebooks are probably making a decent amount of money by formatting and correcting public domain texts.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by HarryT

There would be no reason whatsoever to buy a "new" ebook if a cheaper "secondhand" one was available.

If.

If the right mechanism was in place, someone still has to buy the New ebook for there to be a used one to buy, people who want it first would pay a bit more for new, and the thought of reclaiming some value down the line may make the desicion to buy easier. If the rights holder got a piece of the resale, it could be win win win for all parties.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I don't think the major problem with piracy is people handing out a copy of the book to a few of their friends.

And to play Devil's advocate, I might say it's not a major problem because DRM prevents it from being one.

[conan50]

Publishers could set up a 'used' ebook exchange and take a second, third, etc., cut out of resold ebooks. Kind of astounding how unimaginative the publishing industry is, and how much useless effort they instead spend on upholding a dying business model and restraining inovation.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by conan50

Publishers could set up a 'used' ebook exchange and take a second, third, etc., cut out of resold ebooks. Kind of astounding how unimaginative the publishing industry is, and how much useless effort they instead spend on upholding a dying business model and restraining inovation.

F'in'-A, Bubba.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by ApK

And to play Devil's advocate, I might say it's not a major problem because DRM prevents it from being one.

I'd say most users on this board strip DRM from their purchased books. Yet I don't hear of underground e-book lending rings. Yet we all know about torrents and shifty websites.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I'd say most users on this board strip DRM from their purchased books. Yet I don't hear of underground e-book lending rings. Yet we all know about torrents and shifty websites.

We (the vocal enthusiasts community) do not accurately represent the mass market.