Is a word ever just plain wrong?

PKFFW · 07-19-2015, 02:34 AM

Sometimes I see a word that seems just so out of place that it screams "wrong word choice, just plain wrong".

Recent example: She roared in terror.

Now the way I think of it you can scream in terror, you can cry in terror, you can squeal in terror......you can do lots of things in terror but I can't get my head around roaring in terror.

Why: Because, to me, roaring has an expansive, aggressive, forthright, open, confident etc etc feel to it. Terror on the other hand has a shrinking, withdrawing, cringing, closed, etc etc feel to it.

So I just can't fathom someone roaring in terror. It seemed so out of place to me that I was jolted out of the story, snorted in disgust, griped about authors who don't put any thought into word choice and felt compelled to to turn to my wife and read her the entire paragraph containing that sentence to see if she would pick it.

She didn't.

So that got me to thinking......is it totally subjective or can there really be words that are just plain wrong for the chosen purpose or context?

gmw · 07-19-2015, 03:01 AM

Sometimes, yes, a word is just plain wrong. ... But your example, I think, would have to be judged in context. I can imagine some contexts in which a character might roar in terror (depending on the character and the circumstances), but it does seem unusual.

I remember being similarly knocked out of the story several times by the word choices and similes used in a YA series I read a while ago. For example the writer described an exceptionally clear window as being "perfectly translucent". I immediately stopped and thought "What?" Now it is true, one definition of translucent is clear or transparent, so technically/literally it works, but in my head translucence is associated with things that are specifically not perfectly transparent. Is that my problem or the writer's? I am left supposing it must be mine, since this was a professionally edited book ... but I am not entirely convinced that it is good word choice, even if it is not actually wrong.

This brings to mind what Stephen King talks about in "On Writing": ESP between the reader and the writer. I interpret that as being able to use words and phrases that work with the associations the readers are going to apply to them. Get it right, and the reader does a lot of the work for you, get it wrong and you isolate your reader from the story. It's naturally going to be a bit hit and miss, because different upbringing, environment, experience and education is going to leave people with different associations.

Dr. Drib · 07-19-2015, 07:33 AM

Is this from a C.S. Lewis book? If it were a lion, I could understand it better.

In your example, the two do seem at odds.

Seriously: The definition for such oddities of choice and arrangement is called syntax. And yes, when authors mess around with sentences, some strange things can happen, like this (regarding misplaced modifiers):

"I once shot an elephant in my pajamas. How it got in my pajamas is a mystery to me" [Marx Brothers].

In the above example, the author is aware of the error and plays with it for comedic effect.

mr ploppy · 07-19-2015, 09:39 AM

I perceive a scream as a high-pitched sound, like would come from a woman, so roar seems okay to me for a man. It's the "in terror" bit that bothers me. There's better ways of getting across that he's frightened, without spelling it out like that.

gmw · 07-19-2015, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Drib

Is this from a C.S. Lewis book? If it were a lion, I could understand it better.[...]

Nope. Given the religious overtone* to the stories, and Aslan's role in them, I can't really see him doing anything in terror.

* I considered using the word undertone here, but given the subject of this thread I double-checked in the dictionary and think overtone is the better word.

theducks · 07-19-2015, 11:13 AM

A roar can cause terror

Howled/screamed/screeched in terror?

Are we talking about a Human?

Context is everything

Dr. Drib · 07-19-2015, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

I perceive a scream as a high-pitched sound, like would come from a woman, so roar seems okay to me for a man. It's the "in terror" bit that bothers me. There's better ways of getting across that he's frightened, without spelling it out like that.

Men can scream, too. I've heard them.

Penforhire · 07-19-2015, 11:23 AM

Many such combinations can strike me as odd if I dwell on them. But in this case it felt nearly cliche. A quick web search for "roared in terror" brings up a host of examples.

Besides, this sort of construction is essentially lazy. Writers are taught, good ones anyway, to use very few internal-state descriptions like this. Show us terror, not tell us terror.

mr ploppy · 07-19-2015, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Drib

Men can scream, too. I've heard them.

Yes, but it's more of a roar of terror.

PKFFW · 07-19-2015, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Drib

Is this from a C.S. Lewis book? If it were a lion, I could understand it better.

No it was a Zombie book. That alone might explain a lot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

I perceive a scream as a high-pitched sound, like would come from a woman, so roar seems okay to me for a man.

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

Are we talking about a Human?

Context is everything

We are talking human but funnily enough it was a female character that did the roaring.

mr ploppy · 07-20-2015, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PKFFW

We are talking human but funnily enough it was a female character that did the roaring.

Maybe she had a sore throat or something?

cromag · 07-20-2015, 06:59 PM

A "roar' strikes me as lower pitched; a "scream" strikes me as higher pitched, and more ragged. Without a set-up to prepare me for why this character would roar in terror it would take me out of the story -- which makes a big argument for it being the wrong word.

Now, I do know that in many self-defense classes students are taught to use a lower pitched voice when "screaming" for help -- high pitched screams can get get "caught in your throat," leaving you trying to scream but unable to make a sound (really, an even more terrifying prospect).

Or, if the author was trying to show a mix of frustration and terror -- trying to escape a velociraptor, but the hallway doors are locked shut -- that might work.

But, I'd need more of a set-up to accept the logic of the "roar in terror."

dorotea · 07-23-2015, 09:08 AM

I dont think its necessarily wrong, just a personal preference towards a certain word.

Pulpmeister · 07-24-2015, 12:51 AM

In moments of shock, fright, terror, voice pitch tends to rise. Even a bass would find some tenor in those circumstances. I can see "roar" as possible, but it might jolt some readers out of the story. A bad choice, although I think the writer had a definite image in mind, but perhaps has not put it across well.

(One word that always gets me is "ring" specifically as in "a shot rang out". The phrase is hackneyed as well, but to my mind gunshots to not "ring". I have heard a few gunshots, from back powder muzzle loaders through .22 long rifle to military rifle. Never a ring, not even in an enclosed environment. Whenever I read that phrase I wonder if the author had ever heard a gun fired. I can't imagine Dirty Harry's .44 Magnum "ringing out". Your ears may ring afterwards, but it hasn't happened to me.)

07-19-2015, 02:34 AM	#1
PKFFW Wizard Posts: 3,782 Karma: 33064842 Join Date: Dec 2008 Device: BeBook, Sony PRS-T1, Kobo H2O	Is a word ever just plain wrong? Sometimes I see a word that seems just so out of place that it screams "wrong word choice, just plain wrong". Recent example: She roared in terror. Now the way I think of it you can scream in terror, you can cry in terror, you can squeal in terror......you can do lots of things in terror but I can't get my head around roaring in terror. Why: Because, to me, roaring has an expansive, aggressive, forthright, open, confident etc etc feel to it. Terror on the other hand has a shrinking, withdrawing, cringing, closed, etc etc feel to it. So I just can't fathom someone roaring in terror. It seemed so out of place to me that I was jolted out of the story, snorted in disgust, griped about authors who don't put any thought into word choice and felt compelled to to turn to my wife and read her the entire paragraph containing that sentence to see if she would pick it. She didn't. So that got me to thinking......is it totally subjective or can there really be words that are just plain wrong for the chosen purpose or context? Last edited by PKFFW; 07-20-2015 at 06:30 PM. Reason: Changed He to She

07-19-2015, 03:01 AM	#2
gmw cacoethes scribendi Posts: 5,818 Karma: 137770742 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Australia Device: Kobo Aura One & H2Ov2, Sony PRS-650	Sometimes, yes, a word is just plain wrong. ... But your example, I think, would have to be judged in context. I can imagine some contexts in which a character might roar in terror (depending on the character and the circumstances), but it does seem unusual. I remember being similarly knocked out of the story several times by the word choices and similes used in a YA series I read a while ago. For example the writer described an exceptionally clear window as being "perfectly translucent". I immediately stopped and thought "What?" Now it is true, one definition of translucent is clear or transparent, so technically/literally it works, but in my head translucence is associated with things that are specifically not perfectly transparent. Is that my problem or the writer's? I am left supposing it must be mine, since this was a professionally edited book ... but I am not entirely convinced that it is good word choice, even if it is not actually wrong. This brings to mind what Stephen King talks about in "On Writing": ESP between the reader and the writer. I interpret that as being able to use words and phrases that work with the associations the readers are going to apply to them. Get it right, and the reader does a lot of the work for you, get it wrong and you isolate your reader from the story. It's naturally going to be a bit hit and miss, because different upbringing, environment, experience and education is going to leave people with different associations. Last edited by gmw; 07-19-2015 at 03:04 AM.

07-19-2015, 07:33 AM	#3
Dr. Drib Grand Sorcerer Posts: 45,351 Karma: 59447733 Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Peru Device: KINDLE: Oasis 3, Scribe (1st), Matcha; KOBO: Libra 2, Libra Colour	Is this from a C.S. Lewis book? If it were a lion, I could understand it better. In your example, the two do seem at odds. Seriously: The definition for such oddities of choice and arrangement is called syntax. And yes, when authors mess around with sentences, some strange things can happen, like this (regarding misplaced modifiers): "I once shot an elephant in my pajamas. How it got in my pajamas is a mystery to me" [Marx Brothers]. In the above example, the author is aware of the error and plays with it for comedic effect. Last edited by Dr. Drib; 07-19-2015 at 07:38 AM.

07-20-2015, 06:59 PM	#12
cromag Surfin the alpha waves ~~ Posts: 26,054 Karma: 459735575 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: New Jersey Device: Jetbook Lite & Mini, Nook STR, Kobo, Hanvon N516, Kindle 2, Androids	A "roar' strikes me as lower pitched; a "scream" strikes me as higher pitched, and more ragged. Without a set-up to prepare me for why this character would roar in terror it would take me out of the story -- which makes a big argument for it being the wrong word. Now, I do know that in many self-defense classes students are taught to use a lower pitched voice when "screaming" for help -- high pitched screams can get get "caught in your throat," leaving you trying to scream but unable to make a sound (really, an even more terrifying prospect). Or, if the author was trying to show a mix of frustration and terror -- trying to escape a velociraptor, but the hallway doors are locked shut -- that might work. But, I'd need more of a set-up to accept the logic of the "roar in terror." Last edited by cromag; 07-20-2015 at 07:02 PM.

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07-19-2015, 09:39 AM	#4
mr ploppy Feral Underclass Posts: 3,622 Karma: 26821535 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Yorkshire, tha noz Device: 2nd hand paperback	I perceive a scream as a high-pitched sound, like would come from a woman, so roar seems okay to me for a man. It's the "in terror" bit that bothers me. There's better ways of getting across that he's frightened, without spelling it out like that.

07-19-2015, 11:13 AM	#6
theducks Well trained by Cats Posts: 30,912 Karma: 60358908 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Central Coast of California Device: Kobo Libra2,Kobo Aura2v1, K4NT(Fixed: New Bat.), Galaxy Tab A	A roar can cause terror Howled/screamed/screeched in terror? Are we talking about a Human? Context is everything

07-19-2015, 11:23 AM	#8
Penforhire Wizard Posts: 2,230 Karma: 7145404 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southern California Device: Kindle Voyage & iPhone 7+	Many such combinations can strike me as odd if I dwell on them. But in this case it felt nearly cliche. A quick web search for "roared in terror" brings up a host of examples. Besides, this sort of construction is essentially lazy. Writers are taught, good ones anyway, to use very few internal-state descriptions like this. Show us terror, not tell us terror.

07-23-2015, 09:08 AM	#13
dorotea Member Posts: 10 Karma: 1000010 Join Date: Jul 2015 Device: none	I dont think its necessarily wrong, just a personal preference towards a certain word.

07-24-2015, 12:51 AM	#14
Pulpmeister Wizard Posts: 2,791 Karma: 29144810 Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Perth Western Australia Device: kindle	In moments of shock, fright, terror, voice pitch tends to rise. Even a bass would find some tenor in those circumstances. I can see "roar" as possible, but it might jolt some readers out of the story. A bad choice, although I think the writer had a definite image in mind, but perhaps has not put it across well. (One word that always gets me is "ring" specifically as in "a shot rang out". The phrase is hackneyed as well, but to my mind gunshots to not "ring". I have heard a few gunshots, from back powder muzzle loaders through .22 long rifle to military rifle. Never a ring, not even in an enclosed environment. Whenever I read that phrase I wonder if the author had ever heard a gun fired. I can't imagine Dirty Harry's .44 Magnum "ringing out". Your ears may ring afterwards, but it hasn't happened to me.)