Hyphenation not according Dutch rules

[GeoffR]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

Updating the whole dictionary with a correct one (at libreoffice or openoffice) seems easier to me The idea is to read books, not to kill the pleasure by debugging a system while reading...

The Dutch hyphenation that comes with the Kobo firmware is the one available from openoffice.

All of the other languages have Adobe dictionaries.

[cramoisi]

Originally Posted by GeoffR

The Dutch hyphenation that comes with the Kobo firmware is the one available from openoffice.

All of the other languages have Adobe dictionaries.

Great ! ;( Thus, using the &shy method with this dictionary should prove if the problem is in the kobo firmware or in the dictionary itself. The only downside of the &shy method is when searching words (It breaks the whole thing).

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

@outlandos: what about trying this method I posted yesterday on the Firmware 3.16.0 thread ?

First, since the hyphen algo is supposed corrected in 3.16.0, (and if I were you), I should try to update the hyphen dictionary inside the kobo by adding the one of openoffice (link and method in the post linked). If it continues to not working, I should use the other method and not using the hyphen algo of kobo at all but use calibre + kobo_extra.css to hyphenate correctly the books.

Do you use calibre to send books into your gloHD ? If it’s the case, with KoboTouch plugin or KoboTouchExtended ? Hence, do you read epubs or kepubs ?

Yes, i do use calibre and KoboToughExtended, so all the books on my Glo HD (3.16.0) are kepubs.

@GeoffR thank you again for all this testing, I guess it's a problem with both the kepub reader and the dictionary then?

[GeoffR]

Originally Posted by outlandos

I guess it's a problem with both the kepub reader and the dictionary then?

The dictionary might be okay, I don't really know enough about how it works to say for sure. One possibility is that both the EPUB and KEPUB algorithms are faulty, but that the English dictionary has been tweaked to avoid the problems in the algorithm while the Dutch dictionaty hasn't.

Both hyphenation algorithms are clearly working with words that have punctuation attached, and that seems to be causing the problems. But whether that is a fault of the code or the dictionary I don't know. Maybe they should be stripping the punctuation from the ends of the word before feeding it to the hyphenation algorithm, or maybe the hyphenation dicionary is supposed to have rules to handle the punctuation. The Dutch dictionary has no rules for punctuation, while the English dictionary does have some.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by GeoffR

The dictionary might be okay, I don't really know enough about how it works to say for sure. One possibility is that both the EPUB and KEPUB algorithms are faulty, but that the English dictionary has been tweaked to avoid the problems in the algorithm while the Dutch dictionaty hasn't.

Both hyphenation algorithms are clearly working with words that have punctuation attached, and that seems to be causing the problems. But whether that is a fault of the code or the dictionary I don't know. Maybe they should be stripping the punctuation from the ends of the word before feeding it to the hyphenation algorithm, or maybe the hyphenation dicionary is supposed to have rules to handle the punctuation. The Dutch dictionary has no rules for punctuation, while the English dictionary does have some.

The English hyphenation dictionary I am using is not the one from Adobe. It's from someplace else and I've yet to see an incorrect hyphen using RMDSK.

If the hyphenation dictionary has errors, then you can get incorrect hyphens. So that is one place to look for sure.

[cramoisi]

Originally Posted by outlandos

Yes, i do use calibre and KoboToughExtended, so all the books on my Glo HD (3.16.0) are kepubs.

Then, are you sure the option to add hyphen is deactivated in plugin ? If it’s the case you could try to :

1. add kobo_extra.css with body { -webkit-hyphens: auto !important; } inside at the root of your kobo device.
2. thick modify CSS in the plugin options
3. check the book’s css to remove hyphen mentions
3. delete your books from the kobo device, then resend it from calibre

If this doesn’t work, you could try the manual hyphenation method (originally designed for kindle) it should do the trick.

Since I’m boring at the office, if you point me out a book to test, i could spend some time testing.

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

Then, are you sure the option to add hyphen is deactivated in plugin ? If it’s the case you could try to :

1. add kobo_extra.css with body { -webkit-hyphens: auto !important; } inside at the root of your kobo device.
2. thick modify CSS in the plugin options
3. check the book’s css to remove hyphen mentions
3. delete your books from the kobo device, then resend it from calibre

If this doesn’t work, you could try the manual hyphenation method (originally designed for kindle) it should do the trick.

Since I’m boring at the office, if you point me out a book to test, i could spend some time testing.

That would be awesome, TOPSHOW is the book i am using in the pictures shown earlier. If you PM your email ill send it to you.

The thing is, i have no idea how to add kobo_extra.css to start with..

And: ''check the book’s css to remove hyphen mentions'' do you mean by this that ill have to check the book myself (all pages?!) for faulty hyphen's, manually?

[cramoisi]

Originally Posted by outlandos

That would be awesome, TOPSHOW is the book i am using in the pictures shown earlier. If you PM your email ill send it to you.

The thing is, i have no idea how to add kobo_extra.css to start with..

And: ''check the book’s css to remove hyphen mentions'' do you mean by this that ill have to check the book myself (all pages?!) for faulty hyphen's, manually?

First, let’s try some synch tests. Point me out some errors (i’m not accustomed to dutch hyphenation) with the book you will send me and i will try to reproduce and find out 1. if it’s the firmware 2. the dico 3. the renderer. I will explain myself better when I will see clearer in this matter

PM sent (it goes without saying (as I didn’t said it) it has to be a legal and free book, without DRM for the tests to be performed)

(I let you choose smthg on http://www.gutenberg.org/browse/languages/nl)

I love Spinoza, let’s take http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/15497 !

[cramoisi]

Ok, I got the books, I’m running the test. Will update when finished.
------------
The first run is done using kobo h2o with 3.16.0 sideloaded firmware and original kobo NL dictionaries.

I’m waiting for your feedback.



Ethica inside Calibre :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/w8966hyk7h...45.56.png?dl=0

No mention of hyphen in the CSS books
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xuba38bzep...47.43.png?dl=0



Testing with EPUB and hyphen algorithm of the kobo device :
KoboTouch plugin, add CSS unchecked (and no kobo_extra.css present) :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/724ng538j3...49.59.png?dl=0

installed dict :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/36s1esuvib..._dict.png?dl=0

Let's read the book and take screenshots of the 9 first pages :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/udca8qmnu2...page1.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qc2yf2rthe...page2.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/c2yagruoxv...page3.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1bkmsbikhh...page4.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/76f8296lfi...page5.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3vfpweupwj...page6.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/y68l6anel0...page7.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ndpuax63z0...page8.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed34skguzy...page9.png?dl=0

Do you see any error ?


Let's do it with Topshow, same test :

1. metadata seems ok :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ibs0fk2wh5...10.45.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ui8agx82u5...11.47.png?dl=0

2. I look inside the book's CSS : it has mention of hyphen. I delete them for I want the kobo reader to handle this.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/776rjelpbl...06.22.png?dl=0
Saved the book, send it to Kobo via Calibre as the Ethica.

3. Let's read some pages (in the same chapter as in your pictures above) and see what we have. As my reader is 6,8'' it's a little different, but it doesn't matter :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wh09vz3i0n...show1.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bjwsemea0s...show2.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hnutdg941l...show3.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nt5zdp60t5...show4.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xlh9xt2zlw...show5.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/iq9gxbdd2z...show6.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5u32pyb769...show7.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/itlshlwtnj...show8.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q7rgtynjnf...show9.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6t4ur9m2os...how10.png?dl=0

Do you see any error ?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's do it with kepub and KoboTouchExtended with no kobo_extra.css at the root of the device
As it's a kepub, I have to enable the full justification for the hyphenation to work.

(metadata and book’s css modification were already done during the previous test)

1. activate KTExtended and deactivate KoboTouch driver
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mhx5obfsod...28.52.png?dl=0

2. check if modify CSS and hyphen the files are unchecked :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pxec8k6pl1...29.59.png?dl=0

3. Let's read a little and take some screenshots:
(i will run it 4 times with 4 different police sizes to change the place of the hyphens)

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/nkh2ghzjb...L_dVMq-Fa?dl=0
(the images are the Kepub_screen_XXX.png one)

Do you see any error ?

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

Ok, I got the books, I’m running the test. Will update when finished.
------------
The first run is done using kobo h2o with 3.16.0 sideloaded firmware and original kobo NL dictionaries.

I’m waiting for your feedback.



Ethica inside Calibre :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/w8966hyk7h...45.56.png?dl=0

No mention of hyphen in the CSS books
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xuba38bzep...47.43.png?dl=0



Testing with EPUB and hyphen algorithm of the kobo device :
KoboTouch plugin, add CSS unchecked (and no kobo_extra.css present) :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/724ng538j3...49.59.png?dl=0

installed dict :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/36s1esuvib..._dict.png?dl=0

Let's read the book and take screenshots of the 9 first pages :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/udca8qmnu2...page1.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qc2yf2rthe...page2.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/c2yagruoxv...page3.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1bkmsbikhh...page4.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/76f8296lfi...page5.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3vfpweupwj...page6.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/y68l6anel0...page7.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ndpuax63z0...page8.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed34skguzy...page9.png?dl=0

Do you see any error ?


Let's do it with Topshow, same test :

1. metadata seems ok :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ibs0fk2wh5...10.45.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ui8agx82u5...11.47.png?dl=0

2. I look inside the book's CSS : it has mention of hyphen. I delete them for I want the kobo reader to handle this.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/776rjelpbl...06.22.png?dl=0
Saved the book, send it to Kobo via Calibre as the Ethica.

3. Let's read some pages (in the same chapter as in your pictures above) and see what we have. As my reader is 6,8'' it's a little different, but it doesn't matter :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wh09vz3i0n...show1.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bjwsemea0s...show2.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hnutdg941l...show3.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nt5zdp60t5...show4.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xlh9xt2zlw...show5.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/iq9gxbdd2z...show6.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5u32pyb769...show7.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/itlshlwtnj...show8.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q7rgtynjnf...show9.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6t4ur9m2os...how10.png?dl=0

Do you see any error ?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's do it with kepub and KoboTouchExtended with no kobo_extra.css at the root of the device
As it's a kepub, I have to enable the full justification for the hyphenation to work.

(metadata and book’s css modification were already done during the previous test)

1. activate KTExtended and deactivate KoboTouch driver
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mhx5obfsod...28.52.png?dl=0

2. check if modify CSS and hyphen the files are unchecked :
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pxec8k6pl1...29.59.png?dl=0

3. Let's read a little and take some screenshots:
(i will run it 4 times with 4 different police sizes to change the place of the hyphens)

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/nkh2ghzjb...L_dVMq-Fa?dl=0
(the images are the Kepub_screen_XXX.png one)

Do you see any error ?

I checked them all carefully, and did not find any errors. ''Onderwerp'' is spelled correctly, as in onder-werp, but that could also have to do with the fact that your screen is 6,8' and mine is 6'.

[cramoisi]

Originally Posted by outlandos

I checked them all carefully, and did not find any errors. ''Onderwerp'' is spelled correctly, as in onder-werp, but that could also have to do with the fact that your screen is 6,8' and mine is 6'.

It’s the same resolution, thus it should not count. I tried to change the margin and the size a lot to have the word cut as it is on your screenshot without success... It was always correct, the same with "interview".

Could you post screenshots of your calibre KoboTouch Extended plugin ?

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

It’s the same resolution, thus it should not count. I tried to change the margin and the size a lot to have the word cut as it is on your screenshot without success... It was always correct, the same with "interview".

Could you post screenshots of your calibre KoboTouch Extended plugin ?

Hmmm thats so odd!

Do you mean this?

http://i.imgur.com/0YwcbaL.jpg

[cramoisi]

Originally Posted by outlandos

Hmmm thats so odd!

Do you mean this?

http://i.imgur.com/0YwcbaL.jpg

Yes, but i need to see more - all the option of the plugin

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

Yes, but i need to see more - all the option of the plugin

Will do as soon as I get home tonight.

[outlandos]

Originally Posted by cramoisi

Yes, but i need to see more - all the option of the plugin

http://i.imgur.com/821WKB9.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/56LjjlI.jpg

Anything out of the ordinary?